I like this time at night on HBT

[LabRatBrewer]

I just had an odd thought. Would it be possible to partially refill your co2 bottle by putting an active fermentation in a keg? I'm thinking no. The amount of pressure you'd need to liquefy the co2 probably makes it impossible. Even if it doesn't, the check valves would.

It's still an interesting thought. Maybe carbonate one batch with the co2 produced by another... I'm kinda tired tonight, and my mind is wandering.

Here's a fairly long thread discussing capture of co2. https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f11/how-about-co2-capture-system-48208/index3.html

 

[Leadgolem]

Here's a fairly long thread discussing capture of co2. https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f11/how-about-co2-capture-system-48208/index3.html

Interesting. I'm still reading tangential threads from that.

So, it breaks down to this. Yes you can do it. In order for it to be useful you would need to be able to liquefy the co2 though. That means 6-800 psi.

Page 9 has a diagram for a system that would probably work, and wouldn't be ruinously expensive. The problem would be that it would require a lot of work to run.

An alternate design using an electric pump is to expensive to be practical. Pumps that you could reasonable use for this and can produce pressures high enough to liquefy co2 are 8k and up.

Both of those setups have the problem of requiring a very large diaphragm type storage vessel.

Well, that's one hare I'll probably not pursue further. To many problems, and to high of a space requirement.

 

[Leadgolem]

So, while looking at the idea of compressing co2 from fermentation I thought of two things.

1. Why can't I naturally carb in the keg?

I did some more research and found that there isn't really any reason you can't. There are a couple of disadvantages. First that you end up with some trub in the bottle of the keg. So the first few glasses are somewhat yeasty. Second, the sealing rings on a keg don't usually seat perfectly. So corny kegs don't usually seal without pressure. Easy way around this, use a blast of pressure to seat everything. Then let the yeast carb the brew.

I'm not sure how much co2 you would expend doing that vs force carbing, but it seems like an easy way to save on co2.

2. I don't need another regulator to carb soda.

All I have to do is hook one of the 30 psi connectors up to a 2 liter bottle with the ball lock adapter on it. It won't carbonate in minutes like in the cute youtube videos, but in several days it will still carb. I've got space in the keezer for a couple of bottles too. I've just been thinking that rapidly carbing soda was the "correct" way to do it. That's such a stupid oversight on my part.

I'll probably build an adapter to connect to one of the ball lock gas connectors specifically for this later. I could use a little more line so I can use a gap between kegs in the corner of the keezer for this. That, and I'd like to put a check valve between the line for this and the soda bottle. That way I could shake the bottle to speed the process up without getting soda back into the gas line.

 

[bottlebomber]

LG, are you considering priming soda with yeast and sugar?

 

[Dan]

So, while looking at the idea of compressing co2 from fermentation I thought of two things.

1. Why can't I naturally carb in the keg?

I did some more research and found that there isn't really any reason you can't. There are a couple of disadvantages. First that you end up with some trub in the bottle of the keg. So the first few glasses are somewhat yeasty. Second, the sealing rings on a keg don't usually seat perfectly. So corny kegs don't usually seal without pressure. Easy way around this, use a blast of pressure to seat everything. Then let the yeast carb the brew.

I'm not sure how much co2 you would expend doing that vs force carbing, but it seems like an easy way to save on co2...

Good morning LG

I've never naturally carbed in a keg but can see a time and place for it. Mainly if the pipeline was so full kegs were sitting around waiting to be carbed, then natural would be a great alternative. I don't think the CO2 used to seal the lid would be significant. Even when force carbing my kegs require a shot of pressure to purge the tank and seal the o-rings. But alas, who am I kidding? I haven't forced carbed a keg or brewed for that matter since early spring. I sold off four of my six cornies for the move.

 

[Leadgolem]

LG, are you considering priming soda with yeast and sugar?

I hadn't really thought about it, but I guess I could if I was making a sugar free soda with splenda or something. If I'm going to do that though, I wouldn't need the gas system at all. I'd just fill 2L bottles and cap them.

It hadn't occured to me, because I don't really like sugar free soda. I certainly could do that with the drink mixes I'm testing the keezer with though...

Good morning LG

I've never naturally carbed in a keg but can see a time and place for it. Mainly if the pipeline was so full kegs were sitting around waiting to be carbed, then natural would be a great alternative. I don't think the CO2 used to seal the lid would be significant. Even when force carbing my kegs require a shot of pressure to purge the tank and seal the o-rings. But alas, who am I kidding? I haven't forced carbed a keg or brewed for that matter since early spring. I sold off four of my six cornies for the move.

Mostly, I'm a cheapskate. That, and doing the bottle exchange was kind of a PITA. So I'm looking to conserve co2 a bit.

 

[Leadgolem]

Well, I thought I'd do a little experiment. I've got 2l of sugar free mango drink mix in a bottle with 1 tbs of sugar and 1/4 of a tsp of bakers yeast. I'll give it a week and see what it does.

 

[Leadgolem]

Huh, I just calculated what should be the ABV of this little experiment. It came out higher then I expected at 0.4%.

 

[Thunder_Chicken]

If you naturally carbonate in the keg, wouldn't you still need to maintain pressure using a CO2 bottle, at least as the keg emptied? Otherwise your carbonation level would decrease as the headspace volume increased and residual CO2 came out of solution.

