Little HELP Please!

[scdukeboy]

I've brewed a pretty big stout with the og @ 1.10 on 2/23. I pitched Whitelabs WLP004 @ 70*. Though it took fermentation a good 8-10 hrs to take off...when it did it blew the airlock and overflowed for a good 8 hrs. My fermentation is now stuck @ 1.045. Should I transfer to secondary and pitch more yeast? Can or should I make a starter with some of my primary? I've struggled a little over the winter with a couple BIG beers and any help would be appreciated.

 

[badbrew]

How many packs did you use and did you use a starter? I think you probably need to repitch. How long has it been?

 

[scdukeboy]

I didn't use a starter. I used one test tube like vial of liquid Whitelab. I brewed it on 2/23.

 

[scdukeboy]

The gravity hasn't changed in a week now.

 

[dawgmatic]

you definitely underpitched for a stout that big

 

[BrewKnurd]

I would make a well aerated starter and pitch it while its active.

 

[DosGatosBrewing]

From what I've read on here, you should use a starter on any high gravity beer ( 1.070 or better, IIRC)

 

[scdukeboy]

you definitely underpitched for a stout that big

So, that's what I don't quite get. This beer overflowed for over 8 hrs and I should have pitched more? I've brewed about 10 extracts this past year and when I go for more gravity I blow the airlock, make a big mess and can't get my final gravity down.

 

[scdukeboy]

Looks like I need to start making starters....haven't done that yet.

 

[BrewKnurd]

So, that's what I don't quite get. This beer overflowed for over 8 hrs and I should have pitched more? I've brewed about 10 extracts this past year and when I go for more gravity I blow the airlock, make a big mess and can't get my final gravity down.

so, every time you brew high gravity, you can't get where you want on final gravity, but don't get that this is evidence of underpitching?

All the overflowing means is very active yeast. It doesn't mean there are enough healthy yeast to get through all the sugars you have in a high gravity beer.

 

[tmontana48154]

So, that's what I don't quite get. This beer overflowed for over 8 hrs and I should have pitched more? I've brewed about 10 extracts this past year and when I go for more gravity I blow the airlock, make a big mess and can't get my final gravity down.

Are you using a five gallon carboy for five gallon batches? If so buy a larger carboy and use the smaller carboy as a secondary or for lower gravity beers. Second option, use a blowoff tube

 

[scdukeboy]

so, every time you brew high gravity, you can't get where you want on final gravity, but don't get that this is evidence of underpitching?

All the overflowing means is very active yeast. It doesn't mean there are enough healthy yeast to get through all the sugars you have in a high gravity beer.

I'm not questioning...just trying to understand. I've been thinking I'm losing so much due to overflow that pitching more would just mean more overflow. It seems like when I repitch after a couple weeks the high alchohol kills my repitched yeast and I still can't get the final gravity down. It looks like I should do my homework on starters with the high gavity beers.

 

[Beernik]

The overflow issue is independent of the sticking issue.

When you make a high gravity beer, you can get a really thick krausen. When you make them, you want to stick a hose inside the rubber grommet (for a bucket) or inside the carboy bung (for glass). You stick the other end in a jar of sanitizer. The hose gives the excess krausen a place to go instead of blowing off the top of your bucket or foaming out the airlock.

You want a bigger population of yeast going into a higher gravity beer. If you under pitch, you have too few yeasties working harder than they want to, they get stressed, and go dormant before they are done working.

To get it going again, you want to make a starter that is about the same ABV that you have in the fermentor. You want an active population that is tolerant of the same ABV you are going to put them into, otherwise the new yeast might shock and go dormant too.

Starters are always recommended. If the brew you are doing is over 1.060, they are a necessity.

 

[scdukeboy]

Are you using a five gallon carboy for five gallon batches? If so buy a larger carboy and use the smaller carboy as a secondary or for lower gravity beers. Second option, use a blowoff tube

I'm using a 6 gal homebrewing bucket.

