JZ's Belgian Tripel question

[hinke]

I brewed the Belgian Tripel from Brewing classic styles yesterday and I have a question.

According to recipe the OG should be at 1.081.

I opted to not add the sugar to the boil, which is 2.5 pounds. I ended up with an OG of 1.070 (without the sugar addition).

Is then 2.5 pounds of sugar too much to add to this Belgian? Or does it need all the 2.5 pounds to finish at around 1.011?

 

[OLDBREW]

you need the sugar to reach the alcohol level a triple brings. The yeasts attenuation with the fermentables will bring the gravity down.

I'd take the sugar and add filtered water, then boil it on the stove top making a simple syrup. Then chill it to fermentation temps and add it to the fermenter.

 

[hinke]

Ok. I understand what the sugars will do, I just want to make sure I don't too much.

But if my OG was 1.070 and I add 2.5 pounds of sugar to the fermentation won't I get too high of OG?

How many points does sugar add to the gravity?

The Preboil gravity (without the sugars) was supposed to be 1.063, so I don't think my OG of 1.070 was too high.

Is the suggestion then to just add the 2.5 pounds of sugar?

 

[mkling]

Sugar adds about 42 gravity points per gallon. So 2.5 lbs will add 105 points. Presuming this is a 6 gallon JZ recipe, this would add 17.5 points to your beer bringing you up to 1.087. That's a bit high, though better to be 7 pts high than 10 pts low on a tripel, I think. If it were me, I'd add 1.75 lbs of sugar. This ought to get you to 1.082 and will be enough to bring down your FG nicely.

 

[bknifefight]

Don't add it all at once either. I would do half of it when fermentation starts to slow down and then do the other half after it slows down again. Your gravity will be over 1.081 but it's a trippel, it's supposed to be strong so I wouldn't worry about it.

 

[Houblon]

Or does it need all the 2.5 pounds to finish at around 1.011?

What yeast? wlp530 -3787 or wlp550 -3522 should take it down to 1.006-8.

 

[hinke]

Wlp530

 

[hinke]

Thanks for all the answers. I think I know what to do now.

 

[OLDBREW]

I'm sorry, I didn't read the question correctly.

If you are using cane(table) sugar, you get 46 points per pound per gallon. So 1.33 pounds sugar would give you close to 10 points.

you can add it all at once

http://homebrewtalk.com/wiki/index.php/Fermentable_adjuncts#Sugar.2C_Table_.28Sucrose.29

 

[bknifefight]

Also, your FG depends on the rest of your recipe as well. If you punched it into BeerSmith or something like that, I would work from their suggestion for FG.

 

[hinke]

14# pilsner malt
.25# aromatic.

that's it.

 

[ReverseApacheMaster]

The other reason to use sugar in that recipe is to dry out the beer so it gets that lightness of tripels. Otherwise it's going to be thicker and more malty.

 

[bknifefight]

For AG your mash temp is very important for your FG

 

[hinke]

I did 149F 1.5hour mash.

I know the sugars are important, I just want to know how much, since I think I got different numbers than what the book says (My efficiency might be higher).

 

[Anubis]

+1 for adding in half once ferm has slowed and other half later. It will help you hit you FG.

 

[OLDBREW]

The other reason to use sugar in that recipe is to dry out the beer so it gets that lightness of triples. Otherwise it's going to be thicker and more malty.

yep +1

The 149*F rest will give the fermentable wort profile from the malt. The sugar will thin, dry, and add alcohol without color, and will not stall the yeast.

If you end up having a higher terminal gravity, it will be due to the higher efficiency of your malts and their unfermentables, not from the sugar, or the yeast.

If you look at the recipe book they probably formulated the recipe for a lower efficiency. Most books recipes are designed for 70% eff.

Look to see what they based their recipe on. You will need to adjust the malt bill to your equipments efficiency. The sugar is 100% fermentable and the abbey yeast is alcohol tolerant to 15%abv. Dosing the sugar at this lower alcohol level brew isn't required.

 

[hinke]

I still have not figured out my efficiency of my system, but I suspect it's higher than what they do in the book. I started milling my own grains and have noticed higher efficiency.

 

[hinke]

Another question.

If I add less table sugars, say about 1.33pounds, won't it have trouble attenuating the same amount as adding 2.5pounds?

