Is Jim Koch mad?

wps-hbt
Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum

Help Support Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
The guy is the biggest craft brewer by volume in the US (or one of them) and he also wants to be on cutting edge trendy beer lists? It really seems like sour grapes. What's he complaining about anyway? That he can't have his cake and eat it too? What else does he want? As much as I love the craft beer industry, and all you Shitlords, we're such a tiny corner of the world, and Sam Adams has dominated the non-BMC market. They're in every state in the country; so what if his beer doesn't thrill a small pocket of consumers, he's a success story and he paved the way for beer today. And let's not forget this isn't a rags to riches story. Neither is DFH.

I forget if it was said on here or the other site, but why doesn't he just embrace the space he's in? He's clearly making a ton of money there and is wildly popular. Sure IPAs and weird beer is popular, but its still a small pocket of popularity. Pour a wild farmhouse to someone who drinks middle of the road beer and it'll probably make their head spin.

Stories like this make me feel like we're just going through pubescent growth spurts (cease and desist, resisting trends, brewing gimmicks). It also makes me notice the dichotomy between what people think the beer industry is (friends helping friends) and what it really is (business that's just not as backstabby as other industries...yet) It is all about drinking whatever you like, just take it in stride. Sure business pains is business pains, but damn JK, them jimmies is rustled son!

Backstory and a sense of place in small batch consumables (beer, coffee, cheese, bourbon, bacon *cough*Benton's*cough*) is important to the 21-27 year old market. That doesn't make them "hipsters," it makes them consumers that know what they want.

At the end of the day just drink what you like though.
 
Arbitrator said:
Asking for a second pour in your own glass is great for the bar, which just sold another pint with no cleaning overhead. I think it's weird, but hey, he's marketing and selling the glass.
Click to expand...

It's also illegal.
 
HevvyMetalHippie said:
The guy is the biggest craft brewer by volume in the US (or one of them)
Click to expand...

He is literally the owner of the largest craft brewery ("micro brewery") in the states. BBC and their cohorts lobby the federal government to change the definition of micro brewery every time they close in on overtaking the current volume that allows them to maintain that legal definition.
 
domtronzero said:
He is literally the owner of the largest craft brewery ("micro brewery") in the states. BBC and their cohorts lobby the federal government to change the definition of micro brewery every time they close in on overtaking the current volume that allows them to maintain that legal definition.
Click to expand...

That's the information I also found, but didn't want to make an absolute statement in case the information wasn't accurate. So again I say what is his problem? Because he's not trending with niche drinkers he gets pissy because he won't make "extreme" beer? Give it a rest Koch, you've already won.
 
And furthermore:
http://investorplace.com/2014/12/top-5-stocks-to-buy-for-2015-sam-wag-ulta-cvx-w/2/
http://www.zacks.com/stock/news/159430/boston-beer-sees-further-traction-from-growth-initiatives

I don't claim to know a lot about stocks, strategy thereof, or if this is worth raising an eyebrow at but what is all this about:

  • On Monday, December 29th, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $292.89, for a total transaction of $1,171,560.00.
  • On Wednesday, December 24th, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $291.36, for a total transaction of $1,165,440.00.
  • On Tuesday, December 23rd, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $290.93, for a total transaction of $1,163,720.00.
  • On Monday, December 22nd, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $290.97, for a total transaction of $1,163,880.00.
  • On Friday, December 19th, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $291.31, for a total transaction of $1,165,240.00.
  • On Thursday, December 18th, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $290.80, for a total transaction of $1,163,200.00.
  • On Wednesday, December 17th, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $285.04, for a total transaction of $1,140,160.00.
  • On Tuesday, December 16th, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $284.47, for a total transaction of $1,137,880.00.
  • On Monday, December 15th, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $277.41, for a total transaction of $1,109,640.00.

Source: http://www.intercooleronline.com/st...hareholder-sells-1175720-in-stock-sam/164645/

Also upon reading the BostonMagazine article again, I have a hard time reconciling the juxtaposition of:

"Unfortunately for Koch, the simple truth is that more and more beer drinkers don’t want Sam Adams, and in turn, an increasing number of bars won’t sell the famous amber lager."

with:

" Koch’s company is America’s number one craft brewery—by a pretty large margin."
 
HevvyMetalHippie said:
And furthermore:
http://investorplace.com/2014/12/top-5-stocks-to-buy-for-2015-sam-wag-ulta-cvx-w/2/
http://www.zacks.com/stock/news/159430/boston-beer-sees-further-traction-from-growth-initiatives

I don't claim to know a lot about stocks, strategy thereof, or if this is worth raising an eyebrow at but what is all this about:

  • On Monday, December 29th, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $292.89, for a total transaction of $1,171,560.00.
  • On Wednesday, December 24th, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $291.36, for a total transaction of $1,165,440.00.
  • On Tuesday, December 23rd, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $290.93, for a total transaction of $1,163,720.00.
  • On Monday, December 22nd, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $290.97, for a total transaction of $1,163,880.00.
  • On Friday, December 19th, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $291.31, for a total transaction of $1,165,240.00.
  • On Thursday, December 18th, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $290.80, for a total transaction of $1,163,200.00.
  • On Wednesday, December 17th, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $285.04, for a total transaction of $1,140,160.00.
  • On Tuesday, December 16th, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $284.47, for a total transaction of $1,137,880.00.
  • On Monday, December 15th, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $277.41, for a total transaction of $1,109,640.00.
Source: http://www.intercooleronline.com/st...hareholder-sells-1175720-in-stock-sam/164645/

