Making a sour: adding bottles and dregs of other sours as opposed to making homemade

[DrKennethNoisewater]

Hey guys, making a smoked Berlinner Weisse and the recipe says to either introduce your culture of Lacto or a bottle of a sour (I was gonna add dregs from a Consecration and an entire can of Evil Twin's Nomader Weisse - which is also quite sour).

Do you think this will be enough to strongly sour a beer after like 35-45 days? Would I still need to pitch a manufactured Lacto yeast / vial or just stick with the additions I named above and a regular yeast?

Thanks for any help and hopefully that makes sense.

Here's the recipe I was using. I tried messaging the guy but he hasn't responded.

- Brent


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[DrKennethNoisewater]

Sorry, here's the recipe: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f72/smoked-berliner-weisse-no-boil-bos-424310/




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[microbusbrewery]

Just to be clear, lactobacillus is a bacteria, not a yeast. I'd recommend doing a starter to bring the cell count up before pitching, but the process should work. Keep in mind the dregs won't be a pure culture so at the very least you'll be introducing some yeast along with the lacto. That means the lacto will be competing with whatever yeast is present which could mean the finished beer won't be as tart compared to pitching a pure culture. You also won't really know what kind of bug/yeast ratios you're dealing with since they have different growth rates. That said, it doesn't mean your plan won't work, it just means there are a few variables in the mix.

 

[DrKennethNoisewater]

Thanks Microbus....and yeah, absolutely, I understand the whole Lacto / bacteria thing. I was referring to the yeast that's pitched after the Lacto does its thing for the first 48 hours, etc.

My problem is, I wanted to brew today and don't have time to make a proper homemade Lacto starter (which would take, what, a week?) so that's why I was seeing if dregs and a manufactured Lacto culture (from like Wylabs or whoever) would suffice.

Basically, supplanting a homemade Lacto starter for dregs + purchased Lacto starter.

What do you think? You make a good point about the variables. Sounds like it will def be a crapshoot.


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[Calder]

You have lacto? Just pitch it and don't worry about a starter. For lacto, I believe a starter just slows the process down, because you have 2 lacto cycles to go through. Once the lacto starts working, the difference between souring a quart vs 5 gallons, might only be a few hours depending on the conditions.

Keep the wort with the lacto warm, about 100F. Don't pitch the yeast until it is as sour as you want it to be. Taste it! It could take a week or more. If you pitch the yeast earlier, it will slow the whole souring process, and you could be waiting 6 months or more for the beer, rather than a few weeks.

 

[DrKennethNoisewater]

Calder - I can buy a vial or whatever from the homebrew store. And pitch dregs from a bottle (though that will contain some yeast, too).

Great advice, though. I'll wait to pitch the regular yeast until desired sourness is reached. I had just planned on pitching after 48 hrs per the recipe, but I'll just pitch once everything tastes the way I want it.

Thanks man!


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[DrKennethNoisewater]

Wait, keep it warm (100 degrees) the entire first week?

Or just when I initially add the Lacto.

I don't have a way to keep it that warm all week.


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[davejanssen]

If you add dregs from something like consecration then you will also be adding pedio, which you may not want to do in a fast turn around beer like the one you have planned.

 

[Calder]

Wait, keep it warm (100 degrees) the entire first week?

Or just when I initially add the Lacto.

I don't have a way to keep it that warm all week

Lacto works best at around body temperature. If you can keep the wort somewhere between 90 and 110 it will work quicker than if you keep it at room temperature. It should sour at room temperature, but will take longer.

Seal it up and keep it in the warmest place you have. I use a heating pad for mine, with a blanket wrapped around everything.

 

[DrKennethNoisewater]

Thanks Calder


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