Incompetence at brew shops

[SMOKEU]

I've lost all faith in brew shops

Literally every time I order grain there's a problem. They either forget to add some of the grains and I have to watch like a hawk while my grains are being measured, or the experienced brew shop owner starts serving me only for the phone to ring and then someone with no clue what they're doing stuffs up the remainder of the order. Grains that are "crushed" are almost completely whole, items just blatantly missing even after slowly repeating what I'm after. I've tried several shops but I don't seem to be able to actually trust any of them to do a proper job of handling and crushing grains.

Anyone else just sick of dealing with this sort of incompetence that ruins a brew day and wastes plenty of time, and money?

 

[day_trippr]

That really does sound like a pita to have to deal with. I've never experienced anything like that, ever, really, perhaps because I bought a mill before I brewed my first AG batch, and the stores around me typically are ok with customers measuring out their own grains.

NZ is a pretty good size country, maybe it's time to contact Harcourts?

Cheers!

 

[AzOr]

I've lost all faith in brew shops

Literally every time I order grain there's a problem. They either forget to add some of the grains and I have to watch like a hawk while my grains are being measured, or the experienced brew shop owner starts serving me only for the phone to ring and then someone with no clue what they're doing stuffs up the remainder of the order. Grains that are "crushed" are almost completely whole, items just blatantly missing even after slowly repeating what I'm after. I've tried several shops but I don't seem to be able to actually trust any of them to do a proper job of handling and crushing grains.

Anyone else just sick of dealing with this sort of incompetence that ruins a brew day and wastes plenty of time, and money?

Yeah that sucks. Sounds like your inconvenience has surpassed the amount of money that could be spent on a grain mill.
Plus the convenience of being able to brew on a whim.
Good luck either way.

 

[SouthBounds]

Whew, I thought you saw me in the brew shop.

 

[Brewbuzzard]

I've lost all faith in brew shops

Literally every time I order grain there's a problem. They either forget to add some of the grains and I have to watch like a hawk while my grains are being measured, or the experienced brew shop owner starts serving me only for the phone to ring and then someone with no clue what they're doing stuffs up the remainder of the order. Grains that are "crushed" are almost completely whole, items just blatantly missing even after slowly repeating what I'm after. I've tried several shops but I don't seem to be able to actually trust any of them to do a proper job of handling and crushing grains.

Anyone else just sick of dealing with this sort of incompetence that ruins a brew day and wastes plenty of time, and money?

Sounds like trying to get an order at one of the big chain burger joints. We don't have that problem with HomeBrew Headquarters in Richardson, tx. They are Johnny- on- the-spot.

 

[BruceH]

Have you tried giving them a list when you go in? I've found that to be a great help when getting several items at a specialty store that's run from behind a counter.

 

[grampamark]

I’m pretty lucky. The only dedicated HBS that I have access to is self service and very laid back. I weigh and crush my own grain, write down what I got on the outside of the bag with a Sharpie, go up front and pick out the hops and yeast I want from the cooler, and pay the man. Then we BS for awhile and maybe have a beer.

 

[VTX1300]

My local shop is just like the one grampamark has. Self serve if that is what you want. They will pick and crush your order if you want them to, but on a busy day you may have to wait for a while. Personally I prefer and enjoy pulling my own grains, hops and yeast. They keep their mill properly adjusted and actually have a separate mill for wheat malt that is set a lot tighter than their main mill
Great people with a wealth of knowledge that they are willing to share.

 

[Bobby_M]

I think this is really a difference of philosophy. There are homebrew shops that got started around the upslope of brewing popularity (2010) as a pure money grab where the owner doesn't (or barely) brews. I personally run my shop in a way that would draw ME in as a regular customer if I weren't the owner.

I don't agree that self serve is the answer. If you are the ONLY customer allowed to walk into the grain room it's a great idea. Knowing that the rest of the public is allowed to run wild in there is a turn off to most due to the questionable purity of the grain bins. Frankly as someone that pulls my personal brewing supply from that room, I want to know that people haven't been intermixing grains whether intentional or by accident.

The way we run it is that the customer fills out a grain order form and drops it on the pile. You can either stay and watch the employee like a hawk as they accurately measure out your order or you can go shop for the hops and yeast in the self serve fridge and we'll bring the bags up to the register. You can specify exactly what kind of crush you want or you can tell the grain room operator what kind of mash tun / BIAB rig you have and we will mill per internal guidelines.

Of course I'm very biased about this but ask to talk to the owner. Ask the owner what and when they brewed last (American Brown 2 weeks ago). Are they BJCP certified? (yes) Do they perform well in local competitions with their own beer? (3rd place NJ homebrewer of the year 2018) What percentage of the staff brews? 100% of customer facing employees brew all grain regularly and one of them was 2nd place NJ homebrewer of the year in 2019.

I'm just saying, ask some questions to find out if the place is passionate about homebrewing or just looking for the register to cha'ching.

