LHB said i need to yeast packs?

[deantheking101]

Saturday i am making:


How Rye I Am - A Rye Saison

Original Gravity: 1.058
Final Gravity: 1.004

Amount Item Type % or IBU
.33 lbs Rice Hulls (0.0 SRM) Adjunct 2.70 %
8 lbs Pilsner (2 Row) Bel (1.8 SRM) Grain 67.57 % CHANGED TO 9 LBS
2 lbs Rye Malt (2.9 SRM) Grain 24.32 % CHANGED TO 4 LBS
1.33 oz Styrian Goldings [5.20 %] (60 min) Hops 24.4 IBU
1.0 lbs Candi Sugar, Dark (275.0 SRM) Sugar 5.41 %
French Saison (Wyeast Labs #3711) [Starter 4000 ml] Yeast-Ale

As noted above I have added 1 extra pound of pilsner and 2 extra pounds of rye to original recipe. My friend bought it and is coming over on saturday morning to brew. The LHB said we should get another pack of yeast or make a yeast starter. Since he has the yeast and can not make a yeast starter will it be ok? Also he is coming over early saturday and we have 2 buckets to bottle and two batches to brew so i could do the yeast starter for 8 hrs before it needed to be pitched dont know if that is enough time or not.

 

[Chia]

I dont know much, but i do know that yeast multiplies like nuts. if it were me, i would not worry about it.....i am sure others will know than i do, but that is my .02

 

[HexKrak]

I'll brew anything up to around 1.075 with one pack, there are yeast calculators out there if you want to be sure.

 

[jafo28]

8 hours is likely not enough time for a starter. You could chance it with one pack, but how old is the yeast? Check the date of manufacture on the front of the pack. In the future I would just make sure to do a starter a few days in advance. For this one I'd use two just to make sure, also here's the link for Mrmalty, it will tell you how much yeast you need or how big of a starter you need. Good luck.
http://www.mrmalty.com/calc/calc.html

 

[NordeastBrewer77]

8 hours is likely not enough time for a starter. You could chance it with one pack, but how old is the yeast? Check the date of manufacture on the front of the pack. In the future I would just make sure to do a starter a few days in advance. For this one I'd use two just to make sure, also here's the link for Mrmalty, it will tell you how much yeast you need or how big of a starter you need. Good luck.
http://www.mrmalty.com/calc/calc.html

^that. A starters your best bet, but two packs should definitely give you enough yeast for a brew of that gravity.

 

[bgrayson726]

If you use wyeast, you will get 100 billion cells. If you use TWO wyeast, you will get 2 billion cells (as long as they are healthy). I think you would need about 300 billion HEALTHY cells for that grain bill depending on your efficiency. 8 hours is not long enough to have a good starter. You need about 24-48 for a small starter and 24 hours more for a larger starter.


However, if you pitch 2 Wyeast packs that are HEALTHY, then you will have a slow fermentation, but it will be okay. If your OG is really 1058 with that grain, then you will be fine pitching one yeast packet. If it goes over 1060, then use a starter or 2 yeast packs

 

[dogbar]

With an OG of 1.058 two packs will be more than enough. In the future, a starter off one pack saves a few bucks.

 

[deantheking101]

Can i make the yeast starter in the morning brew in the afternoon and pitch it the next day?

 

[GreenDragon]

Yeah 1.6 OG is my cut off point.. under I don't bother with a starter (especially if using SafeAle). Over I always do a starter on a stirplate ~48 hours before I brew. 1.58 is that grey area, depends on how good you hit the OG I guess.

 

[Zixxer10R]

1.6? Holy hell that's heavy.

 

[GreenDragon]

Yeah 1.06 OG is my cut off point.. under I don't bother with a starter (especially if using SafeAle). Over I always do a starter on a stirplate ~48 hours before I brew. 1.58 is that grey area, depends on how good you hit the OG I guess.

Forgot a zero.

 

[deantheking101]

so can i wait 24 hrs after i brew to pitch the yeast

 

[mredge73]

Sure can, starters don't take that long. 2-3 days most.
Keep your wort air tight and sanitize well. The yeast in a big starter should overcome any small colonies of beasties that may have formed in the 24 hours it has been sitting.

