is this illegal?

[kosmokramer]

http://losangeles.craigslist.org/lgb/bar/2939378114.html

I just saw this during my dailly trolling of cl and after a chuckle i was wondering if this guy was in for some trouble?

 

[beergolf]

I think he is in for trouble. Selling homebrew is illegal and he is just putting it out there on CL for all to see.

 

[thegerm]

yes

 

[cardinalsfan]

I dunno...he isn't really selling it. he is offering it as compensation for services rendered. that said, if i DID do something like that, I wouldnt post it on CL for everyone to look at

 

[LandoLincoln]

He's not selling. He's bartering. The ATF has a lot more important things to worry about than some guy bartering homebrewed beer for remodel work.

 

[jerryboy]

It is offered as a barter but it seems very gray to me.

 

[ArcLight]

Can you really make enough money homebrewing 5 gallons to be worth your materials cost + time and effort?
Hell, my prep time and clean up time is measured in hours when one considers brewing and bottling (cleaning botthles, etc)
What if you have to toss a batch once in a while.
As for brewing 2 gallons, you can make a profit off that?

It seems like it works out to minimum wage.

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

He's not selling. He's bartering. The ATF has a lot more important things to worry about than some guy bartering homebrewed beer for remodel work.

Yes. And DHS has more important things to do than investigate every complaint about parents that spank their children.

And, yet ...

 

[thegerm]

it's illegal, don't fool yourselves.

 

[atom]

the worst that will happen to this guy is that his ad will be flagged and removed...

 

[quick5pnt0]

Don't fool yourselves, the ATF would raid this guy's house just to prove a point and make headlines. There may be a gray area between selling and trading but no judge is going to fall for it and you'd still be charged with illegally selling alcohol.

 

[cardinalsfan]

Can you really make enough money homebrewing 5 gallons to be worth your materials cost + time and effort?
Hell, my prep time and clean up time is measured in hours when one considers brewing and bottling (cleaning botthles, etc)
What if you have to toss a batch once in a while.
As for brewing 2 gallons, you can make a profit off that?

It seems like it works out to minimum wage.

really he is just trading one skill for someone elses. Maybe the brewer is bad at being handy around the house. It's worth his time and materials to give a 5 gal batch to someone that knows how to fix things, has tools, etc.

 

[bob1852]

There may be a gray area between selling and trading

Actually there isn't. Selling and bartering unlicensed booze is illegal.

 

[LandoLincoln]

Don't fool yourselves, the ATF would raid this guy's house just to prove a point and make headlines. There may be a gray area between selling and trading but no judge is going to fall for it and you'd still be charged with illegally selling alcohol.

Now that's funny. Wait, you're serious? Now that's REALLY funny.

 

[bob1852]

Now that's funny. Wait, you're serious? Now that's REALLY funny.

Yeah, whenever these threads pop up, it's hard pressed to find a case where a homebrewer has been convicted for selling homebrew. I see to recall the numbers are right around zero.

 

[thegerm]

maybe it's not rigorously enforced or even possible to really enforce on a 5 gallon scale... lol... and i'm pretty sure nobody on this forum would argue it's wrong or immoral to do this... it is technically illegal though.

 

[Greenbasterd]

what if the handyman or whatever pitched his own yeast? doesn;t that make "his" alcohol?
thats how the brew-it-yourself places work around here.. they do all the work and you just pitch your own yeast

 

[PVH]

Seems like the same answer for every post like this: "Yes, it's illegal. No, you won't get caught if you don't tell the world you're doing it."

 

[amandabab]

no difference between this and my granddad doing 7 (twice) for whiskey.

The guy is ASKING for handcuffs.

 

[brewingmeister]

no difference between this and my granddad doing 7 (twice) for whiskey.

The guy is ASKING for handcuffs.

Popcorn?

 

[gauzzastrip]

I feel like you could take donations. That way the home brewer is just receiving a donation and the drinker is just receiving some free beer.

 

[xjmox14x]

Popcorn?

lol good ol' Popcorn Sutton.

 

[BrewKnurd]

I feel like you could take donations. That way the home brewer is just receiving a donation and the drinker is just receiving some free beer.

Yeah, that wouldn't look at all like selling.

 

[PVH]

Holy crap! guazzastrip just figured out a loophole that allows us all to sell our beer! Well done, sir.

 

[amandabab]

donations, trade, barter. Their probably is no home brewer that hasn't swapped a bottle for something.

the difference is advertising the intent on a nationally viewable list.

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

Your regulations may vary but, the Federal Regulations that govern oklahoma are pretty clear that compensation for homebrew is illeagal. Even goes so far to say that while I may share, it must be consumed on my premises excepting only for purposes of competitions.

 

[rjsnau]

The person that posted the ad is an idiot and things like that only put the entire hobby in danger. If it becomes a problem the our wonderful government will feel the pressure to get involved and do something about it in the form of more regulations on home brewing or god-forbid, making it illegal again.

It is one thing to discuss what is legal and what is not and it is another to post something like this on craigslist.

/rant

For discussion purposes. Someone mentioned having them pitching the yeast. I don't see why that would be illegal since it is their beer then. Anyone else have an option on this?

 

[gauzzastrip]

Yeah, that wouldn't look at all like selling.

But you're not selling it. You just received a donation because someone thinks you're that great of a person. And you just gave them some home brew because you thought they'd enjoy it.

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

But you're not selling it. You just received a donation because someone thinks you're that great of a person. And you just gave them some home brew because you thought they'd enjoy it.

Okay. Despite having passed laws allowing HomeBrew in Oklahoma, the ABLE commission continually disallows HomeBrew at Beer Festivals. They aren't selling the beer, right? All they are doing is offering samples to further promote a hobby, right?


Wrong.

Since the festival have a cover charge, or ticket charge, then the Federal Govt construes this (loosely) as sales.

Plain and simple. If you accept compensation for your beverage, monetary or otherwise, you've sold it and have violated Federal Law. Same applies to a competition if it has an entry fee. This is construed as a sales.

 

[HexKrak]

All the laws I've read in regards to homebrew say that it is illegal to sell or barter your homebrew. In fact most sources site that you can't even give away more than a 6 pack at a time.