Improved boiling on the stovetop!

[davemb]

A less expensive source for this stuff: 3M® Firemaster® Duct Wrap - Fire Barrier Duct Wrap - 3M Fire Barrier Plenum Wrap
(smaller amounts) might be the answer,

 

[BrewBeemer]

My friend had clear plastic bubble wrap that caught on fire and gave the bier that burnt plastic taste. This was his first AG brewing session. Not too happy for a newbie.

 

[BrewBeemer]

I must add to the first reply above, on the second attempt on my friends AG brew day with 7 gallons in the boil keggle it would not come up to a boil with a bare keggle just hold at 191*F max with the cast iron hot water heater burner on natural gas. I live a block away, came back real quick with one of my old welding blankets and some Mig wire to insulate wrap the keg. Instantly the temps went up to a point of a rolling boil even cutting back the gas flow to app 80% of max flow. This with 65 degree weather. The blanket was only 1/8" thick but saved that brew session besides being flame proof and asbestos free as only 10-12 years old.

 

[mrkeeg]

Anyone thought about neoprene? Is heat resistant, not sure how flame resistant.. if you made a sleeve out of it it would be easy to slip off for cleaning.

Hmmm.. that old wetsuit is past its prime anyway...

 

[Hegh]

I'm thinking that welders' blankets look pretty good. Where might I find one of those? There's a welding shop nearby (never been inside), are they likely to carry those?

Even if I get a big burner and move outside (my next project), it'd be nice to use that to conserve on fuel and save time. Wouldn't want fiberglass getting into the wort, though... are they generally pretty solid and don't let go of fibers?

 

[dwf137]

wow, i can't believe i didn't think of insulating my pot.

I work as a consultant on the waterproofing/insulating side of high rise buildings, this seems like a no-brainer to me.

Roxul mineral wool insulation is frequently used as a fire-safing material. It is flame resistant. I'm heading out to site now for a review, I'm going to see if I can find some scraps lying around.

I don't know how available it is to the average consumer, but roxul insulation can withstand temps up to 1000 degrees, which would mean you could most likely use it on gas stoves as well.

http://www.roxul.com/sw34066.asp

 

[johnnyc]

Must be the gearhead in me but the first thing that came to mind when looking to keep heat in was header wrap Exhaust - summitracing.com There's copper and ceramic and they work up to 2000 degrees!

 

[SteveG]

So I picked up some of that DuraBlanket, used it last night on a brew and it worked really well on my gas range with my 15gal kettle...

One thing I have an issue with is the durability of the `dura'blanket... because its 1) not that durable and 2) I tried not to touch it once it was on the kettle because I didn't want any small fibers being swept up into my beer. Anyone use this stuff and find something to coat it with or a material to sandwich the blanket between?

You all are more creative then I am with this sort of fabrication so I thought I'd see if anyone has come up with a good solution....

 

[fastricky]

Must be the gearhead in me but the first thing that came to mind when looking to keep heat in was header wrap Exhaust - summitracing.com There's copper and ceramic and they work up to 2000 degrees!

This seems like a good idea... So what would you wrap this around?

I will say, if someone could consolidate this info into ONE good concept that would work for us Gas (and Electric) range users, this has the potential for PROSTing.

I dare say even a sticky.

 

[MoRoToRiUm]

HVAC tape? Flashing as a heat shroud pop riveted as a sleeve to hold it around the pot?

 

[edwar281]

anyone used a welders blanket to insulate a brew kettle on a stovetop? How well does it work?

 

[Drbobcat]

I found a fairly cheap and effective way to insulate my 8 gallon brew pot and not have it get burned from my gas stove. I used a product called Heat Wave Pro. It is a thermal accoustic barrier product made of natural fibers (no fiberglass) and is faced on both sides with aluminum wrapping. It has a Class A fire rating and is very easy to work with. I used foil tape to seal the sides and put 2 grommets on each end to hold it around the pot. Since my pot straddles 2 burners I made a heat shroud/skirt out of gutter flashing/bib material that wraps around the pot and is held in place by some hose clamps. I went from barely boiling 5 gallons to a rolling boil of 6.5 gallons. It was very easy to make.

 

[FlyGuy]

That sounds like an ideal product. Is it something that is carried at automotive stores locally, or did you have to order it from the interweb?

 

[Drbobcat]

I ordered off the internet from a company called "Second Skin Audio." I have never seen it in a store. Just type in Heat Wave Pro on any search engine and it should come up. Be sure to get the "Pro" version as the regular "Heat Wave" product has facing on only one side. Nine square feet of the product was about $25 and shipping was about $12. It was more than enough for my kettle and lid. Now I have a good supply of melted Reflectix if you are interested ;-)

 

[maztec]

Interesting product Drbobcat. Have other people tried Heat Wave Pro now?

I can get mine to a rolling boil, but do not have a particularly efficient kettle. With my lid off, I consistently fall to 6F short of a full boil :\. Very frustrating. I have used a friends kettle with thicker walls that held the heat in better . . difference? aluminum bottom & stainless sides vs all aluminum. Mine is the all aluminum - great for heat transfer, but goes right out the sides :\.