 

[PantherCity]

Just pitch the one pack. I wouldn't under pitch with 1056, but since you are a brewing a beer with yeast derived character under pitching is OK. I was listening to an old episode of the Jamil show and on it Criss White from White Labs was talking about how he regularly sugestes to people who are not getting the flavor they what from saisons and belgians to do two things: 1 ferment hotter & 2 under pitch. If you strain the yeast a little bit they produce more of the spicy flavor compounds that we are looking for in our saisons.
Hope that helps

 

[Pappers_]

so can i wait 24 hrs after i brew to pitch the yeast

Given the choice between pitching the one package of yeast you have or waiting to pitch the yeast for a day after you've brewed your wort, I would choose to pitch the one package immediately after cooling the wort.

 

[weirdboy]

With an OG of 1.058 two packs will be more than enough. In the future, a starter off one pack saves a few bucks.

I am pretty sure the OG is higher than 1.058. That is, the OG was 1.058 in the ORIGINAL RECIPE, but then he added 3 more pounds of grain to the bill.

I would pitch 2 vials or smack packs, but one packet of dry yeast.

 

[HomebrewMTB]

French Saison (Wyeast Labs #3711) [Starter 4000 ml] Yeast-Ale

Did you notice the recipe calls for a 1 gallon starter? That's the equivalent of 4 packs! Compared to the recipe author, your LHBS is being conservative. Buy the second yeast pack or wait to make a starter.

 

[Bmorebrew]

Given the choice between pitching the one package of yeast you have or waiting to pitch the yeast for a day after you've brewed your wort, I would choose to pitch the one package immediately after cooling the wort.

Yes, I would do the same. Can't get to your LHBS to buy another pack before then? How "L" is it?

 

[deantheking101]

as homebrewMTB said yes it will be above 1.06. What do you think of this crazy idea.... i pitch 3/4 of the yeast as soon as the wart cools and use 1/4 of it to make a starter then pitch that 24 or 48 hours later?

 

[NordeastBrewer77]

Why not just make a starter and pitch at high krausen (probably 24-36 hours)? Make the starter now, brew tomorrow afternoon, the starter should be good to go by the time your wort's cooled.

 

[dogbar]

as homebrewMTB said yes it will be above 1.06. What do you think of this crazy idea.... i pitch 3/4 of the yeast as soon as the wart cools and use 1/4 of it to make a starter then pitch that 24 or 48 hours later?

You haven't talked about your process, but if we're having the yeast starter conversation, the extra grains are probably going to be just enough to correct for some poor efficiency.

Why not just make a starter and pitch at high krausen (probably 24-36 hours)? Make the starter now, brew tomorrow afternoon, the starter should be good to go by the time your wort's cooled.

This. Or if you have to make it in the morning, just do that and then pitch when the batch is done. This is not some huge barleywine that's going to be problematic.

Aerate as well as you can.

 

[rollinred]

Just pitch the one pack. I wouldn't under pitch with 1056, but since you are a brewing a beer with yeast derived character under pitching is OK. I was listening to an old episode of the Jamil show and on it Criss White from White Labs was talking about how he regularly sugestes to people who are not getting the flavor they what from saisons and belgians to do two things: 1 ferment hotter & 2 under pitch. If you strain the yeast a little bit they produce more of the spicy flavor compounds that we are looking for in our saisons.
Hope that helps

READ THIS GUYS POST ^^

This is a saison after all. This beer predominantly gets its flavor from yeast. Under pitching will actually add more of the coveted saison flavors. Adding too much yeast and they will eat too fast and not give off the flavors you want.

Pitch the one pack and ferment warm. You will be glad you only did one pack!

 

[dukeredhair]

I've used that specific yeast on a brew bigger than that and the results were outstanding. You will not believe what that yeast can do. It is by far the strongest hungriest yeast I've ever used. I wouldn't be worried about two packs or starters. Just pitch and you'll be pleasantly surprised.

 

[deantheking101]

Well i will check the gravity and unless it is really high like above 1.07 i will just do one pack

 

[JJL]

Just pitch the one pack. I wouldn't under pitch with 1056, but since you are a brewing a beer with yeast derived character under pitching is OK. I was listening to an old episode of the Jamil show and on it Criss White from White Labs was talking about how he regularly sugestes to people who are not getting the flavor they what from saisons and belgians to do two things: 1 ferment hotter & 2 under pitch. If you strain the yeast a little bit they produce more of the spicy flavor compounds that we are looking for in our saisons.
Hope that helps

+1...I've read similar recommendations in a few different places. Ferment at 72F or above and under pitch to stress the yeast. The flavors this produces are often desirable in belgians and saisons. And at an OG of 1.058, you're really not taxing the yeast that much.

 

[deantheking101]

The OG was 1.058 before adding the additional grains. I think i may also cut the candy sugar back to 1/2 or 1/4 pound.