Lagering a Kolsch question

[brewguy82]

So I have my Kolsch fermenting at 50 degrees and I planon Lagering it to clear it out in a couple weeks. My question is if i do lager it at about 45 degrees or so can I still Bottle condition the beer after and get the carbonation I need? Or if not any advice on what do do? I dont have a kegging system yet.

 

[paraordnance]

So I have my Kolsch fermenting at 50 degrees and I planon Lagering it to clear it out in a couple weeks. My question is if i do lager it at about 45 degrees or so can I still Bottle condition the beer after and get the carbonation I need? Or if not any advice on what do do? I dont have a kegging system yet.

Fermenting @ 50F? What yeast you using? I know WLP029 will not ferment that cold, and 2565 I only tried down to 60F and it was painfully slow.
You can always bottle after lagering it just might take a little longer, or simply add some fresh yeast during bottling

 

[brewguy82]

yeah I was thinking that. Im using WYeast 2565 it started out at around 55 degrees and fermentation kicked off pretty good. I think it is around 50 degrees now. I have it in my ref and that is what my fermometer reads. I was thinking off taking it out to ferment on the higher side now. think that would be okay or just leave it in the ref? It still has a big Krausen head on it right now.

 

[brewguy82]

i do have some generic ale yeast laying around that i was thinkin i could pitch a lil into it once i finish lagering in case there is not much left for bottle conditioning.

 

[bannonb]

I might suggest doing a diacetyl rest (bringing fermenter up to 68 for a couple of days). This should reduce any diacetyl (buttery) flavors and also would let you see if your fermentation is complete before you bottle.

Of course you could take a gravity reading which is the authoritative reference.

 

[paraordnance]

I might suggest doing a diacetyl rest (bringing fermenter up to 68 for a couple of days). This should reduce any diacetyl (buttery) flavors and also would let you see if your fermentation is complete before you bottle.

Of course you could take a gravity reading which is the authoritative reference.

From my experience I never had any hints of diacetyl with 2565 and I use this yeast up to 6-7 generations. But I do take my fermenter out of freezer and leave it for a week at room temp more to get better attenuation than diacetyl preventive measure.

50F seems a litle low for ale yeast, there is really no need to go that low. I noticed below 60 F 2565 gets really sluggish and slow with no real benefit in flavour department. If you like month long fermentation - go for it. By the way, with 2565 krausen will stick around long after fermentation is over, it will drop like a rock when you cold crash it or start lagering (I lager in primary carboy )

 

[cscade]

I agree with the statements above, 50f is darned cold for Kolsch yeast. 62f is a happy medium for me between profile and speed.

I have been playing around with kolsch yeast lately at warmer temps (66-68f, allowing to run as high as 70f if it wants to) with some very interesting-in-a-good-way results. It won't make a to-style kolsch at those temps, but it is creating some really interesting beers with an almost farmhouse character.

To answer your original question, I would bottle condition at 58-60f for at least two weeks, and then "lager" just by storing the bottles in the fridge for another 3-4 weeks. It's a long time to wait for a relatively small beer, but you'll reap the rewards in the refinement department.

If your yeast is actually working at 50f, be prepared for the fermentation to take a LONG time. Unlike the more common american strains (WLP001 for instance) kolsch yeast has a much more linear and long attenuation schedule. If you cold crash too early, you'll be well high of your intended FG.

Cheers, and I hope it turns out great!

 

[brewguy82]

Thats cool I just pulled it out Of my fridge today to let it warm up for now before I go and cold crash it. Do you think there will be enough yeast to get bottles carbonated after I cold crash?

 

[camus]

Yes, I cold crash Kolsch 4-5 days then bottle, no problems. Nice clear beer.

 

[brewguy82]

Cool. Guess I will do that. Bring it up to warmer temps for a couple of days. then cold crash it for maybe 1 week then bottle and cold condition for another 2-4 weeks.

 

[jeffjm]

I have been playing around with kolsch yeast lately at warmer temps (66-68f, allowing to run as high as 70f if it wants to) with some very interesting-in-a-good-way results. It won't make a to-style kolsch at those temps, but it is creating some really interesting beers with an almost farmhouse character.

I've been seeing the same thing. I recently fermented a kolsch at 68F and kegged it after three weeks of lagering. The hydrometer sample was quite fruity. Next time I will ferment at 62 and maybe age longer.

 

[brewguy82]

Well I just took the kolsch out of the primary and into the secondary. Now it is cold conditioning in my ref at a low 40-45 degrees.

 

[SailorTodd]

I was looking at possibly doing a koelsch style brew soon. What benefit does the beer get from the cold lagering after primary fermentation? and what is the ideal temperature for cold lagering after primary?

 

[brewguy82]

cold lagering helps to clear your beer. Kolsch yeast doesnt flocculate too well so doing this part helps with that. I belive around 48 degrees is best.

 

[brewguy82]

just checked a small sample today. its clearing out been cold conditioning since the 26th already. has a nice grainy taste to it

 

[SailorTodd]

just checked a small sample today. its clearing out been cold conditioning since the 26th already. has a nice grainy taste to it

Grainy like wheat? I don't know why, but I'm extremely averse to wheaty flavors. I'm one of those who would opt out of the wheat in any koelsch recipe.

(Not knocking your brew, though, just a general comment.)

 

[ASantiago]

I was looking at possibly doing a koelsch style brew soon. What benefit does the beer get from the cold lagering after primary fermentation? and what is the ideal temperature for cold lagering after primary?

Jamil Zainasheff has a pretty decent podcast on brewing Kolsch. Check them out over at the BrewingNetwork.com. I found it quite informative and good preparation for the Kolsch I'm brewing this weekend.

 

[permo]

I have brewed many a kolsh beer and I have found that the #1 goal of the lagering or aging is to get the yeast to drop and the beer to clear. I like to cold crash with gelatin after the beer has finished fermenting (WLP029 at 65-70 degrees), then keg it up and its good to go. Basically, as soon as its clear its ready. IMO.

 

[brewguy82]

I'm getting that grainy taste from the german 2 row I believe. I did add in a little bit of wheat though just to help with head retention.

 

[badhabit]

A year ago I did pretty much what you are talking about. I used WLP011 and fermented at between 60 and 65. I got a good fermentation and then I attempted to bottle condition after fermentation and got very little carbonation. I ended up killing my yeast so much so that after about 3 months conditioning at about 70 F I still had little carbonation. I ended up adding some dry yeast to each bottle which took care of the carbonation issue but did not help the flavor of the beer, which was excellent without the carbonation.

 

[brewguy82]

so my kolsch was pretty clear when I checked another sample of it. I threw in a little more of some generic brewing yeast just in case there was not enough left from cold conditioning it. I then bottled them and now I am waiting about a week and will throw it back into the ref to cold condition one more week. Right now I see alot of particles at the top of the bottled beers. I hate seeing this. But My guess is this is just yeast at the top and wait it out for it to settle to the bottom of the bottle...

 

[brewguy82]

well, just tried a bottle of this kolsch i made last night with a buddy and the wife. Let me tell you it tasted REALLy GOOD!! very clear and crisp! great flavor for a light bodied beer. I love Kolsch

 

[dragonlor20]

Yeah still had some floaties on my Kolsch when I racked to the keg a few weeks ago. Tasted greAt already though. No worries at that gravity. Just rack from underneath.

 

[brewguy82]

Awesome! Gave my father some bottles a week ago he loved it and has offered to buy all of the ingredients so I can make him some more.