Is Fast Pitch canned wort coming back?

[Morrey]

I cant ever seem to catch Northern Brewer having Fast Pitch in stock. I have used it from time to time when I rushed in from work and wanted to get a starter on the plate w/o boiling and cooling and all that hassle. I got great results but it seems they quit stocking it there. Any feedback...or other sources?

 

[TBC27]

I called them and asked. They said ~Novemberish timeframe.

 

[Morrey]

I called them and asked. They said ~Novemberish timeframe.

Thanks! I know this is an expensive product, but it sure makes up for that with convenience.

 

[TBC27]

Agreed!

 

[Oldskewl]

Ditto! I like having it around. Makes for a quick and easy starter.

 

[treacheroustexan]

Thanks for reminding me. I have been using nothing but dry yeast for the past year or so. Just saw this thread and remembered I still have two cans of fast pitch tucked away.

 

[DevilsCups]

Thanks! I know this is an expensive product, but it sure makes up for that with convenience.

This got me curious...let's take a second and think about this...

1lb of DME comes in at roughly $6. I'm generally using 200g per 2L to make starters, so I'll get a little more than 2 starters worth of DME in a pound. When you consider 2 cans makes a 2L starter, it's actually not that bad of a price for the convenience you get when needed!

 

[TBC27]

I contacted NB again today to see if they had a firmer date on when Fast Pitch would be available again and they still don’t have a timeline.

“Sorry, but we are having issues with the supplier. At this time we do not have an ETA, but are working hard at getting back in asap.”

 

[Morrey]

I contacted NB again today to see if they had a firmer date on when Fast Pitch would be available again and they still don’t have a timeline.

“Sorry, but we are having issues with the supplier. At this time we do not have an ETA, but are working hard at getting back in asap.”

Please correct me if I am wrong, but this "out of stock" situation began around the time line In Bev took over. If this company operates like other large companies, they will squeeze the manufacturer to the point of a loss, so the mfg may have said thanks but no thanks. If my theory holds true, this may be more truthful than some story of cans exploding in a warehouse somewhere.

 

[Rob2010SS]

Please correct me if I am wrong, but this "out of stock" situation began around the time line In Bev took over. If this company operates like other large companies, they will squeeze the manufacturer to the point of a loss, so the mfg may have said thanks but no thanks. If my theory holds true, this may be more truthful than some story of cans exploding in a warehouse somewhere.

I would doubt that's the case. If that were true, you'd be able to get it at other places and I can't find it ANYWHERE. Everyone says "Out of Stock". If it was just an InBev thing, NB would be the only one who doesn't have it.

EDIT: Scratch that... Just noticed it's a Northern Brewer product, so it could be the case actually.

 

[BrewerDude_Store]

Some of you may want to can your own wort. Give this a try: https://www.themadfermentationist.com/2014/11/pressure-canning-starter-wort.html

 

[MaryB]

Instead of pressure canning I just freeze it. Thaw, boil, cool and use!

 

[Morrey]

I don't see anything wrong with preparing double strength starter wort like NB did, then diluting it to 1.040 in the flask on the stir plate before adding the yeast. This concentrate will allow me to can 1 pint jars to make a one liter starter which saves space. I usually have more shelf space than freezer or refrigerator space which makes a Fast Pitch style concentrated wort attractive.

I think I have officially given up on NB restocking Fast Pitch. According to the folks there I have called about this issue, there is a huge demand for the product which makes it seem odd to me they are not more diligent in solving their supply chain problem.

 

[gromitdj]

I don't see anything wrong with preparing double strength starter wort like NB did, then diluting it to 1.040 in the flask on the stir plate before adding the yeast. This concentrate will allow me to can 1 pint jars to make a one liter starter which saves space. I usually have more shelf space than freezer or refrigerator space which makes a Fast Pitch style concentrated wort attractive.

That is exactly what I do. I just did a run on New Year's that should last me the rest of the year. It may be a New Year's tradition.

 

[Morrey]

That is exactly what I do. I just did a run on New Year's that should last me the rest of the year. It may be a New Year's tradition.

I wish I had one of the big boy pressure canners that holds a dozen jars at a time. I have a Cuisinart counter top 6 quart model so I'll have to see how many pint jars I can fit. The specs say this unit gets to 241F on high making almost a 15 psi cooker. I plan to can some soon.

 

[gromitdj]

...The specs say this unit gets to 241F on high making almost a 15 psi cooker. I plan to can some soon.

If it will, that should be all you need. You just may have to do it more often. I bought the 20 qt. Presto canner a couple of years ago with the intention of doing some yeast management and culinary canning, but sadly I've only used it a couple of times for canning starter wort.

