Minimum volume boil for 5 Gal?

[jelsas]

What's the minimum volume I can get away with boiling for a 5-gal. batch? I'm considering trying to speed up my brew-day activities a bit for the following Kolsch recipe:

0.5lb wheat DME
5.5lb light DME
2 oz Hallertau

Boil 1 gal. water
add wheat DME
add 1.5 oz 6%AA Hallertau, boil for 10 min.
add 0.5 oz 6%AA Hallertau, boil for 5 min
Add light DME for 1-2 min.

cool & top off to get 5 gal in fermenter
aerate, add yeast, aerate

My brewing software (BeerAlchemy) puts this at 28 IBU -- roughly the range I was going for. I've read a bit about late malt extract additions to increase hops utilization & keep the color light. But, is adding almost all the DME at the end a no-no? or just boiling the bittering hops for 15 minutes? would I have trouble getting all that extract to dissolve in 1 gal. of water?

 

[chillHayze]

With 1 gal boil you will be at a ridiculously high SG (i.e. syrup) which will inhibit you from extracting much more that 10% of the AAs from your hops. I did it this way for about 2 beers. Sorry but that's just the way it is. You need at least 2.5 gallons to make decent beer. And add 10% of your extract for the full boil, and the rest at 15-10 min.

 

[Beerrific]

add 10% of your extract for the full boil, and the rest at 15-10 min.

Is this good to do for all beers? I have heard a lot of talk about late boil extract addions but I haven't put much thought into it.

I am also soon to brew a kolsch (partial mash) and want to keep it light.

OP, I think 28 IBU is kind of high for a kolsch, right?

 

[Jaybird]

good beer takes time to brew.
JJ

 

[DeathBrewer]

With 1 gal boil you will be at a ridiculously high SG (i.e. syrup) which will inhibit you from extracting much more that 10% of the AAs from your hops. I did it this way for about 2 beers. Sorry but that's just the way it is. You need at least 2.5 gallons to make decent beer. And add 10% of your extract for the full boil, and the rest at 15-10 min.

agree, 2.5 gallons MINIMUM boil. You're going to have boil off and with one gallon you may not have any water left. carmelization is also an issue.

i usually add all my extract at the beginning of the boil, but reading from other threads i'm going to start experimenting with that.

 

[chillHayze]

Is this good to do for all beers? I have heard a lot of talk about late boil extract addions but I haven't put much thought into it.

I am also soon to brew a kolsch (partial mash) and want to keep it light.

OP, I think 28 IBU is kind of high for a kolsch, right?

Yep, do it for all your beers. But keep in mind the thermal load of adding 4+ lbs of extract will take your boil away. So pause your timer and start it again once boiling.

28 sounds high for a kolsch, but with even a 2.5 gal boil you won't be half of that.

 

[Beerrific]

Yep, do it for all your beers. But keep in mind the thermal load of adding 4+ lbs of extract will take your boil away. So pause your timer and start it again once boiling.

28 sounds high for a kolsch, but with even a 2.5 gal boil you won't be half of that.

Thanks, I have yet to make a light colored beer (all extracts), maybe this will solve the problem.

I assumed the the 28IBU took into account a standard 2.5 gallon boil, since software was being used. I could check it but I am too lazy. . . :cross:

 

[david_42]

I suspect this will turn out poorly.

 

[grrtt78]

when you do the late extract the color is lighter and im pretty sure you get more hop utilization. I could be wrong about that but im pretty sure it will be hoppier if you add your extract at the end

 

[Beerrific]

I suspect this will turn out poorly.

Why? Help is appreciated.

 

[BoxerDog]

Then I take it you guys dont like late boils??? I have a bunch of recipes that only have gallon boil amounts.

 

[Beerrific]

when you do the late extract the color is lighter and im pretty sure you get more hop utilization. I could be wrong about that but im pretty sure it will be hoppier if you add your extract at the end

I want a lighter cooler for the Kolsch, but I do not want to over hop it.

