I want a diesel

[shafferpilot]

Back in the day I had a Ford Escort with a diesel, and it was one of the best cars I ever had. I got somewhere around 75mpg and that thing would cruise down the highway at 75mph all day long..... as long I as didn't have any passengers

 

[Brew Runner]

There was a brief period after the second oil 'crisis' in '79, where MB and other companies sold diesels in the US. Then Cadillac came out with a 'diesel' V8 that was just a gasser with higher compression. It was such a POS that it killed diesel autos in the US for a long time.

I seem to recall that the diesel 350 was about the same quality....unless the Caddy oil burner was based on/same as the 350 smoker. I'm not a GM historian, but I do know I wouldn't buy one given better options.

 

[user 574]

Diesel prices used to just lag behind the going rate of gas. If gas was increasing, diesel would usually be cheaper for a period because consumption wasn't as high as regular gas, then diesel would be higher as gas went down. That doesn't seem to happen anymore though. Seems like diesel is always higher. I smell an agenda.

Perhaps I was fed a line of BS but I thought gas had more pollutants than diesel but people usually freaked cuz they could see the smoke from diesel? Perhaps that was before unleaded?

I wish we had more diesel cars in the US like Europe. Wouldn't cost that much to maintain if we had a lot of them here to support the mechanics. Love the gas mileage.

 

[Flyin' Lion]

Diesel prices used to just lag behind the going rate of gas. If gas was increasing, diesel would usually be cheaper for a period because consumption wasn't as high as regular gas, then diesel would be higher as gas went down. That doesn't seem to happen anymore though. Seems like diesel is always higher. I smell an agenda.

Perhaps I was fed a line of BS but I thought gas had more pollutants than diesel but people usually freaked cuz they could see the smoke from diesel? Perhaps that was before unleaded?

I wish we had more diesel cars in the US like Europe. Wouldn't cost that much to maintain if we had a lot of them here to support the mechanics. Love the gas mileage.

I thought diesel was cheaper to make than gas and cost less because of that fact. I figured diesel was more expensive now because they tax the hell out of it to disuade people from using it.

 

[david_42]

One of the reasons diesel used to be cheaper was the lower octane ratings of gasoline (which were boosted cheaply with lead). Refineries produced a higher percentage of diesel 30 years ago out of every barrel of oil. Re-structuring refineries to produce high octane gas that didn't use lead AND making ultra low sulfur diesel cuts the diesel percentage and boosts the cost.

Not saying the oil companies aren't wallowing in profits.

One thing I'm concerned about is the move to taxing vehicles by the miles driven, not fuel usage.

 

[brewman !]

This is my truck (and trailer.) Its a Ford with a Cummins in it.

You can read more here.
http://common-sense-diesel.blogspot.com/

 

[Lil' Sparky]

That's got to be heresy of the highest order!

 

[shafferpilot]

no one hydrocarbon is more or less expensive than another to make. Refineries don't just distill crude anymore (and haven't for a long time. They have equipment that cracks heavier molecules into lighter ones, as well as equipment that can make light molecules come back together. That's how they adjust how much of each type of fuel they produce. The real killer of diesel is this low sulfer crap. First, IMHO, there are basically NO advantages enviromentally for sulfer free diesel!!! Sulfer is a naturally occuring gas!! One active volcano spews out millions and millions of tons of it each day!! Look at the world's history. Volcanos have been around for billions of years, and the earth has survived all of the sulfer. So here's the deal: American oil is expensive to refine because it has a LOT of sulfer in it. More so than any other oil in the world. do you see where I'm going with this? If a$$holes like Mr Bush and all the other american oil barrons want to keep the price of oil products through the roof, a sulfer scare is a GREAT way to do it. It's very much like starting a war based entirely on lies. Plus our dependence on foreign oil is critical to keeping the prices as high as possible. whew, i'm done with the political crap now, sorry.

Anyways, diesel prices are generally more stable because the consumption is much more stable. Most diesel is used by transport trucks, ships and trains. They run all year long rain or shine so the supply chain moves steadily along instead of the speed up, slow down that gasoline goes through on a weekly and seasonal basis.

Wow I'm really gonna hear about that childish rant I just had aren't I. Oh well, bring it on! I'm gonna go get a beer and chill out and save some money by NOT driving to the bar

 

[brewman !]

There are huge environmental justifications for low sulfur diesel. Sulfur + oxygen = sulfur dioxide. Yes, volcanoes emit it. That doesn't make it good for us. Forests emit CO2 when they decay or burn. Still not good for us.

"no one hydrocarbon is more or less expensive than another to make." This statement is outright wrong.

 

[shafferpilot]

Pure oxygen makes my head spin like when I hyperventilate. pure oxygen dilutes in the atmosphere to a more tolerable level, and is then consumed by different kinds of living things..... just like sulfer! But I don't think anyone is ready to ban oxygen production. Sulfer released by diesel engines is not even a drop in the bucket. Heck it's not even a drop in the swimming pool of sulfer in the atmosphere. There are certainly chemicals that we should NOT be releasing into the atmosphere. The ones we need to worry about are ones that are not naturally occuring!! Anything that occurs in nature has enzymes, microbes, etc that will consume it. Many CFC's do not. Almost all plastics do not. No one is trying to outlaw teflon, but many scientists are convinced it causes cancer. And if you think teflon isn't floating around in the atmosphere, do a google search on teflon and penguins in antarctica.

 

[shafferpilot]

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[Brew Runner]

You won't hear backlash from me since I don't disagree.

Anyway, the long name for what you're talking about is catalytic reformation, "cracking" for short. Also, it's not so much sulfur alone that is the problem, it's the sulfur dioxide gas that results from burning it. That gas goes into the atmosphere and when it mixes with rainwater creates sulfuric acid. I'd like to know just how critical the sulfur dioxide emissions are that come from diesels versus coal-burning industry.

I read something on a diesel forum that in many areas it's possible to have your fuel tank dipped to check for illegally using off-highway diesel.

 

[brewman !]

Sulfur reductions were not done to drive up the price of diesel. Reducing sulfur was a pain for everyone, refineries included and if you look at crack spreads they aren't larger since the start of ULSD production. In effect the refineries are doing more for the same price.

If you want to reduce the price of diesel and do the economy some good, get all the oil fired furnaces in the north east converted over to natural gas.

 

[shafferpilot]

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[brewman !]

*shakes head

Oil burning furnaces can be just as efficient as natural gas furnaces and both fuels can have the same CO and NOx issues, depending on furnace design.

The reason I contend that people should switch over is because natgas is a gaseous fuel at atmospheric temps/pressures, whereas diesel is a liquid fuel. Presently liquid fuels are more suited to transportation needs and natgas has a higher hydrogen/carbon ratio so it decreases the carbon footprint required to heat a home.

I don't think the government is doing anything wrong as far as not encouraging homeowners to switch over. That is something that individuals should decide/do, just like buying a more fuel efficient vehicle. In short, I am NOT buying into your conspiracy theory.

And if you want to "follow the dollar signs", look no further than oil traders/speculators. Phil Davis has some interesting information on that topic if you spend some time searching and reading.
http://www.philstockworld.com/

 

[shafferpilot]

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[shafferpilot]

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[knarfks]

Brew runner. It is true the highway patrol, or basically any law enforcement person can dip the tank. Off road fuel typically has red dye in it. In kansas you get caught it is a $3500 fine. The do enforce it. I have an excavator friend who had to pay it. He has since rigged a supply line from the tank in the bed, but he won't put it in the truck's gas tank anymore.

 

[Brew Runner]

I'm not sure, but it would most likely be the CHP running a checkpoint.