Also upon reading the BostonMagazine article again, I have a hard time reconciling the juxtaposition of:

"Unfortunately for Koch, the simple truth is that more and more beer drinkers don’t want Sam Adams, and in turn, an increasing number of bars won’t sell the famous amber lager."

with:

" Koch’s company is America’s number one craft brewery—by a pretty large margin."
Click to expand...

Gotta pay for those christmas presents some how ... or he thinks the company is overvalued ... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 
What I don't get about a lot of these old timers is that they were the ones who wanted to "elevate" beer and have people "respect" beer and get away from boring, bland adjunct lagers. Now people are going nuts for old obscure styles like Gose, Berliner Weiss, and Lambic, and US brewers keep pushing the envelope and redefining classic styles like the IPA. And old timers like Koch are pissed about that. What do you want? Everyone to drink Vienna lagers and cream stouts and never try anything new?
 
Hopping Tiger said:
I want to know about the more than half the menu he looked at that wasn't worthy of being served. I'd love to know what stuff he deems unworthy.
Click to expand...
Not the menu back when he was there in July or whenever, but this is what they have currently:
http://row34.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/Beer-1715.pdf

He must be way out of touch because I would never expect a place like this to serve a Sam Adams product that isn't Utopias (which I wouldn't even expect, really). I suppose stylistically, SA covers some of the German beers listed though, but you aren't going to see SA's takes on those styles in a craft bar ever.
 
I saw some posts on the other channel implying that the owner of the bar was "rude" to not have a Sam Adams product available, because he should expect that Jim Koch would not drink anything but one of his company's beers at a public event. If that's the case, when Koch is either a huge snob ("Only my beers are good enough for me!") or basically more of a marketer than a brewer ("I can't be seen at this tiny boutique craft beer bar drinking anything but Sam Adams!"). And it's funny that he feels the need to act in that way but none of the other brewers who were present for this dinner felt the need to emulate him.
 
sacrelicio said:
What I don't get about a lot of these old timers is that they were the ones who wanted to "elevate" beer and have people "respect" beer and get away from boring, bland adjunct lagers. Now people are going nuts for old obscure styles like Gose, Berliner Weiss, and Lambic, and US brewers keep pushing the envelope and redefining classic styles like the IPA. And old timers like Koch are pissed about that. What do you want? Everyone to drink Vienna lagers and cream stouts and never try anything new?
Click to expand...

Only a small piece of the overall beer market is craft, and only a small piece of that piece is looking for what we're looking for. How often do you see people disappointed over getting something "basic" in a box that is nothing special to us? We call certain beers shelfturdz because we can get them all the time. But to the non-initiated it's a big deal.

The beer drinkers at large love SA's seasonal stuff. Porchrocker, Harvest Pumpkin, Secret Agent IPL, Chocolate Squirrel or whatever the **** it's called, are all gobbled up as soon as possible.

I don't really care about SA any more than them drawing blood against MBC. Id rather just not drink beer if my options are so limited that SA is a restaurants craft selection, but looking at our world from the outside is very different. This is what I don't get. Why does Koch wants to hang with us?
 
HevvyMetalHippie said:
Only a small piece of the overall beer market is craft, and only a small piece of that piece is looking for what we're looking for. How often do you see people disappointed over getting something "basic" in a box that is nothing special to us? We call certain beers shelfturdz because we can get them all the time. But to the non-initiated it's a big deal.

The beer drinkers at large love SA's seasonal stuff. Porchrocker, Harvest Pumpkin, Secret Agent IPL, Chocolate Squirrel or whatever the **** it's called, are all gobbled up as soon as possible.

I don't really care about SA any more than them drawing blood against MBC. Id rather just not drink beer if my options are so limited that SA is a restaurants craft selection, but looking at our world from the outside is very different. This is what I don't get. Why does Koch wants to hang with us?
Click to expand...
Chocolate Squirrel is such a random name that someone should totally steal it.
 
shadowane said:
Chocolate Squirrel is such a random name that someone should totally steal it.
Click to expand...
17-anchorman-quotes.gif
 
HevvyMetalHippie said:
Only a small piece of the overall beer market is craft, and only a small piece of that piece is looking for what we're looking for. How often do you see people disappointed over getting something "basic" in a box that is nothing special to us? We call certain beers shelfturdz because we can get them all the time. But to the non-initiated it's a big deal.

The beer drinkers at large love SA's seasonal stuff. Porchrocker, Harvest Pumpkin, Secret Agent IPL, Chocolate Squirrel or whatever the **** it's called, are all gobbled up as soon as possible.