 

[seatazzz]

@Bobby_M, I never thought of the aspect of others before me accidentally mixing up the grain; something to think about. Both of the HBS I go to are self-serve if the owner knows you, and knows you know what you're doing; if they (or their excellent employees) see someone going into the grain room/area that they don't know, they're on them like a stink on sh*t offering to help. One of the shops I frequent uses plastic bags for grains; I have no problem measuring them out, but the owner always has to come help me seal the bags because his sealing machine hates me (we both have a good laugh over that every time). And the obligatory BS session at both places is the high point of the visit. Both owners are avid homebrewers, with a lot more years experience than me; one of them is a person of the female persuasion, like me, AND her prices are super competitive for a small-town LHBS. Going to the LHBS isn't just a means to an end, i.e. getting ingredients for brewing; it's a social occasion. I'm lucky.

 

[AzOr]

@Bobby_M, I never thought of the aspect of others before me accidentally mixing up the grain; something to think about. Both of the HBS I go to are self-serve if the owner knows you, and knows you know what you're doing; if they (or their excellent employees) see someone going into the grain room/area that they don't know, they're on them like a stink on sh*t offering to help. One of the shops I frequent uses plastic bags for grains; I have no problem measuring them out, but the owner always has to come help me seal the bags because his sealing machine hates me (we both have a good laugh over that every time). And the obligatory BS session at both places is the high point of the visit. Both owners are avid homebrewers, with a lot more years experience than me; one of them is a person of the female persuasion, like me, AND her prices are super competitive for a small-town LHBS. Going to the LHBS isn't just a means to an end, i.e. getting ingredients for brewing; it's a social occasion. I'm lucky.

Well said seatazzz.
We have good brew shops around my house and I feel lucky for it. I patronize two of them; one is closer to my house and the other is closer to work. Both have extremely helpful staff who are very knowledgeable and always give good advice. If I'm not looking for advice it's nice to shoot the ish.

The only time that advice is a crap shoot is when I'm asking about mead or cider. Usually the store will have at least one staff who is experienced in those areas though. I don't fault them for it at all.

 

[seatazzz]

@AzOr, where do you go? Mine are Mt Si Homebrew in Snoqualmie, and Jon's Homebrew in Puyallup. Also had good luck at Micro Homebrew up north but I don't get up there very often.

 

[AzOr]

@AzOr, where do you go? Mine are Mt Si Homebrew in Snoqualmie, and Jon's Homebrew in Puyallup. Also had good luck at Micro Homebrew up north but I don't get up there very often.

I’m a few hours south of you. I go to Steinbart’s mostly.

 

[BruceH]

Is microbrew the place in Kenmore?

 

[greyghost]

Is microbrew the place in Kenmore?

Sure is

 

[monkeymath]

I'd be happy to have any kind of walk-in store where I could by ingredients. Non-existent in almost all of Germany. Have to order everything online.

I don't drive, so I'd still have to order bags of grain, but it'd be so great if I could just go to the store to pick up yeast or hops.

 

[dnr]

I refuse to deal with my LHBS while on lockdown just because of their awful website.
The owners have been guests on Basic Brewing Radio, and I was like, "Oh. I'll go visit them."
Pandemic
Their website
Northern Brewer and Hops Direct win.

Sorry your LHBS is a bunch of chumps.

 

[madscientist451]

Tired of incompetence? Easy solution: Just say "Your Fired".
Get a malt muncher grain mill and an small Anvil scale (together about $150) and order your grains in 10 lb bags from More Beer or some other supplier. Its great to have control over your crush and build up an inventory to be able to brew what you want whenever you want to.

 

[Pkrd]

Like a lot of hobby shops, often the owners have a real passion for the hobby but suck at retail (although my local sucks at both).

I bounce around a few online options but these guys are enthusiastic brewers, competent retail professionals and have a great range.
https://www.brewshop.co.nz

 

[Conehead]

I only had trouble with one HB store. I have to do mail order where I live, so being loyal to a local HB store is not required.

 

[crane]

I think this is really a difference of philosophy. There are homebrew shops that got started around the upslope of brewing popularity (2010) as a pure money grab where the owner doesn't (or barely) brews. I personally run my shop in a way that would draw ME in as a regular customer if I weren't the owner...What percentage of the staff brews?

There are several LHBS in my area. There are 3 that stand out due to their staff/owner.

First has been around for 20ish years now. It's run by the owner who is a curmudgeon. Walking into his shop you are first interrogated as to why you are there and what you need. Then he watches you grab your supplies while telling you that you are wrong for not brewing with minimal equipment the same way he does. He says he was BJCP certified who knows how long ago. So in this case, how long a place has been open, or how often they brew, etc. has no bearing on a shitty attitude towards your customers.

Next home brew shop is quite famous. This is the original home brew shop in San Diego that Ballast Point started out of. This is by far the dirtiest shop I've been to. The staff are extremely arrogant and it seems like most of don't/hardly brew. When I've asked questions, they are either too busy selling a beginners homebrew kit to some who has never brewed before or they belittle me for not already knowing everything about home brewing. Again, being open the longest has no bearing here. The questions of how much of the staff brew on a regular basis, how many are BJCP certified are impossible to get out of any of the staff here. Also the "owner" brews more barrels of beer an hour than a home brewery could brew in a year.

