How to keep Trub out of the fermenter

[Big Monk]

Not everything they do even involves bad habits or shortcuts. And just because an experiment isn’t scientifically sound doesn’t mean it isn’t valuable info.

I hear just as many brewers dismiss Brulosophy because it disagrees with how they do something- even if they’re just doing it because a book they read in 1985 said to. I have also met the “I do it this way and make great beer” guys - and in fact they don’t make great beer, it is just Ok and an open mind to different ideas than what they’ve always done could make it better.

Short and shoddy?

What self respecting person in any hobby would openly promote something like that?

It’s their whole ethos distilled into a three word mission statement.

 

[TechFanMD]

Short and shoddy?

What self respecting person in any hobby would openly promote something like that?

It’s their whole ethos distilled into a three word mission statement.

Short and shoddy is only one of the things they do....and considering many people leave the hobby because they don’t have time to dedicate 4-6hrs for a brew day I applaud them for showing methods that can cut back on some of the time. Many of the methods they use are well regarded on HBT as well (shorter mashes, shorter boil times).

But again- that’s only one piece of what they do (though I don’t like the name they use for it)

A front page article on HBT is about how to brew in an hour or less.....and magazines have been increasingly having articles surrounding this idea.

 

[Big Monk]

Short and shoddy is only one of the things they do....and considering many people leave the hobby because they don’t have time to dedicate 4-6hrs for a brew day I applaud them for showing methods that can cut back on some of the time. Many of the methods they use are well regarded on HBT as well (shorter mashes, shorter boil times).

But again- that’s only one piece of what they do (though I don’t like the name they use for it)

A front page article on HBT is about how to brew in an hour or less.....and magazines have been increasingly having articles surrounding this idea.

I’m of the opinion that if you don’t have the time to devote to making exceptional beer than you shouldn’t.

When I can’t brew I buy. I certainly don’t look for shortcuts to scratch an itch better served by purchasing beer of exceedingly exceptional quality with regards to what I can brew myself.

Brulosophy and anyone following what they are doing are bass-ackwards. They are often touted as being some sort of role models for brewers when all they are doing pimping themselves out and peddling absolute rubbish to people who don’t know any better.

Can you tell I’m biased?

 

[Qhrumphf]

I mean, there's something to be said to calm the newbie "oh no I did XYZ is my beer ruined?"

But small things add up, and I too am in the camp of "if you're not gonna make the best you can with the gear at your disposal then don't bother".

 

[TechFanMD]

I’m of the opinion that if you don’t have the time to devote to making exceptional beer than you shouldn’t.

When I can’t brew I buy. I certainly don’t look for shortcuts to scratch an itch better served by purchasing beer of exceedingly exceptional quality with regards to what I can brew myself.

Brulosophy and anyone following what they are doing are bass-ackwards. They are often touted as being some sort of role models for brewers when all they are doing pimping themselves out and peddling absolute rubbish to people who don’t know any better.

Can you tell I’m biased?

Wow. That is a very elitist attitude. You can brew anyway you want....and so can anyone else. To say that other people shouldn’t do it if they don’t have time to get really really good at it and make exceptional beer is rude and diminishes the idea of it being a hobby to be enjoyed.

Imagine telling kids not to play a sport if they aren’t going to be expert at it, or going to college unless they can be top in their field. I should quit golf because I’ll never break par.

I make good beer, but I look for ways to cut the time it takes because I’m also a good father, a good citizen involved in the community, and have a job. I’ll never be as good at brewing as you - because apparently time is the secret ingredient to enjoying the hobby and to making beer that’s better than you buy.

You know better than all of the guys at Brulosphy combined. It is obvious. Tell us more.

 

[Goowa]

I believe this thread was how to keep trub out of the fermenter.

 

[WBB]

I was checking out strainers. And I saw this one which looked interesting. It’s used for beekeepers, but it looks like it would fit perfect over wide opening fermenters like the anvil.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00EHIWX1K/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

 

[Qhrumphf]

"I don't intend to hijack the thread......