 

[hinke]

Hi again,

The beer is fermenting. It has gone from 1.070 (1.071) down to 1.038 in 4 days. It is still fermenting, there is lots of movement in the carboy.

When should I add the sugar? I already made the syrup thinking I was going to add it yesterday, but decided not to do it since it was still bubbling strong.

Any tips?

 

[funkswing]

Well, you should have added it to the boil (but this will have to wait until next time).

I'd take the sugar and add filtered water, then boil it on the stove top making a simple syrup. Then chill it to fermentation temps and add it to the fermenter.

This is the "best" option for now, but make sure you add enough water to not actually make simple syrup b/c the high density of simple sugar will make it not want to mix with your beer. If too thick after cooling it down, once you add it to the fermenter it will just sink to the bottom and prolly won't ferment into much alcohol.

Next time most def add it to the boil, in the last 15 min.

When you boil your syrup, boil for 10 min to make sure you "sanitize" the sugar and water. Then cool to fermentation temps and "pitch" it in the fermenter.

 

[hinke]

Man, I get different opinions all the time here Add sugar to boil, add sugar to fermentation etc.

This is my first Belgian, so I am learning.

The syrup was pretty viscous. It's pitched in the fermenter. Lets see what happens

 

[funkswing]

Man, I get different opinions all the time here

Doesn't that just make it awesome! In the end you get to decide what to do and come to your own conclusions.

Yeah, hopefully the syrup will the mix with the solution and not just hang out with the flocculated yeasts.

"Brew like a Monk" is a nice book for Belgium style ales. You can read it in a couple of hours, too. I would just read it in a bookstore opposed to buying it. But it gives some nice info on what makes the belgium style diff. from other styles (its not just the yeast).

 

[hinke]

That is correct. I like opinions, but sometimes there are so many different types As you say, in the end I get to choose and learn.

The tripel has started up again and formed a new kreusen which is blowing off.

I have been meaning to get that book, I like Belgian styles, except for the IPA kind.

 

[MikeRoBrew1]

If the established recipe calls for that much sugar, why would you leave it out? The style of a Tripel by definition calls for higher abv%, thus the candi sugar which is designed to increas ABV without affecting taste. Cant wait to try it out myself, what is the finished ABV% on your recipe *supposed* to be?

 

[hinke]

Because the OG was high, and if adding the 2.5 pounds of sugar would have yielded a much higher OG than the recipe calls for.

I emailed Jamil (it's his recipe), and he said just to add less sugar.

The ABV should end up around 9.5%.

 

[funkswing]

The ABV should end up around 9.5%.

Hangover, here we come!

 

[OLDBREW]

Like Jamil said for now just add less sugar.

By the "Next Time" you brew the rcipe, you should know your equipments efficiency, so when you dial down the malts and check your pre-boil gravity, you are able to add all the sugar during the boil to hit the recipes OG.

It will dry and thin the brew, giving you that lightness the belgian tripels have.

By the way, what do John, and Jamil, base their recipes efficiency on in the book?

 

[maida7]

Like Jamil said for now just add less sugar.

By the "Next Time" you brew the rcipe, you should know your equipments efficiency, so when you dial down the malts and check your pre-boil gravity, you are able to add all the sugar during the boil to hit the recipes OG.

It will dry and thin the brew, giving you that lightness the belgian tripels have.

By the way, what do John, and Jamil, base their recipes efficiency on in the book?

All the recipes in Brewing Classic Styles are based on 70% efficiency. I've made this recipe several times. The sugar is important to dry out the beer. It makes it a light bodied, dry, refreshing, and very drinkable. Make sure you give it plenty of carbonation. It should be like beer champagne. Enjoy!

 

[hinke]

It is still fermenting after adding the sugar. So far it looks promising.

 

[bctdi]

I made this recipe several months ago and had a little to high og as well ... I added 1 lb of sugar during the last 15 mins of the boil... Then during fermentation as soon as the bubbling started to slow I added another lb .... Then the last 1/2 lb when the bubbling slowed again.It got all the way to 1.008. The beer came out very drinkable but a little bit of an alcohol bite.I think it could have been better with a little less sugar.... I'd listen to Jamil on that because I think too much sugar is what gave mine a little alcohol bite since I had good temp control during fermentation.