The 3rd I offer up for comparison is the youngest in San Diego. They opened 8 or 9 years ago. Best shop I've been to ever, hands down. The owner pushes his staff to become BJCP certified. They are always very candid with their knowledge and will admit if they don't know something. This shop was voted home brew shop of the year last year at the American home brew conference.

A lot of it comes down to attitude that you can't really pick up on in just a visit or 2. You really need to go there yourself several times to really get a feel if it's a decent shop or not.

 

[markcurry]

I'm a big fan of MoreBeer in Los Altos. I don't know if it's the same at other Morebeer locations but the self service is why I shop there. I weigh and mill everything myself. Bins are well organized, and labeled. Not a problem with a few folks doing the same, at the same time. Might be short wait for shared things - scales, mills, grain bins, but it works fine. Malicious customers mixing grain within bins? - I can't image any homebrewer doing such a thing. Caveat - it is a small shop, and staff has an easy view of everything.

For a first time brewer, it can be intimidating in the store. But the staff's quick on the pickup, and are very helpful with walking new customers through the process.

 

[NitrogenWidget]

My HB store is about 40 mins. away.
when I was going into the office it wasn't much to swing by on my way home.

but with the pandemic, they only do curbside pickup.
Plus i'm working from home so it's a drive for me now.
the shop does a good job far as i'm concerned.

They stopped taking bulk orders for grain when the lockdown came so I order online.
I get it. supply chain is slow and there are other customers who need a normal amount of grain for their normal batch sizes.

But, I just upgraded to 13 gallon fermenters,
I want them filled and my kegs filled ASAP.

 

[beernutz]

I have a simple solution for bad brew shops--I don't come back. When I first moved to my current city 20 years ago there was one terrible brew shop. They had years old hops and yeast, everything in the store was covered in dust, the owner was unhelpful, and they didn't even have a grain mill. My first trip there was my last.

Luckily about 10 years later a new shop opened with a knowledgeable, enthusiastic, and friendly owner who keeps his shop well stocked with fresh ingredients at reasonable prices. When you shop you can give him a list or just tell him what you want one item at a time and he'll pick it out for you and will grind your grain orders to spec.

The method he uses reminds me of how people shopped in an old western movie's mercantile store.. His isn't a big shop so this system works pretty efficiently.

Plus he comes to the local homebrew club meetings so if you want you can email him and he'll bring stuff to the meeting and save you a trip to his store which is a bit out of the way.

I buy a few things online that he doesn't carry but try to spend most of my brewing money in his LHBS.

 

[TheMadKing]

My LHBS is also owned by a competent and enthusiastic guy who is always happy to chat about brewing and offer a recommendation if you need one. He allows self serve of his grains, but he has a rule to only have 1 grain bin open at a time due to the mixing issue.

He's over an hour away, but he is also very quick about shipping stuff when I order from him online and charges flat rate shipping - so unless I'm placing a big order I'll just have him ship it to me for less than I would have paid in gas, and then receive it the next day (usually in the morning). I buy almost 100% of my ingredients from him and I'm glad to support the shop.

There WAS also a brew shop much closer that has since (thankfully) gone out of business. He stocked no grain, no liquid yeast, and didn't refrigerate his hops. He was frequently quoted as saying "I can brew any extract beer just as well as any all-grain brewer, and nobody can tell the difference" so he refused to sell grain, because he believed all-grain brewing was a waste of time. Extracts, dry yeast, warm hops - I went in once and never again.

 

[marc1]

I've lost all faith in brew shops

Literally every time I order grain there's a problem. They either forget to add some of the grains and I have to watch like a hawk while my grains are being measured, or the experienced brew shop owner starts serving me only for the phone to ring and then someone with no clue what they're doing stuffs up the remainder of the order. Grains that are "crushed" are almost completely whole, items just blatantly missing even after slowly repeating what I'm after. I've tried several shops but I don't seem to be able to actually trust any of them to do a proper job of handling and crushing grains.

Anyone else just sick of dealing with this sort of incompetence that ruins a brew day and wastes plenty of time, and money?

Sucks that none of them can take an order properly.
Try giving them a list and have each grain packaged separately.

 

[davidabcd]

It's too bad not to have nice experiences with beer supply purchases.
I'm lucky to have the place I go to.
Even the other, "bad" supply shop I go to doesn't ruin it for me.

 

[JAReeves]

My LHBS is run by a friendly, knowledgeable guy who is passionate about beer. The local brew club meets at his store for most of the meetings. It's self-service, but from the register, he can see all the bins and who's doing what-not that I expect home brewers to mess with the grains. As Seatazzz mentioned, it's more than just a supply run; it's social hour, beer sharing, and technical advice all rolled up with clean, fresh ingredients.

 

[seatazzz]

I’m a few hours south of you. I go to Steinbart’s mostly.

I hit them up two months ago when I was in Portland for work; very nice shop, very impressed with the staff and prices. Also buying grain with no sales tax...