What has been the best solution found so far? The thread seems pretty mixed.

 

[rico567]

I got my firewall insulation from J.C. Whitney, along with the spray adhesive to make it stick to the brewpot, and the foil tape to secure it. Total about $40 (with a ****load of insulation left over!). It does solve the problem, however. My 30 qt. SS brewpot would barely keep a full 5 gal. at a bubbling boil previously (on our Jenn-Air gas cooktop, burner rated at 8.5K btu), and now it can maintain a bubbling boil quite comfortably. Note that this is not the "volcanic" rolling boil that some seem to prefer. There is no burning or scorching of the insulation or tape, despite the gas cooktop.
I will soon be moving outside to do my first AG batches, and I question whether the insulation will survive a boil on the Bayou Classic SP-10. I'm contemplating a test boil using water to check this.

 

[Philsc]

Foam Control: I gotta put another plug in for this stuff. Magic. I had that turkey fryer pot within an inch and a half of the rim, and there was no danger of boiling over at ANY point in the process. Highly recommended stuff! Turns your 30 qt pot into a 40!!!

What is this "Foam Control" of which you speak.

By the way, thanks for sharing all your innovations. I'm going to get out and buy me some insulation and a plastic T. At some point I want to make a frozen yeast bank.

Perhaps you should write a book and make some money off your creative engineering.

 

[jescholler]

I know the thread died, but this looks really promising for you electric brewery guys:

Mcmaster.com
9349K2
Foam Rubber Insulation Plain Back, 1/2" Thick, 36" X 48" Sheet, Black
In stock at $18.88 Each

This is enough to do two sanke sized kettles 18" high by 48" around. A little high temp duct tape at the seam and you're golden... remove it when you want to or not..

Ultra-Flexible Foam Rubber Insulation

Fiberglass Faced
Temperature Range: Uncoated Plain Back, -20° to +220° F; Uncoated Adhesive Backed, +20° to +180° F; Fiberglass Faced, -297° to +220° F
Heat Flow Rate (K-factor): 0.27 Btu/hr. x in./sq. ft. @75° F
Density: 3-6 lbs./cu. ft.
Color: Uncoated, black; Fiberglass Faced, black with silver jacket
Wrap this foam insulation around ducts and large diameter pipes—it's moisture resistant and extremely flexible and soft. Insulation is made of closed-cell elastomeric Buna-N/PVC foam. Cut with a knife. Meets ASTM E84 25/50 for flame and smoke. Size is 36" x 48", unless noted.
Install plain back insulation with contact adhesive (sold separately below).
Uncoated insulation is for indoor use; can be used outdoors if coated with latex paint (sold separately below). Fiberglass-faced insulation is impregnated with aluminum for impact resistance. Use indoors and out.

Has anyone tried this material? If so, did it work well? It looks pretty cost effective.

 

[Briansierra]

As someone else above noted, backpack stoves need to be efficient. Look at the flux ring heat exchanger that JetBoil uses. Looks like a radiator on the bottom of the pot. Maybe I have one in my Delorean that will work

Combined with an insulated lid, and maybe that Caldera cone setup, there are some good ideas in this thread. Need to get busy and test various options.

 

[maztec]

Combined with an insulated lid, and maybe that Caldera cone setup, there are some good ideas in this thread. Need to get busy and test various options.

Read back, a lid usually isn't a good idea.

 

[Briansierra]

Yes, I know about DME, but I do use the lid on the HLT and getting the wort up to a boil.

 

[NotALamer]

So has anyone come up with a simple solution for a gas range? Frax blanket is a great insulator but I'd rather not deal with it, it's not very durable and the fibers probably aren't great for your lungs.

 

[rico567]

I got my firewall insulation from J.C. Whitney, along with the spray adhesive to make it stick to the brewpot, and the foil tape to secure it. Total about $40 (with a ****load of insulation left over!). It does solve the problem, however. My 30 qt. SS brewpot would barely keep a full 5 gal. at a bubbling boil previously (on our Jenn-Air gas cooktop, burner rated at 8.5K btu), and now it can maintain a bubbling boil quite comfortably. Note that this is not the "volcanic" rolling boil that some seem to prefer. There is no burning or scorching of the insulation or tape, despite the gas cooktop.
I will soon be moving outside to do my first AG batches, and I question whether the insulation will survive a boil on the Bayou Classic SP-10. I'm contemplating a test boil using water to check this.

As a followup, I have moved to AG, using the pot for three batches so far, heating strike water and for 6.5 gal boils on a Bayou Classic SP-10, and the insulation and associated components (tape & adhesive) do not seem to be adversely affected.

 

[maztec]

So has anyone come up with a simple solution for a gas range? Frax blanket is a great insulator but I'd rather not deal with it, it's not very durable and the fibers probably aren't great for your lungs.

There are a few recommendations in the list, but nothing that I saw with any results posted. So, no idea. I wish I had better news ;(

 

[BrewBeemer]

I'm thinking that welders' blankets look pretty good. Where might I find one of those? There's a welding shop nearby (never been inside), are they likely to carry those?

