Mash in: Grain First - Clearer wort?

[KiterNick]

I just switched over to all grain from extract and on my first batch I added the grain first, then the water. When I set the grain bed it only took about a quart and the runnings were very clear, I was impressed. It seemed like a pain though, so for my next several batches I did the water first and then grain, which I like a lot better, but now I run maybe 4-6 quarts through and it gets clearer, but never as clear as that first batch. I'm wondering if it wasn't because I added the grain first...thoughts?

I may try grain first on my next brew day to try it out, but it seems much easier to hit my temp targets with water first...

 

[Pie_Man]

Did you stir the first batch really well, the water onto grain mash? Or, was your efficiency lower than expected? It's possible you had some areas of compacted grain (dough balls) where your mash and sparge water had little effect.

 

[KiterNick]

Eff was around 79% both ways, only difference I'm wondering about is how clear the wort is coming out of the mash tun after setting the grain bed. My thoughts are that the grain surrounds the manifold better if you add the grain first and then the water. I stirred well in both cases.

 

[Pie_Man]

I understood your qustion. My point was that dough balls may lead to more clear wort during the vorlauf (less lose grains in the mash). Reduced efficiency being a side effect of dough balls.

Your cruch and grain bill may have factored in. I suppose you could try again and see what happens.

On my system, I've not noticed a difference with the methods in terms of clearer beer. It seems like once everything is thoroughly stirred, the grains are suspended in the water then settle to form the grain bed. Since the grains become suspended in either case, it really should not make a difference.

 

[kh54s10]

IMO, if you add the grains to the water or the other way around, once it is stirred up you are at the same place. The set of the grain bed happens after the grains are thoroughly stirred then vorlaufed. So I believe the difference in clarity had some other source.

 

[RM-MN]

Are you really wanting clear wort...or is the real goal to make clear beer? My wort goes into the boil kettle super cloudy because I mill my grains super fine for BIAB and squeeze that bag hard to get as much wort out as I can which also increases the cloudiness. Last week an old friend stopped by and I poured him a sample of my beer and his first comment was, "nice and clear".

 

[KiterNick]

At this point not sure I care, I just want to determine if it is having an effect on the clarity. I agree it shouldn't matter if it is stirred up good; however, with my copper manifold, I would bet that the initial grain I dumped in at the very bottom wasn't stirred up, I can't really stir below the top of the mainfold...so I wonder if this didn't cause the difference...I will try it on my next batch and post the results....will be in about 3 weeks...

 

[KiterNick]

Brewed adding grain first, no difference...going back to adding grain to water...