.....Brulosophy"

WHAT COULD POSSIBLY GO WRONG.

Hey, could bring LODO into it.



Have any homebrew scale equipment suppliers started making kettles with trub walls yet? Whirlpool arms definitely. Trub walls are the final frontier.

 

[Big Monk]

I believe this thread was how to keep trub out of the fermenter.

 

[Big Monk]

You want to keep trub out of the fermenter?

Use Brewtan B in the mash, use a BIAB bag as a filter (don’t pull bag, just drain into kettle), in general put clear beer into the kettle, Whirlpool well, use whirlfloc, let break settle while chilling (up to 30-60 minutes after chilled), and drain clear beer into fermenter.

 

[Big Monk]

Wow. That is a very elitist attitude. You can brew anyway you want....and so can anyone else. To say that other people shouldn’t do it if they don’t have time to get really really good at it and make exceptional beer is rude and diminishes the idea of it being a hobby to be enjoyed.

Imagine telling kids not to play a sport if they aren’t going to be expert at it, or going to college unless they can be top in their field. I should quit gold because I’ll never break par.

I make good beer, but I look for ways to cut the time it takes because I’m also a good father, a good citizen involved in the community, and have a job. I’ll never be as good at brewing as you - because apparently time is the secret ingredient to enjoying the hobby and to making beer that’s better than you buy.

You know better than all of the guys at Brulosphy combined. It is obvious. Tell us more.

I came on a bit strong and I apologize. I recognize how tough it is to allocate time for brewing. I go through the same thing trying do be a good dad, engineer, and husband.

I’m averse to Brulosophy and everything they stand for but that’s not good enough reason to antagonize people on the forums.

 

[Rob2010SS]

"I don't intend to hijack the thread......

.....Brulosophy"

WHAT COULD POSSIBLY GO WRONG.

Hey, could bring LODO into it.



Have any homebrew scale equipment suppliers started making kettles with trub walls yet? Whirlpool arms definitely. Trub walls are the final frontier.

My mistake! Sorry lol

 

[z-bob]

I alway read and see people not using hop bags for boiling/whirlpool pellet hop additions. I hear you get better hop utilization without using hop bags. I have never tried adding the pellets directly to my wort of my electric kettle. what’s the best practice to keep the Trub out of your fermenter. I have a whirlpool arm from brewhardware.com and a solar water pump, The small tan one some people on here use. How or what methods work best. I want to know how you do it correctly so I don’t mess up my batch.

As you can see from the arguing, there's not a correct way, there may not even be a best way. Here's what I've started doing: When the wort comes to a boil, I skim off and discard the foam at the top. When I add the hops, I just throw them in the kettle (I used to use a hops spider or a sock). I do the initial fermentation in a bucket, and I line it with a paint strainer bag before I transfer the wort into it. Lift out the bag and drain it, squeeze the hops and hot/cold break matter to recover most of the wort. After all that I still get some trub in the fermenter, but I've eliminated a lot of it and I don't worry about what's left. When the fermentation slows down, I transfer the beer to a carboy to finish, that eliminates the rest of the trub. I end up with reasonably clean yeast at the bottom of the carboy when the beer clears. It still has a little hops and protein break, but very little.

Using a separate fermentor for a primary is an unnecessary step, but it make it easy to harvest the krausen for yeasts that are top-croppable.

 

[doug293cz]

Ok, the detour into a Brulosophy debate was interesting, but thankfully it seems to have run its course. Please carry on with the "to trub, or not to trub" discussion. Any further discussion about Brulosophy in this thread (other than a simple reference) will be deleted as being off topic.

doug293cz
HBT Moderator

 

[Big Monk]

Here’s

I alway read and see people not using hop bags for boiling/whirlpool pellet hop additions. I hear you get better hop utilization without using hop bags. I have never tried adding the pellets directly to my wort of my electric kettle. what’s the best practice to keep the Trub out of your fermenter. I have a whirlpool arm from brewhardware.com and a solar water pump, The small tan one some people on here use. How or what methods work best. I want to know how you do it correctly so I don’t mess up my batch.