 

[TimTrone]

Make sure you aerate really well on high gravity beers too

 

[BrewKnurd]

I'm not questioning...just trying to understand. I've been thinking I'm losing so much due to overflow that pitching more would just mean more overflow. It seems like when I repitch after a couple weeks the high alchohol kills my repitched yeast and I still can't get the final gravity down. It looks like I should do my homework on starters with the high gavity beers.

Just giving you a hard time.

yeast require sterols and fatty acids to reproduce and maintain their cell walls. They can create these sterols from oxygen, but your fermenter is going to be oxygen free after the lag phase.

So basically, based on your pitch rate and oxygen levels, theres just a limit to how much the yeast can ferment before they poop out. In high gravity beers, the alcohol levels provide an extra stressor, since the yeast have to put more effort into keeping the alcohol outside the cell wall.

All of this adds up to you'd better pitch a lot of yeast into high gravity beers. You can also help by oxygenating multiple times (but not after active fermentation starts), but the best bet its to pitch enough healthy yeast in the first place.

 

[scdukeboy]

The overflow issue is independent of the sticking issue.

When you make a high gravity beer, you can get a really thick krausen. When you make them, you want to stick a hose inside the rubber grommet (for a bucket) or inside the carboy bung (for glass). You stick the other end in a jar of sanitizer. The hose gives the excess krausen a place to go instead of blowing off the top of your bucket or foaming out the airlock.

You want a bigger population of yeast going into a higher gravity beer. If you under pitch, you have too few yeasties working harder than they want to, they get stressed, and go dormant before they are done working.

To get it going again, you want to make a starter that is about the same ABV that you have in the fermentor. You want an active population that is tolerant of the same ABV you are going to put them into, otherwise the new yeast might shock and go dormant too.

Starters are always recommended. If the brew you are doing is over 1.060, they are a necessity.

That makes sence, thanks. Let me ask you this. Can I use what's in my primary and make a starter with it using more yeast?

 

[BrewKnurd]

That makes sence, thanks. Let me ask you this. Can I use what's in my primary and make a starter with it using more yeast?

you could. But then you're plunking then into a high alcohol environment right off the bat. Obviously, plunking them into alcohol is inevitable when trying to restart a fermentation, but I would want a fresh starter, so they can be nice and healthy prior to pitching into the fermenter.

oxygenate/aerate the starter well.

 

[scdukeboy]

you could. But then you're plunking then into a high alcohol environment right off the bat. Obviously, plunking them into alcohol is inevitable when trying to restart a fermentation, but I would want a fresh starter, so they can be nice and healthy prior to pitching into the fermenter.

oxygenate/aerate the starter well.

Thanks a lot...I appreciate the feedback. I think I learned something.

 

[scoundrel]

So, that's what I don't quite get. This beer overflowed for over 8 hrs and I should have pitched more? I've brewed about 10 extracts this past year and when I go for more gravity I blow the airlock, make a big mess and can't get my final gravity down.

Here's a practical way to look at under pitching. A local buffet restaurant had a sweepstakes and you won! You will win a million bucks if you and your friends (yeast) can eat 70% (apparent attenuation) of the buffet in 8 hours. So you and I go to the restaurant and nobody we invited shows up. So we eat frantically for 8 hours, we don't even get close, we're stressed and we fall to the floor. No cash for you

Now if the other 100 people we invited would have joined us we would easily eat 70% or perhaps 75% and in maybe less than 8 hours.

 

[Beernik]

Originally I bought a one liter flask for making starters. But I've found that reusing a one gallon glass cider jug is more convenient. The one I use has about the same size opening as a glass carboy.

