I have brewed about 10 batches of beer, last two were tangy.

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BausFight

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Hello!

I have brewed a decent amount of successful 5 gallon batches from various kits that all tasted good, some great, some incredible! The last two have had a bit of a tangy taste to them and I'm not sure why.

Generally I let it ferment in the primary about a week or two (maybe a few days more on some beers). We then bottle and let it go for about 2-3 weeks. I crack a couple open after 1 week one to try them. Usually consistently great beer after the 2 week mark.

The last few batches, a pumpkin ale and a porter, both had tangy flavors (the pumpkin much more so). I tested the porter before bottling and it was great. The tangy-ness came after bottle conditioning, noticeable after week 1 and week 2. It's not terrible, but definitely not ideal and not something I would share with friends or family. The pumpkin ale never got better after over a month. The porter... not sure yet, but at week two the tangy-ness is alive and well.

My question is... what can I do to prevent this? I'm fermenting an IPA right now, and man... if it's tangy, that will be a real demotivator. We are very vigilant with sanitizing, so that seems unlikely. Is it from bottling?

Here's the big difference between my previous batches and these two:

New House (still in the same area)
Water is rainwater, filtered through RO, carbon filter, then sanitized by boiling (for these two batches).
Previous water was a community well that went through a treatment plant (high chlorine).

Thoughts?
 
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If your sanitization is up to par, I wonder if it could be temperature related? Have any conditions during fermentation been altered? I have been diving into the conditions I provide during fermentation and ways on how I can improve them.

Only other thing I could think of with my limited knowledge would be the freshness of ingredients. Is everything fresh/ stored correctly? Ingredients that are past their prime, such as liquid malt extract can through some off flavors.

Let us know. I am curious to learn what may be causing it as well.
 
Sounds like a potential sanitation issue with your bottling equipment. Tell us about your equipment and cleaning/sanitizing process. Is it a bottling bucket, and if so, how do you clean it each time (be very specific with agents and processes)? Do you use a bottling wand? If so, how do you clean the tip contraption? How are you cleaning and preparing your bottles?
 
Thanks for the replies!

@THESULLI Ingredients were new kits, ordered off Amazon. I would say that it might be slightly warmer by a 2-3 degrees than previous house. Ambient room temp is kept at 69-71 F (small room with its own A/C).

Sanitization procedure:

Carboy: Hot rinse and wash, then use no rinse sanitizer.

Bottling wand, siphon, and tube: Goes through dishwasher, then gets no rinse sanitizer. Sanitizer gets rinsed through everything, including wand - hold tip in to let it flow through.

Bottling bucket: Hot rinse and wash, then swirl sanitzer, let it flow through spigot.

Bottles (used new ones this time: plastic): Dishwasher, then each is soaked in no rinse sanitizer, then flipped over to drain. Also used a few glass growlers, also new, same procedure. Beer taste the same in both.

One thing I did notice was this last batch, the fermentation process in the carboy was extremely active and it blew the airlock off twice lol. First time I've seen that!

Beer seems great before bottling, which is what is throwing me off.

Thanks for the help!
 
Does the inside of a bottle get thoroughly cleaned through a 1/2” opening when it goes into a dishwasher? Just saying, there’s probably more effective ways to clean inside a dirty bottle. But, if they were new bottles this time, then probably not the issue. When you say hot rinse and wash, what agent are you using and are you scrubbing any plastic surfaces?
 
Did you take apart the plunger on the wand and get the gunk off the spring? also the bucket valve comes apart. If your IPA comes out clean, I would suspect that the darker beers have a much lower pH which causes tartness without any other flaws.
 
When you say "kit" are you talking about a can like a Coopers Blonde? The kits in question you have made before?

There are a variety of "kit" types. All grain, pre - hopped canned kits, like the Cooper's, partial mash extract kits, all extract kits that require a boil.

I'm not going to knock a well made kit but knowing exactly what you're making would help.
 
... including wand - hold tip in to let it flow through. ...

I find that, occasionally, gunk will get stuck in the spring of the bottling wand.

After each use, I disassemble and clean the auto-siphon and bottling wand, let them air dry, and store disassembled. On bottling day, the parts are sanitized, then assembled while wet.
 