So what if I were to use something like this http://hbd.org/recipator/ to calculate the correct hop schedule using a 2.5-3 gallon boil using the smaller malt amount. Then when I add the rest of the malt with 10-15 minutes remaining, I will add the hops at/after this as if I had boiled the malt the entire time.

I think this would work and keep my hop utilization correct.

 

[jelsas]

Here's my logic:

Why do you boil extract brews? the malt doesn't need it. Its just for the hop alpha acid extraction, right? The amount of acids extracted from the hops is inversely proportional to the SG of the wort, which I can control with late extract additions. In fact, I can boil my hops in plain water if I wanted -- would this extract the maximum amount of acids from the hops?

Based on resources like this:
http://www.realbeer.com/hops/research.html
http://www.realbeer.com/hops/FAQ.html
http://www.howtobrew.com/section1/chapter5-5.html
the *boil volume* doesn't have much to do with the hops utilization, only the SG of the wort & time of the boil.

So, why don't we just boil our bittering hops in a small amount of water (1gal) for just enough time to extract the acid, then add all the malt at the end?

 

[Yooper]

Well, you could do that. But when you add, say, 6 pounds of malt, to less than a gallon of water, you'd have a tough time to stir it, I'd think. You could also make a hop tea and not boil LME at all, just mix it up if you're that rushed. What exactly are you trying to do? Make better beer? Save 5 minutes?

But also the reverse, how much time does it save boiling 1 gallon instead of 2 or 2 1/2? 5 minutes? Why not do the 2.5 gallon boil and do the late extract addition? I still don't understand the point you're trying to make.

If you steep your steeping grains at 155 for 20 minutes, and then remove them and bring that water up to a boil, does it really matter if it's one gallon or two? I just I just understand the point, sorry.

 

[jelsas]

I see your point. I don't think I would be making better beer this way, just brewing hopefully the same quality in less time. I'm thinking about this approach for several reasons:

(1) My brew day usually starts after 9PM, after the kids are in bed. Saving 1/2 hour+ would be nice.
(2) My big pot is cheap & not quite flat on the bottom. This doesn't matter on gas, but I have a glass-top electric stove inside. It takes considerably longer to bring 2.5 gal. to a boil in my big pot than 1 gal. in a smaller (flat-bottom) pot.
(3) I wouldn't consider this for recipes I was steeping specialty grain. Just simple hops + extract recipes.

of course, I need a better & bigger pot. a gas stove would be nice. it would also be nice to be able to start earlier. but, those aren't possibilities now, so i was just brainstorming ways to speed up my process.

anyway -- thanks for the input. maybe this is an experiment i'll try sometime...

 

[Yooper]

Or, you could always split the batch up. I was doing AG in the kitchen all winter, and boiled 1/2 in one pot, 1/2 in the other. Split the hops equally (more or less) then combined when done. Easier to cool, easier to lift, and still got my 5 gallons when I was done!

So, you could boil 1.25 gallon in one pot, and 1.25 gallon in the other and split everything equally including the late extract addition. Cool separately, too, if you have a two sink kitchen sink like I do, and that would be super quick. Then combine in the primary and top off with cool water, pitch yeast and go to bed!

Just a thought!

 

[Beerrific]

Is it better to boil more? I have a 30 qt. pot but have only been doing 2.5 g boils since this is what the instructions tell me to do.

 

[Kayos]

Big thread on late addition extract..

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=26151&highlight=late+extract

I am going to do this with my next recipe, but with less bittering and flavor hops. I think the steeped grains will be the only thing in the water witht the hops. No DME at all. We'll see what happens.

 

[Bosh]

So if you put all of the DME into a little bit of water its hard for the hops stuff to get out into the wort. But if all you're using is DME, which doesn't need to be boiled, what would be the absolute minimum amount of water you could use to get all of the flavor out of the hops?

My stove is a crappy POS with a full 3 gallons I don't think I could get a good boil going period