I just made a batch of all-grain starter wort @ 1.084 S.G., yielding (8) 24 oz. and (8) 16 oz. jars for about $12.00. At that rate it should pay itself off in 10 more years.

 

[Morrey]

I'm doing an experimental canning batch of wort starter as I type. I used a 1 lb package of DME and divided it 4 ways into pint jars which fit perfectly into my 6 qt Cuisinart. Filled each jar with hot water 1/2" from the top, a pinch of nutrient and screwed lid and ring into place after stirring to dissolve. Calculations are that 113 grams of DME in this pint, then diluted to a volume of 1 liter when used is close to the right amount. This ratio allows me to split a 1 lb package of DME evenly between 4 pint jars.

Filled cooker with water about 2/3 way up the sides of jars, and it only took a short time for the Cuisinart to come up to pressure. The cooker just turned off after 30 minutes under pressure at appx 15 psi. The entire process took around 1 hour.

This method is so much easier than boiling one single starter at a time. If by chance NB should announce that Fast Pitch is now back in stock....sorry Charlie, but I found a new dance partner!

EDIT: Jars did fine and the lid "Popped" down perfectly as planned. This is an easy way to produce starter concentrate...just wish I had discovered this sooner.

 

[Oldskewl]

I need to give this a try. My pressure cooker is small too. Guessing 6 to 8 qt also. I hate making starters from DME. Fast Pitch really was an easy way to make a starter.

 

[Sbe2]

I'm doing an experimental canning batch of wort starter as I type. I used a 1 lb package of DME and divided it 4 ways into pint jars which fit perfectly into my 6 qt Cuisinart. Filled each jar with hot water 1/2" from the top, a pinch of nutrient and screwed lid and ring into place after stirring to dissolve. Calculations are that 113 grams of DME in this pint, then diluted to a volume of 1 liter when used is close to the right amount. This ratio allows me to split a 1 lb package of DME evenly between 4 pint jars.

Filled cooker with water about 2/3 way up the sides of jars, and it only took a short time for the Cuisinart to come up to pressure. The cooker just turned off after 30 minutes under pressure at appx 15 psi. The entire process took around 1 hour.

This method is so much easier than boiling one single starter at a time. If by chance NB should announce that Fast Pitch is now back in stock....sorry Charlie, but I found a new dance partner!

EDIT: Jars did fine and the lid "Popped" down perfectly as planned. This is an easy way to produce starter concentrate...just wish I had discovered this sooner.

I am very interested in your results, as I really liked using fast pitch.

 

[Morrey]

I need to give this a try. My pressure cooker is small too. Guessing 6 to 8 qt also. I hate making starters from DME. Fast Pitch really was an easy way to make a starter.

I think you'll find this a very rewarding project...check how many pint jars you can fit in your cooker. I'm able to fit 4 pint jars in my 6 quart Cuisinart electric pressure cooker. These were wide mouth jars but I don't see more than 4 standard mouth jars fitting either. Four makes a nice even number in that one lb of DME is divided evenly. I plan to do 3 consecutive batches when I get to my LHBS for a 3# bag of DME, and to the hardware store for a dozen more pint jars. That should hold me a good while considering I use some dry yeast and some harvested yeast as well.

I am very interested in your results, as I really liked using fast pitch.

This method yields the same instant gratification as a popping a top on a can of fast pitch, but of course there is a bit of time invested upfront before using it. It only took me a few minutes to weigh out the DME and put on a jar lid, so that's no biggie. I watched the news once I set the timer on the cooker so there wasn't much to this process.

I used to hate the darn mess from that DME making a starter and boiling it and the clean-up. This method is crazy simple and absolutely no mess to clean up...just dry off the cooker and put it away. Huge winner!

 

[Sbe2]

I used to hate the darn mess from that DME making a starter and boiling it and the clean-up.

This is what I want to avoid.

Do you add boiling water to the jars or just hot tap water?

 

[gromitdj]

I believe proper canning technique is to use warm contents and pre-boil the jars before filling. However, on my last run I chilled the wort in order to get as much cold break material to settle out as possible and it still worked well.

The contents get boiled as it comes up to pressure anyhow, but you might want to make sure everything is mixed well before processing.

 

[Morrey]

This is what I want to avoid.

Do you add boiling water to the jars or just hot tap water?

I'm sure my canning process is not completely standard protocol, but I weighed out the DME in the jar, then added hot tap water to help the DME dissolve while stirring. I also put the lids in hot tap water to pre-soften them for a better seal.

Not sure if I should have prepared my jars any other way, but I ran them thru a sanitizer dishwasher cycle and made sure the rim was clean for a good seal. Once the contents has cooled next day, I note a layer of DME that settles in the wort. I shook it up and it dissolves immediately (no chunks or the like), so the stir bar in the flask will keep it all stirred up anyway.