I don’t think hose in dishwasher and then sanitized is optimal. You really need to be pumping hot PBW/Oxy Clean through that hose immediately after every use. I actually do same immediately before every use.

I think you’re putting to much faith in your no rinse sanitizer step. Sanitizing equipment before storage is fine but it’s way more important to get everything really clean before storing. Most of the benefit of sanitizer is when used immediately before the equip touches your next batch.
 
Hmm... you say you only ferment it for a week? Or maybe a couple days after that then bottle?
I don't know how you are not getting bottle bombs bottling that early. And the beer would indeed be tangy - also known as green beer. It isn't "ripe" yet.
Unless I am misunderstanding your post?
 
Thanks for all the replies!

My take away here is just to double check on sanitizing the bottling wand. It's the only part of the equation that could contaminate as I have never disassembled it to clean it. Everything gets thoroughly cleaned, soaked-sanitized, but the spring in there might be housing something I don't see.

I also suspect what @hottpeper13 says about the tangy flavors coming from the dark malts. Our water profile is likely seriously lacking, being RO purified rainwater.

@dwhite60 Most kits are Brewer's Best kits, tho the other tangy beer was a Boomchugalug kit.

@iamwhatiseem Haven't had any bottle bombs, ever. Only incident I have ever had was a growler crack, but that isn't exactly uncommon trying to carb in one.

Thanks again everyone!
 
If you're using RO water for dark beers you might want to try cold steeping the dark grains overnite then adding the liquid to the boil kettle after the main wort is run into it. Just make sure to add enough salts in the main mash to get a min of 50 ppm Ca. and I like dark beers that are mashed at a higher pH, around 5.5, they seem to be drinkable sooner.
 
Thanks @hottpeper13!

Slight update: Disassembled bottling wand. There was no gunk in it and it was actually very clean. Considering it is cleaned and sanitized after every use, then cleaned and soaked and run through with more sanitizer again before use (as is all our equipment), I'm starting to lean more and more with water profile here than contamination. The beer just isn't off that much either. It's a tangy taste, not really sour. But I've certainly made better beer!

Thanks again to everyone that replied to help me out. Very appreciated!
 
Bottling with corn sugar? You might try priming with LME instead and see if there is any difference. Just a thought.

BTW, I used 1 and 1/4 C. of LME when I used to use it for priming. That as opposed to the 3/4 C. of corn sugar.

I also used to sanitize my bottling bucket by using a solution of one Tbsp. of unscented bleach per gallon of water and then rinsing it before use. That as long as the tap water is decent enough. I have never been much of a fan of "no rinse". But each to his own I guess.
 
There’s no way that the items you have mentioned that are being put in the dishwasher are coming out clean. As mentioned above I would run hot cleaner through your lines and bottles, scrub the bottles in necessary with a brush, then sanitize. Likely the problem, especially since your saying it was the last two batches/ two different kits.
 
I always used my solution of one Tbsp. of unscented bleach per gallon of water to sanitize my bottles. Let them soak for 30 minutes then rinse them with a bottle washer and leave them upside down to dry. At that point I store them in a box upside down with clean paper towels on the bottom. Seal the top of the box off with newspaper and duct tape until bottling time....

Always worked well for me.
 
Thanks @hottpeper13!

Slight update: Disassembled bottling wand. There was no gunk in it and it was actually very clean. Considering it is cleaned and sanitized after every use, then cleaned and soaked and run through with more sanitizer again before use (as is all our equipment), I'm starting to lean more and more with water profile here than contamination. The beer just isn't off that much either. It's a tangy taste, not really sour. But I've certainly made better beer!

Thanks again to everyone that replied to help me out. Very appreciated!
Take another look at the protruding tip of your bottling wand, the small piece that the spring pushed down on. That little black part has a very small black oring on it that is easy to miss. Take that off and clean underneath it. I had a string of diastaticus infected batches that would lead to gushers, finally tracked it down to that tiny little oring. Haven't had any issues since then. I wish they would mold that part in white or clear so that the black oring is visible.
 
I'm starting to lean more and more with water profile here than contamination. The beer just isn't off that much either. It's a tangy taste, not really sour. But I've certainly made better beer!

Thanks again to everyone that replied to help me out. Very appreciated!


Just confirming...you’re brewing all-grain kits where you are mashing all the grain...no extract.....correct?
 
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