Here is just one reasonable, low cost method for clear beer into the fermenter:

1.) Use a BIAB bag as a faux mash filter. Just mash in the bag but don’t pull it like the BIABers do. Drain the wort into the kettle with the bag in place. A more advanced technique that could benefit you greatly would be to recirculate with you tan pump throughout the mash and rest the bag on some sort of an elevated false bottom. This will help greatly with conversion and wort clarity.

2.) Use Brewtan B in the mash.

3.) Use Whirlfloc.

4.) As you chill, use your pump to get a good whirlpool going so you get all the kettle trub in a nice cone.

5.) Once chilled, allow the wort to settle for 30-60 minutes.

6.) Rack carefully off the cone without disturbing it and into the fermenter.

 

[Wagon_6]

Wow. Not sure OP will ever come back but I’ve been battling with the hop spider option on a new build. I’ve used a hop spider mostly and loved the convenience. But the new steam slayer tech had me rethink it since they’re usually hooked to the side and the kettle top can’t seal. I’m going to start chucking hops in and see where it takes me.

You can’t go wrong, brew some batches and see what works, what annoys you, and if you’re happy with your beer. As others have mentioned, you may want a stronger pump for the whirlpool.

 

[SanPancho]

I think one of the biggest issues for homebrewers is the inability to get a good whirlpool like in professional gear. Go hard for 10, settle for 15 and knockout. By the bottom of the kettle you can see a literal cone of trub.

At home? I stir and stir but it s not the same. The hops will be left in the center, but the fluffy pillowy trub is just spread out all over the bottom.

Having gear professionally designed for the right size/shape, tangential inlet, properly designed pump with correct flow rate, etc. is just so far beyond homebrew gear its silly.

I do small batches. I hate trub simply for reasons of volume loss. But i dont know ill ever have a great solution at home.

 

[Big Monk]

I think one of the biggest issues for homebrewers is the inability to get a good whirlpool like in professional gear. Go hard for 10, settle for 15 and knockout. By the bottom of the kettle you can see a literal cone of trub.

At home? I stir and stir but it s not the same. The hops will be left in the center, but the fluffy pillowy trub is just spread out all over the bottom.

Having gear professionally designed for the right size/shape, tangential inlet, properly designed pump with correct flow rate, etc. is just so far beyond homebrew gear its silly.

I do small batches. I hate trub simply for reasons of volume loss. But i dont know ill ever have a great solution at home.

Try letting the chilled wort sit for 30-60 minutes before racking off and pitching. That typically allows the finer stuff to settle out as well.

 

[SanPancho]

I let it sit, always. And It settles, but it doesn’t really compact like hop sludge does. Still says somewhat fluffy and easily disturbed. Given the smaller batch sizes a 1/2 to 3/4 gal loss in kettle is a bit painful. I drink for free, but seeing that loss still hurts.

 

[bornandraisedlv]

Nothing new here but I have been using a plastic mash paddle that I’ve attached to my drill. Once I hit about 80° I get as good of a whirlpool as I can with that mash paddle with the goal being the vortex reaching the bottom of the kettle. I then let that sit for about 30 mins and drain to my catalyst fermenter.

I use secondary method unique to the catalyst that helps remove pretty much the rest of the trub before I pitch yeast.

 

[Big Monk]

I let it sit, always. And It settles, but it doesn’t really compact like hop sludge does. Still says somewhat fluffy and easily disturbed. Given the smaller batch sizes a 1/2 to 3/4 gal loss in kettle is a bit painful. I drink for free, but seeing that loss still hurts.

Right. I’m a former (likely to be soon again) 1.25 gallon brewer. I feel your pain.

 

[xenon2000]

Have any homebrew scale equipment suppliers started making kettles with trub walls yet? Whirlpool arms definitely. Trub walls are the final frontier.


The latest SS kettles have a trub dam attachment included now. Could make a bit of a difference I guess ...