 

[MaryB]

Modern lids should NOT be preheated! The sealing compound doesn't need it and the lid will sterilize during the boil.

 

[Morrey]

Modern lids should NOT be preheated! The sealing compound doesn't need it and the lid will sterilize during the boil.

Mary, so all I need to do is put the lid on the jar, finger tighten the ring and set the pressure cooker? Should I pre-boil the jars (I used new ones) instead of running them thru a dishwasher cycle?

 

[BrewinSoldier]

This thread is a few months old but I'm bringing it back up. I too got stuck on the NB fast Pitch train. I HATE making starters but I make them because I know how important it is to have the right yeast pitch rate.

That said, I'm down to my last few cans of fast Pitch. I would like to make these as well.

On the can it lists the ingredients:
-Organic Malt extract
-Organic sugar
-Water
-Yeast nutrients

So to me, I'm betting they are using their Mallard Malts Organic malt syrup, probably the organic dextrose they used to carry(made from tapioca) and then wyeast yeast nutrient or similar.

One other thing the can says is "pasteurized". I know they story I got from NB with the forever out of stock was because their new supplier didn't pasteurize the cans which caused them to explode. I don't see why they'd like about that.

I also happen to have a canner for my beer(got tired of washing bottles lol) so I can use it to can the starter wort just like they do which is my plan.

So with this information, how do you think they are doing it?

I'm guessing they just mix the malt extract syrup, water, and yeast nutrients and then boost the SG up to 1.080 or so with the dextrose. Then after the boil is done(15-20 mins), they chill it and can it. After they are canned, they run through a machine that hits them at 160° to pastuerize them.

Does this sound about right or do you think I'm off? Also, how much dextrose to malt extract syrup? I'm plugging this in to Brewers friend recipe creator trying to get to 1.080-1.084 since that's what I tested out of their cans prior to diluting.

Any help or opinions are appreciated!

 

[Morrey]

Or maybe they (used to) can the product, then cooked and pasteurized it while heating right in the sealed can. Not sure if this is feasible but canned meats and vegetables are frequently cooked right in the can after sealing.

You make a good point in that they very possibly used LME instead of DME. I have been canning (glass jars) my own starter with DME and there is a layer of sediment that settles in the bottom on the glass jar when it cools after being in the pressure canner for 30 minutes. When I use the starter concentrate, I shake it and it mixes back, so using LME may prevent that sediment layer.

I process 115G of DME in a pint of distilled water. When I make a 1L starter from the canned concentrate, SG reads 1.042 so I add just a bit more distilled water to read 1.040.

I frankly don't think they plan to bring it back. If they were going to do so, they are taking their sweet time - over a year now. They (AB/InBev)probably beat up their supplier to the point there was no profitability in producing the Fast Pitch for them. Since I discovered that canning is quite simple in my table top electric pressure cooker, I am perfectly happy to keep canning away. Works just fine.

 

[pshankstar]

I never purchased any of NB's fast pitch canned starter wort, but I have been making my own for the last year to two years. I follow the instructions that Drew Beechum made.

Canned Starter Wort Instructions

Over the course of a few nights I make enough to get me through the year. It works great, I love how easy it is to make and use. I thought I would throw it out there for others who may not be aware of it. Cheers!

 

[mongoose33]

The point of pressure canning is to allow the temperature to reach about 240 degrees which will destroy botulinum bacteria spores. It's a bacteria that grows in an anaerobic environment. Under the right conditions it will grow and produce botulinum toxin, which is....well, toxic.

I believe the reason we don't see that happen in beer that is pasteurized is that the pH is too low. Pasteurization kills the other baddies we don't want in our wort/beer, but it's not going to kill BT spores.

Only exposure to 240+ degree temps will do that.

Now, what's the probability that we'll get BT spores in boiled wort that's sealed and set on a shelf? I don't know. The risk/reward seems out of whack, though.

And no, I don't know how the Fast Pitch makers resolve this. Maybe someone can shed more light on BT, how it reacts in various environments, and so on.

************

I posted a thread on canning wort for starters last month: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum/threads/pressure-canned-starter-wort-why-so-dark.644852/

I was rather disappointed in the outcome. Very dark. Maillard reactions going on apparently, and a specific kind of carmelly flavor ensued. That might be ok for my Funky Rye or Darth Lager, both beers with lots of flavor and they're dark, but other beers not so much.

 

[TimmyWit]

I also happen to have a canner for my beer

Sorry for taking this completely but I gotta know more. First off ! I was not aware of a home use canner on the market. Details? Pics?

I also like how you just slid that in there like everybody who gets tired of bottling logically just moves to canning as the next step (instead of kegs) lol