Major Mash Mishap! Now what??

[chickypad]

Once again I'm so sorry but still you can try to fix this now no? you might have just messed up with the yeast bad yeast pitching it to warm who knows. I'm still not buying the unfermentable sugar deal did he take his reading right are you sure it is at 10:58

Just curious, why are you so adamant this is not a fermentability problem? The OP mashed at 168*!!. I agree we need to confirm the 1.058 reading, but even if this was with an uncorrected refractometer that is ridiculously high - even corrected it won't come out anything close to a normal FG. Pitching yeast warm is not going to cause this - unless you're talking so hot you killed the yeast. Sure an unhealthy pitch could make things worse but why ignore the most glaring issue in front of us and keep insisting the OP just pitch more yeast.

OP I would double check your reading, definitely use a hydrometer. If the reading is correct Gavin has summarized the best options from this thread if you want to try to save this beer.

 

[brandonnys]

Did he take his reading right? Are you sure it is at 1.058?

If it was a refractometer reading, it won't be as reliable. They may want to take a new reading with a hydrometer just to be sure. Maybe the OP can shed a little more light here.

Either way I'm sorry

No big deal, man. Everyone's here to learn and help each other. We get passionate sometimes. Water on a duck's back.

 

[brandonnys]

In case you skipped right to the end, here's Gavin's Post:

Problem: Mashed at 168F
Mash chemistry: Very little to zero beta amylase activity and a massively shortened duration of activity of alpha amylase.
Result: Wort rich in unfermentable long chain sugars.

Data (I assume it's correct)
OG: 1.073 What was the target? No idea if this number is accurate or close to the planned OG. Lets assume it's accurate and to target.

FG: High. Undrinkable high. This assumes you measured the Fg correctly, it is indeed the Fg and you did not measure with a refractometer. If you measured with a refractometer you need to correct the data with an appropriate online algorithm.

So you have an extremely unfermentabe wort owing to mash errors. Adding more yeast will do nothing unless you want to add something like Brett. Total waste of time and makes absolutely no sense to add 100 B more when there is no shortage of yeast. That is not the issue. They have no food to eat.

Swirling shaking or otherwise assaulting your FV will do nothing.

Adding DME will increase the current SG by a few points. The yeast will ferment a % that out leading to a subsequent increase in the FG.

Adding sugar will not reduce the FG as it is 100% fermentable. Gravity points will be added and subsequently fermented out. The beer will become drier though not by much.

The only recourse aside from adding Brett and embarking on a whole new type of beer is to add amylase to convert unfermentable sugars to fermentable sugars. I'm assuming @chickypad linked @passedpawn 's thread on amylase. Read it it's good info. (Should be a sticky thread PP).

Available in all good LHBS

As the amylase works to cleave the long chain sugars, the yeast in the beer (of which there are 100's of Billions) now have something to eat. They will ferment those sugars reducing the FG and increasing the ABV.

Assuming the current SG reading is correct and assuming it is the FG (without further measures) this will reduce the SG by perhaps ~10 points leaving you with what I would still classify as an undrinkable sweet beer.

It's a dumper in my world. Learn and move on.

Best of luck.

 

[applescrap]

@kombat thank you for the history lesson I enjoyed it. The old recipes I have seen called for waiting until you couldn't see your face in the water due to steam. Furthermore I am a firm believer that those people could Brew with unbelievable skill and none of the equipment of today. You have really inspired me to learn more about old techniques.

@ chicky because I know that a lot of people Brew with propane like my friend and I'm sure somebody along the way has left the heat on and forgot to stir and had the bottom of their Kettle get a little hot if not the whole Mash. I'm sure there's a point where you could really screw a beer up but I don't think that number is 168. Based on the post I'm not even sure what he really did mash at. But I am certain that plenty of Brewers have accidentally had their Mash temp rise. But you make a great point that based on all the information and evidence it is very possible this had something to do with the stall

 

[jlivecc]

Just to clear this up, I checked SG with my refractometer originally and corrected using the "Brewers Friend" calculator. I also backed up that reading with a hydrometer because I was skeptical at first. My refractometer is typically right on with my hydro readings after correction.

 

[jlivecc]

Also I should add that fermentation looked completely normal at first. I know it's not the best practice to use the airlock as the indicator but in this case the fermentation seemed very healthy for the first 5-7 days. This leads me to believe that the yeast was not the problem...definitely an enzyme issue.

 

[chickypad]

Sounds like we have our answer. If you try the amylase or Brett be sure to report back!

 

[Saboral]

That won't work. Read the other posts. The problem is not a lack of yeast - it's a lack of food for the yeast to eat. The fermentable/unfermentable sugar ratio of the wort is way out of whack. The wort contains far too much unfermentable sugars/starches. There's nothing for the yeast to chew on.



In my opinion, this batch is a dumper. You might be able to coax the FG down a little lower by adding some amylase enzyme as described in the other thread, but I would expect that the flavour profile is beyond saving. Chalk this one up to a lesson learned, buy a decent thermometer, and move on.

Fine, sling that janks in the backyard. View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1461927695.690834.jpg

 

[jlivecc]

Just a little update...

Added a little less than 1/8th tsp. of amylase (it's a 1g batch) on 04/28. After about 24 hours fermentation restarted. Checked to SG today and it is at 1.018 according to my hydrometer. My expected FG for this recipe was 1.017 but I have no idea how the amount of amylase added will effect fermentation. I would think that since the amount of total sugars remained constant the FG should remain relatively the same as well. On the other hand maybe the added amylase will convert more unfermentable sugars than would have been converted with a typical mash. I guess we shall see! Planning on leaving for maybe another few days and re-checking SG.

 

[bransona]

Science wins again!

 

[applescrap]

I told you that would work
Seriously glad it worked out

 

[chickypad]

OP any update? Did it stay at 1.018?