 

[scdukeboy]

Here's a practical way to look at under pitching. A local buffet restaurant had a sweepstakes and you won! You will win a million bucks if you and your friends (yeast) can eat 70% (apparent attenuation) of the buffet in 8 hours. So you and I go to the restaurant and nobody we invited shows up. So we eat frantically for 8 hours, we don't even get close, we're stressed and we fall to the floor. No cash for you

Now if the other 100 people we invited would have joined us we would easily eat 70% or perhaps 75% and in maybe less than 8 hours.

Hey, I understand that! You knew a name like "scdukeboy" that I just needed it layed out for me in layman's terms. Haha...thanks!

 

[scdukeboy]

Originally I bought a one liter flask for making starters. But I've found that reusing a one gallon glass cider jug is more convenient. The one I use has about the same size opening as a glass carboy.

I've got a couple clear growlers I think should work.

 

[scdukeboy]

My homebrew shop is not the best at giving me enough of the correct yeast I need for these bigger beers. Thanks a lot everyone!

 

[Rowdybowdy07]

Heres how i look at it. Even though you shoulda pitched a starter. Your og and its current fg Will make a fun beer to drink. If it tastes good drink it and enjoy it, And now youll have another reason to brew another batch. Plus the residual sugar will make it easier for. Other people to drink.

 

[scdukeboy]

Originally I bought a one liter flask for making starters. But I've found that reusing a one gallon glass cider jug is more convenient. The one I use has about the same size opening as a glass carboy.

Heres how i look at it. Even though you shoulda pitched a starter. Your og and its current fg Will make a fun beer to drink. If it tastes good drink it and enjoy it, And now youll have another reason to brew another batch. Plus the residual sugar will make it easier for. Other people to drink.

Yeah no doubt....but, like my barley wine I'm afraid to bottle it. My barley wine taste awesome but I'm unsure about bottling it at 1.04. Og was 1.124. I'm just not kegging yet....still bottling.

 

[Rowdybowdy07]

Yeah no doubt....but, like my barley wine I'm afraid to bottle it. My barley wine taste awesome but I'm unsure about bottling it at 1.04. Og was 1.124. I'm just not kegging yet....still bottling.

Well Let it clear really well. Then use carbo drops Or bottle like normal. And monitor the bottles Plus if your yeast is inactive now it shouldnt. "shouldnt" make much difference capped

 

[Stauffbier]

I've brewed a pretty big stout with the og @ 1.10 on 2/23. I pitched Whitelabs WLP004 @ 70*. Though it took fermentation a good 8-10 hrs to take off...when it did it blew the airlock and overflowed for a good 8 hrs. My fermentation is now stuck @ 1.045. Should I transfer to secondary and pitch more yeast? Can or should I make a starter with some of my primary? I've struggled a little over the winter with a couple BIG beers and any help would be appreciated.

Big starters and lots of O2 will solve your problem with stuck gravity.
As far as your overflow problems go.. Check this out;

 

[scdukeboy]

Big starters and lots of O2 will solve your problem with stuck gravity.
As far as your overflow problems go.. Check this out;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t2CHjeEhuXA

Nice...thanks a lot!

 

[scoundrel]

My homebrew shop is not the best at giving me enough of the correct yeast I need for these bigger beers. Thanks a lot everyone!

I wouldn't give up quite yet. There are a couple of things that might work to bring the FG lower. What White Labs yeast did you use? If it is WLP001 and they sell dry yeast Saf 05, you can re-hydrate and pitch that. They are essentially the same yeast but there is a lot more yeast in dry packets than liquid. Then you can then add maybe 1/2 pound of table sugar. The yeast will go for they easy to eat, fully fermentable sugar and will be tricked into eating some of the more complex sugars when the table sugar is gone. This will drive the gravity down, slightly thin it out the beer and boost the alcohol. It won't give a cidery off flavor since the amount is small

Another yeast you could use is White Labs high gravity yeast in a starter, if you used something other than 001. Then you can move it to a warmer room and see what happens.

The problem with leaving it at 1.040 is that it will be cloyingly sweet and after drinking 1 you may not want another unless you like sweet drinks.