You must of lived a sheltered life sorry to hear this Hegh. Check one of your larger welding suppy stores they should have blankets in different sizes. This was a emergency use item not a permanent installation.

I used one of my old stained blankets folded in thirds then wrapped little over one time around the boil keg. basically a blanket app twice the thickness of canvas material that has fire proof material in it. I have had it almost dark red hot against gas welding and slag from the O/A cutting torch with items behind it fully protected. Granted it will also hold liquid from a boilover, don't do that. For my HLT and MLT I used .032" 7075 aluminum sheeting I had laying around and made 2" wide collars for the top and bottom of the kegs then pop riveted 90 degree tabs to hold a outer wrapping on. The bottom joints were tight but still duct taped incase of leakage until the foam set up. At the top added six 1/2" holes in the 2" wide collar for adding liquid a box of expanding foam plus a bleed off zone when over filled. It happens trust me. when the foam was done expanding the top collar was cleaned off and automotive weather strip sealer was used on app 1 1/2" diameter sanded aluminum discs and hole areas over the fill holes. This has been on my electric brewing system I sold almost 4 years ago and I used it for 2 years before then and is still working of the last phone call last winter. Small stainless sheet metal screws hold the discs in place as the weather strip sealer finally let loose. This old system boils with 10 gallon net batches with two 4,500 watt ULD heating elements then to one when the boil begins. Sealed cell foam so no wet bier soaking into the foam or bier smell when put away. This has been my best insulation cure for electrically heated keggle system so far.

 

[JJWP]

I found a fairly cheap and effective way to insulate my 8 gallon brew pot and not have it get burned from my gas stove. I used a product called Heat Wave Pro. It is a thermal accoustic barrier product made of natural fibers (no fiberglass) and is faced on both sides with aluminum wrapping. It has a Class A fire rating and is very easy to work with. I used foil tape to seal the sides and put 2 grommets on each end to hold it around the pot. Since my pot straddles 2 burners I made a heat shroud/skirt out of gutter flashing/bib material that wraps around the pot and is held in place by some hose clamps. I went from barely boiling 5 gallons to a rolling boil of 6.5 gallons. It was very easy to make.

Drbobcat - can you describe the heat shroud skirt in some detail? Right now I'm using Reflectix on my 7.5 gal pot and it seems to have no effect other than melting on my gas range. Like you I position my pot over two burners - I'd be very interested in knowing how you deflect the heat from the edges closest to the burners from going straight up the sides and burning your insulation.

Thanks,

jjwp

 

[Prickle]

I found a fairly cheap and effective way to insulate my 8 gallon brew pot and not have it get burned from my gas stove. I used a product called Heat Wave Pro. It is a thermal accoustic barrier product made of natural fibers (no fiberglass) and is faced on both sides with aluminum wrapping. It has a Class A fire rating and is very easy to work with. I used foil tape to seal the sides and put 2 grommets on each end to hold it around the pot. Since my pot straddles 2 burners I made a heat shroud/skirt out of gutter flashing/bib material that wraps around the pot and is held in place by some hose clamps. I went from barely boiling 5 gallons to a rolling boil of 6.5 gallons. It was very easy to make.

Can you post some photos?

 

[weirdboy]

I PM'ed DrBobcat and he emailed me some photos of his setup along with a description to post here on the forum. So, here it is with DrBobcat's comments and my occasional additional editorial insertions.

I mash in a 5 gallon pot wrapped in Reflectix material. I am essentially doing DeathBrewer's method with a twist or 2.

This is the Heat Wave Pro Product with the edges sealed with foil tape and 2 large grommets at each end to all ow you to fasten it to itself.

A close-up of the grommets:

A shot of the wing nut assemblies for fastening the wrap to the BK:

This is the heat skirt made of aluminum gutter bib/flashing material. It comes prebent in the L Shape so all you do is take some snips and cut every 4 inches or so. I would advise you to cut the corners on the individual pieces or you WILL slice up your hands.

I connected 3 hose clamps to fit around the entire skirt. I did two wraps to make sure the flame from the stove had no opening to sneak through.

The close up of my stove is where the heat was deflected to. It nearly melted the whole assembly. Now I put 2 layers of foil over the electronic portion of my stove as well as between the stove and the adjacent cabinets...they got really, really hot.

 

[Drbobcat]

Just a quick clarification. The picture is of my 8 gallon pot. The 5 gallon pot is not pictured.

 

[hexmonkey]

Has anyone tried this material? If so, did it work well? It looks pretty cost effective.

I brew on an electric burner with a "canning element" and I bought that material to make a jacket for my 7.5-gallon stainless kettle. I have to take photos and actually test the effectiveness, since I never tried to boil in my 7.5-gal kettle before using the jacket (I was using a 5-gallon aluminum kettle before). Even with it, I don't get the same kind of rolling boil that I got with this kettle on my bayou classic burner, but it gets the job done and I haven't had any trouble with off-flavors or DMS.