 

[schematix]

Have any homebrew scale equipment suppliers started making kettles with trub walls yet? Whirlpool arms definitely. Trub walls are the final frontier.

I completely disagree. They are a form of filter, and filters clog, ultimately leading them to fail.

Filters are not effective in brewing except for finished beer.

The holy grail IMO is a home brew scale centrifuge.

 

[Dland]

what’s the best practice to keep the Trub out of your fermenter.

What I do is gravity feed from BK to my cleaned out mash tun, which acts as hop back. If I want post boil hops, I let wort gravity feed feed though leaf hops in hop screen, or spider. I use to use leaf hops loose, then with bag, but the screen chamber is easier.

The gravity feed, vs pumping, does not pull any break trub or boil hops though screen tube at bottom of BK. Wort going out to cooler is almost completely free of trub or hops debris. This step adds a half hour or so, but is a good time for post whirlpool hops, at whatever temp you want to let wort down form BK to "hop back"

 

[Qhrumphf]

I completely disagree. They are a form of filter, and filters clog, ultimately leading them to fail.

Filters are not effective in brewing except for finished beer.

The holy grail IMO is a home brew scale centrifuge.

How is a trub wall/dam a filter? I mean in the most rudimentary sense, sure, it helps hold the cone back as you get to the bottom of the kettle, but it doesn't filter any thing. And it doesn't always stop it all. But it's a literal wall of metal. It can't clog.

They make a WORLD of difference.

And with finished beer, that's where I'd rather have a centrifuge than a filter. Faster. More sanitary. Almost as effective. And less detrimental to flavor.

 

[Goowa]

How is a trub wall/dam a filter? I mean in the most rudimentary sense, sure, it helps hold the cone back as you get to the bottom of the kettle, but it doesn't filter any thing. And it doesn't always stop it all. But it's a literal wall of metal. It can't clog.

They make a WORLD of difference.

And with finished beer, that's where I'd rather have a centrifuge than a filter. Faster. More sanitary. Almost as effective. And less detrimental to flavor.

You're talking about the patented SSBrewtech trub dam, amirite?

 

[Qhrumphf]

You're talking about the patented SSBrewtech trub dam, amirite?

Negative. I'm talking about something that's been an integral feature of most professional kettles for a long time, but I've never seen in a homebrew kettle. Happy to hear SSBT is putting them in now.

 

[Soulshine2]

I’m of the opinion that if you don’t have the time to devote to making exceptional beer than you shouldn’t.

When I can’t brew I buy. I certainly don’t look for shortcuts to scratch an itch better served by purchasing beer of exceedingly exceptional quality with regards to what I can brew myself.

Brulosophy and anyone following what they are doing are bass-ackwards. They are often touted as being some sort of role models for brewers when all they are doing pimping themselves out and peddling absolute rubbish to people who don’t know any better.

Can you tell I’m biased?

I can certainly agree with you in this post, and it actually applies to a lot of things , not just brewing. Look at YouTube and a ton of DIY videos...we've all seen the garage hacks, life hacks,even tv shows that show a team flipping a run down house in a week, etc...Somebody took a shortcut and GOT BY with their result . If you dig just past the surface, they left out a few steps to do it correctly (safely) and passed it off as the way to do it onto someone "that doesnt know any better" .

 

[Soulshine2]

I was checking out strainers. And I saw this one which looked interesting. It’s used for beekeepers, but it looks like it would fit perfect over wide opening fermenters like the anvil.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00EHIWX1K/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

why not just buy a simple cooking strainer from the housewares dept .Same purpose, way less cost.

 

[Vale71]

Unfortunately the SS Brewtech "trub dam" as they refer to it is neither patentented (you can buy it from the Chinese manufacturer on Ali) nor effective. It's way too small and, especially with the larger kettles (it's a one-size-fits-all which is just plain silly), you'll have trub sliding through from above and from the sides. It's a 10 for effort but a 2 for execution at best...
That's based on my experience using a 15 gal BrewKettle with tangential inlet as a whirlpool.