 

[Dan]

If you naturally carbonate in the keg, wouldn't you still need to maintain pressure using a CO2 bottle, at least as the keg emptied? Otherwise your carbonation level would decrease as the headspace volume increased and residual CO2 came out of solution.

Absolutely. The natural carbonation would be lost and the beer would not flow. Serving pressure will always need applied. Even a commercial keg that is fully carbonated will stop flowing if additional pressure is not added. I wonder if that is why old style beers in England are lowly carbonated. Natural carbonation in the barrel, first few pours are foamy and then an equilibrium exists and since the tap is near the bottom of the keg beer flows, but not much carbonation. After time, that is the norm. After much time that is what makes the beer good. To style Now a days with force carbonation you'd have to carbonate to a low PSI to duplicate.

That's what I think anyway.

 

[Leadgolem]

What he said.

 

[Dan]

LG

I'm at my daughter's place today, drove up yesterday. She moved up here, Monterey for college. It's nice here, close to the ocean and the air is cool and clean. We refinished a wooden dining room table today. Dad and daughter building something together, making memories, nice father daughter project. I live for these days, or should say, days like this keep me alive. (whoa-melodrama Dan!)
Need to apply a few more coats of polyurethane finish but I have to leave tomorrow mid-day. Life is way to short

 

[brewingmeister]

Don't rush those coats of poly.

 

[Dan]

Don't rush those coats of poly.

That's good advice and because the air teperature (we applied the poly outside) is at the lower limits, the recommended six hours between coats is more likely going to be 12. I really need a few more days. I figure we'll hit it with some quad 0 steel wool tomorrow before she leaves for school and then apply a second coat. There will be plenty left in the can, thinking I'll add a few more coats next time I'm here around T-day. Should be okay to do that. I'll slightly roughen the finish a little first. Funny thing is, this table is 14 years old but when we're finished with it will look and hold up better than new. I love wood!

 

[Leadgolem]

That is nice about hardwood, it can sure be refinished a lot.

 

[Dan]

Yep it can. I think it's like anything else, quality material, craftsmanship, and time go a long way. Beer and brewing gear certainly fits in that category

 

[Leadgolem]

If you ever run a file server, try to remember to empty the trash on it once in a while. It's been a couple of months, and I've been doing that for like an hour.

 

[Dan]

Take out your trash and do dishes daily. The more often you do the less the hassle. Otherwise that crap becomes overwhelming.

 

[BrerRabbitBrew]

Wise words there Dan.

 

[Dan]

Good night HBT...

 

[BobbiLynn]

It seems like late night to me but I see it's not even 5 PM. Long day. Thanks so much to all who sent "good vibes". Leaving to see my kids at college this week and next week will be hubby recovering from surgery. Back to "nurse mode". I've started a batch of hard lemonade and a batch of hard apple cider. Lemonade for difficult days, and apple for difficult evenings.

 

[lschiavo]

If you ever run a file server, try to remember to empty the trash on it once in a while. It's been a couple of months, and I've been doing that for like an hour.

You're IT? It all makes sense now. Do you know Homer?

 

[Leadgolem]

It seems like late night to me but I see it's not even 5 PM. Long day. Thanks so much to all who sent "good vibes". Leaving to see my kids at college this week and next week will be hubby recovering from surgery. Back to "nurse mode". I've started a batch of hard lemonade and a batch of hard apple cider. Lemonade for difficult days, and apple for difficult evenings.

So, when's the bottle of whiskey for?

It seems rather late to me too. I am not used to getting up at 5:30 am. Something about getting up before the sun does seems wrong to me...

 

[Leadgolem]

You're IT? It all makes sense now. Do you know Homer?

I'm the families IT. Not professionally. That means I'm the only one who understood how useful a high capacity network drive would be. That's the file server I'm talking about. I'm not familiar with Homer, either connect or admin. Though I do know what it is.

My new job title is "Operations Analyst". Which breaks down to doing work that computers are either terrible at, or that would be very complicated to automate. With a double shot of, "whatever we need done right now".

I am pretty nerdy though. I'm using Fedora 17 right now for instance. I'm also the only person I know of that has a HDD in my PS2... So, yeah.

 

[Leadgolem]

My sugar free orange stuff is carbonated. Yeah, I need to get longer serving lines. By a lot. I knew that, but I didn't realize quite how bad it would be. I get paid Friday, so I'll order some then. The existing line is 5' of 3/16 ID. I'm thinking 20' would be about right.

EDIT: A nice bonus is that I could sit on my couch and fill my glass. As long as I didn't mind leaving the keezer lid cracked or warm lines anyway.

 

[BobbiLynn]

So, when's the bottle of whiskey for?

I don't even remember mentioning the bottle of whiskey hidden in my jacket pocket. That's for a rainy day.

 

[Thunder_Chicken]

Raise your hand if you tried to learn to play this on a keyboard back in the 80s:

 

[lschiavo]

I failed at that...thankfully.

I did learn this on guitar though:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=J-tvJcTPxHc

 

[Stauffbier]

I failed at that...thankfully.

I did learn this on guitar though:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=J-tvJcTPxHc

HA! I played this pretty good!

 

[snaps10]

Raise your hand if you tried to learn to play this on a keyboard back in the 80s: Video Link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IqG1l4lScsg

Tried? Tried?

I mastered that $%#+. I could even play it on the touch tone back then.