Melanoidin Malt vs. Caramber Malt in Red Beers

[Barão]

I heard that Melanoidin 3% along with Carared 3% and Caramunich I 3% .....is better than Caramber 3% and Carared Carared % and Caramunich I 3% ...in Red Beers

What do you think ?

 

[MaxStout]

A small amount of Carafa II or III will give a nice red color, without altering the flavor much.

 

[Cheshire Cat]

He’s my recipe for Pataskala Red IPA

Malts (4.85 kg)​

2 kg (41.2%) — Crisp Vienna Malt — Grain — 4 SRM

1.7 kg (35.1%) — BESTMALZ BEST Red X® — Grain — 15 SRM

850 g (17.5%) — Crisp Finest Maris Otter® Ale Malt — Grain — 3.3 SRM

250 g (5.2%) — Weyermann Carared — Grain — 24 SRM

50 g (1%) — Weyermann Carafa Special III — Grain — 710 SRM

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

Another Red IPA:

• 2.5 gal (into fermenter); 15 min boil
• 3# Muntons Extra Light DME; 1# sugar
• 0.25# Simpsons DRC; 0.25# Fawcett Light (180L) Chocolate
• Cold steep for 20 minutes in side pot while heating wort to boil

 

[Barão]

He’s my recipe for Pataskala Red IPA

Malts (4.85 kg)​

2 kg (41.2%) — Crisp Vienna Malt — Grain — 4 SRM

1.7 kg (35.1%) — BESTMALZ BEST Red X® — Grain — 15 SRM

850 g (17.5%) — Crisp Finest Maris Otter® Ale Malt — Grain — 3.3 SRM

250 g (5.2%) — Weyermann Carared — Grain — 24 SRM

50 g (1%) — Weyermann Carafa Special III — Grain — 710 SRM

thanks...recipe for how many liters ?

 

[Barão]

Another Red IPA:

• 2.5 gal (into fermenter); 15 min boil
• 3# Muntons Extra Light DME; 1# sugar
• 0.25# Simpsons DRC; 0.25# Fawcett Light (180L) Chocolate
• Cold steep for 20 minutes in side pot while heating wort to boil

thanks

 

[worlddivides]

thanks...recipe for how many liters ?

However many you want. He gave the percentages, so you can adjust it however. Depending on the ABV you want, that could be for an 11 liter or 19 liter batch.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

thanks...recipe for how many liters ?

Excellent question - the grain bill listed is incomplete.

But, in "defense" of @Cheshire Cat, a web search on "Pataskala Red IPA" (link) provides the missing information.

Depending on the ABV

For the craft beer mentioned (Pataskala Red IPA link), it's 7.3%.

 

[worlddivides]

For the craft beer mentioned (Pataskala Red IPA link), it's 7.3%.

Ah, right. I've had that before, but I forgot the name. In that case, it looks to me like a 2.5 gallon batch (9-10 liters or so?).

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

Given a longer list of assumptions, it feels like around 4 (US) gal

ABV 7.3% can be achieved by OG 68 and an 80% AA yeast.

4.85 kg is roughly 10.5#.

A rough calculation for gravity points the mash, assuming 75% efficiency is:

36 * 10.5 * 75% = 283.5 gravity points.​

Given the relatively high amount of specialty malts, 283 may be high, but it's close

283 gravity points in ___ gal of wort is OG 68.

283 / 68 = 4.15 gal

 

[worlddivides]

Ah, right. I put 4.85kg of base grains into one of my Brewersfriend recipes for 3 gallons and it estimates 9.05% ABV (fermented with US-05), so I assumed if I used 4.85kg in 2.5 gallons, that'd be around 7.3%. That said, I hadn't considered just how high the percentages of specialty grains are in that recipe, which would definitely lower the fermentability and thus the ABV.

 

[Cheshire Cat]

thanks...recipe for how many liters ?

19 litres

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

Ah, right. I put 4.85kg of base grains into one of my Brewersfriend recipes for 3 gallons and it estimates 9.05% ABV (fermented with US-05), so I assumed if I used 4.85kg in 2.5 gallons, that'd be around 7.3%. That said, I hadn't considered just how high the percentages of specialty grains are in that recipe, which would definitely lower the fermentability and thus the ABV.

I doubled checked my math assuming OG 74 and used a 2nd recipe calculator. So there's still an assumption that doesn't match the complete recipe.

BYO did a "clone" recipe for Pataskala Red X IPA (link) - 100% Red-X. IIRC, BYO recipes assume 70% efficiency..

The extract version uses CaraFa Special III for color

(Briess had a Munich DME in the timeframe the article was written. It's apparently been discontinued. Pale Ale DME would be a close substitution, but one may need to adjust the amount of the two base malts to get the color right).

 

[BeerAndTele]

I heard that Melanoidin 3% along with Carared 3% and Caramunich I 3% .....is better than Caramber 3% and Carared Carared % and Caramunich I 3% ...in Red Beers

What do you think ?

To the question of Melanoidin vs. Caraamber: Weyermann has "aroma wheels" on their website.

Melanoidin malt: https://www.weyermann.de/en-us/product/weyermann-melanoidin-malt-6/?cat=specialty-malt-en-us
Caraamber malt: https://www.weyermann.de/en-us/product/weyermann-caraamber-3/?cat=caramel-malt-en-us

Pretty similar overall, with the caraamber prividing maybe a tick more sweetness than the melanoidin - which you might expect from a cara malt - but at 3%, I'd be hard pressed to detect a difference. Both clock in at the 23-30L range.

Cheers.

 

[Jag75]

I used active red malt in a red ipa . Pretty decent malt .