I don't really care about SA any more than them drawing blood against MBC. Id rather just not drink beer if my options are so limited that SA is a restaurants craft selection, but looking at our world from the outside is very different. This is what I don't get. Why does Koch wants to hang with us?
Click to expand...
Yah I guess that's part of my point. Like dude, not only do people buy your ****, ubergeeks take beer too seriously.
 
HevvyMetalHippie said:
  • On Monday, December 29th, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $292.89, for a total transaction of $1,171,560.00.
  • On Wednesday, December 24th, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $291.36, for a total transaction of $1,165,440.00.
  • On Tuesday, December 23rd, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $290.93, for a total transaction of $1,163,720.00.
  • On Monday, December 22nd, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $290.97, for a total transaction of $1,163,880.00.
  • On Friday, December 19th, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $291.31, for a total transaction of $1,165,240.00.
  • On Thursday, December 18th, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $290.80, for a total transaction of $1,163,200.00.
  • On Wednesday, December 17th, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $285.04, for a total transaction of $1,140,160.00.
  • On Tuesday, December 16th, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $284.47, for a total transaction of $1,137,880.00.
  • On Monday, December 15th, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $277.41, for a total transaction of $1,109,640.00.
Click to expand...
That's absurd. Can't believe his first name isn't even Jim.
 
HevvyMetalHippie said:
And furthermore:
http://investorplace.com/2014/12/top-5-stocks-to-buy-for-2015-sam-wag-ulta-cvx-w/2/
http://www.zacks.com/stock/news/159430/boston-beer-sees-further-traction-from-growth-initiatives

I don't claim to know a lot about stocks, strategy thereof, or if this is worth raising an eyebrow at but what is all this about:

  • On Monday, December 29th, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $292.89, for a total transaction of $1,171,560.00.
  • On Wednesday, December 24th, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $291.36, for a total transaction of $1,165,440.00.
  • On Tuesday, December 23rd, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $290.93, for a total transaction of $1,163,720.00.
  • On Monday, December 22nd, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $290.97, for a total transaction of $1,163,880.00.
  • On Friday, December 19th, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $291.31, for a total transaction of $1,165,240.00.
  • On Thursday, December 18th, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $290.80, for a total transaction of $1,163,200.00.
  • On Wednesday, December 17th, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $285.04, for a total transaction of $1,140,160.00.
  • On Tuesday, December 16th, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $284.47, for a total transaction of $1,137,880.00.
  • On Monday, December 15th, C James Koch sold 4,000 shares of Boston Beer Co stock. The shares were sold at an average price of $277.41, for a total transaction of $1,109,640.00.
Source: http://www.intercooleronline.com/st...hareholder-sells-1175720-in-stock-sam/164645/

Also upon reading the BostonMagazine article again, I have a hard time reconciling the juxtaposition of:

"Unfortunately for Koch, the simple truth is that more and more beer drinkers don’t want Sam Adams, and in turn, an increasing number of bars won’t sell the famous amber lager."

with:

" Koch’s company is America’s number one craft brewery—by a pretty large margin."
Click to expand...

From the SEC filing

In addition, on November 14, 2014, C. James Koch, Chairman and Founder of the Registrant, entered into a 10b5-1 Plan under which a maximum of 40,000 shares of Class A Common Stock may be sold. All shares that may be sold under Mr. Koch’s 10b5-1 Plan will be shares of Class A Common Stock that Mr. Koch was issued by the Registrant on November 4, 2014, upon the conversion of a like number of shares of Class B Common Stock, as is Mr. Koch’s right under the Registrant’s Articles of Organization.

The purpose of each 10b5-1 Plan is to provide liquidity and investment diversification. Once executed, transactions under each 10b5-1 Plan will be disclosed publicly through Form 4 and/or Form 144 filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission.
Click to expand...

Basically, he receives much/all (didn't dig too deep into their sec filings) of his compensation as stock and likely sells a chunk each year so he has cash to be a baller / invest elsewhere so all his fortune isn't tied up in BBC stock.
 


After he gets dunked in the stale beer he takes the tank home and rolls around in it and makes his kids drink the beer because he's a giant creepstain.
 
I think people missed the sarcasm...

"Now I'm not an expert in marketing like you are..."
"I guess you can't have it both ways but once again, I'm no expert in marketing."
"I just wish there was some way to combat Sam Adams current image problem. I don't have a Harvard education like you so I haven't been able to come up with any solutions."

As a matter of fact, the whole last paragraph is hilariously sarcastic.
 

Similar threads

A
Wouldn't Know Him From Adam(bier)
Replies
0
Views
480
AlexKay
A
Tobor_8thMan
"Beer for Pete's Sake" book
Replies
4
Views
955
Shenanigans
S
N
Sharing Nostalgia with the Beginners: What Was The First Beer Your Brewed?
2 3
Replies
89
Views
5K
palmtrees
palmtrees
hout17
Sam Adams Double Agent IPL and Cream Stout worthwhile?
Replies
15
Views
2K
hout17
hout17
CyberFox
Most efficient use of hops and the hop stand/dry hop saturation points
Replies
17
Views
3K
JAReeves
JAReeves

Latest posts

Back
Top