Saison How Rye I Am (Rye Saison) - 2011 - 1st Place Best of Show - HBT Comp

Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum

Help Support Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
What SRM are you at using Turbinado?

I want to make this one, and would like to use turbinado instead. But I want that darker color. What should I add to get it to ~19 SRM? I was thinking a tiny tiny bit of Carafa III (2 oz) that hopefully at that small amount wont add any roastiness? Any suggestions? Thanks
 
3oz would be 1.93%. Small enough to where I doubt it would have any flavor contributions.


I also just thought about maybe grinding up the grain (and maybe decreasing to like 2 oz) and adding it at the end of the mash to get a bunch of color out of it
 
I am planning on brewing this on Friday. Got my yeast from LHBS today and have a starter going on the stir plate. Couple questions:
1.Do you add rock sugar to boil or to primary?
2.If adding to primary do you boil it first to dissolve it?
3.How long did you leave in primary?
4.What was the brewhouse efficiency?
Thanks....sounds great. Can't wait to taste this one.
 
1.Do you add rock sugar to boil or to primary?
2.If adding to primary do you boil it first to dissolve it?
3.How long did you leave in primary?
4.What was the brewhouse efficiency?
Thanks....sounds great. Can't wait to taste this one.

I'd also love answers to 1, 2, and 4. I have some time to wait since I need to order the yeast. This would be my first saison so I'd like to have as much info to go on as possible come brew day.
 
Some recommend incremental feeding of simple sugars to yeast while it is fermenting in primary.

On the other hand, many commercial breweries add sugar to the boil with no problems.

From what I can tell this yeast will do just fine if you add the sugar to the last 5-10 minutes of the boil to dissolve it and save yourself the hassle of adding to the primary.

If you do add to primary, you should dissolve the sugar (if it's crystalline) in a small quantity of water, boil it for about 10 minutes, cool it to about room temp, and add that to the fermenter.

I am going to be using honey for mine...1 lb. at the beginning of the boil to create more flavor and color compounds, and 1 lb. at flame-out to preserve the aroma of the honey.

Leave it in the primary fermenter for about 4 weeks to allow the yeast to ferment and clean up.
 
1- Added to boil
2- If you want to add to primary "orangehero" explained the process perfectly
3- 5 weeks @ 71*
4- Recipe was planned for 75%, we ended up at 70% though. Too many outside factors that day :) We lautered a bit too fast on this one.

I am planning on brewing this on Friday. Got my yeast from LHBS today and have a starter going on the stir plate. Couple questions:
1.Do you add rock sugar to boil or to primary?
2.If adding to primary do you boil it first to dissolve it?
3.How long did you leave in primary?
4.What was the brewhouse efficiency?
Thanks....sounds great. Can't wait to taste this one.
 
This is what I am planning for my Monday brew, please add comments:
5.5 gal batch
9 lb Pilsner
3 lb Rye Malt
.33 lb Rice Hulls
1.8 oz Fuggles (60 min remaining)
.8 lb Amber Candi Sugar
3711 yeast with starter
Mash at 151

I saw a reference to Oats, is that needed,

Sheldon
 
I brewed 10 gallons of this yesterday and used:
14 Pilsner
5 Rye
1 Rice Hull
1.75 Dark Candi Sugar
4 oz Willamette 3.4%
tasted great....hit 1.057....and it took off within 3 hours of adding yeast. It going crazy today at 74 degrees. Smells great.
 
Brewed this puppy today. Had a great brewday. Ended up getting better than average efficiency and got 1.064. Only change I made was rounding up the candi sugar to a full pound , and substituted magnum at 24 ibu's for the 60 minute.
 
brewed on 5/30 at 1.058 using 3711. Transferred to secondary today at 1.010, didn't want it to get too low. Sample tasted really good. Can't wait to bottle and enjoy
 
I split the 10 gallon batch with WL565 & WY 3711. After 12 days and heat blankets for the last 7 days to get it 78* or 80+*, my batch with WLP 565 got down to 1.004. It tastes pretty good but needs more time [fusel-ely].

I did not gravity check or taste the 3711 (too lazy to get out siphon; # 565 was in a bucket w/ spigot).
 
Curious to see how they both turn out! You fermented a lot higher than we did with the 3711 - that might give you a bit more of a fusel flavor too.



I split the 10 gallon batch with WL565 & WY 3711. After 12 days and heat blankets for the last 7 days to get it 78* or 80+*, my batch with WLP 565 got down to 1.004. It tastes pretty good but needs more time [fusel-ely].

I did not gravity check or taste the 3711 (too lazy to get out siphon; # 565 was in a bucket w/ spigot).
 
Curious to see how they both turn out! You fermented a lot higher than we did with the 3711 - that might give you a bit more of a fusel flavor too.

Usurpers26- totally. My brew partner wanted to crank the heat up to 80* to get some "peppery" taste which he said didn't take hold until 80*. I have never fermented anything that hot.
I see now that you fermented at 71*. How did you decide the beer needed 5 weeks in primary?
 
Brewin' this one now(or something close)
5.5 gallon
9# pills
3.25# rye
0.5# flaked rye.
1# turbinado
1.5oz. styrian golding 4.5%AA 60 mins.
3711 wyeast.
Second saison in a row, I brew a wheat, pills, Cascade last week that went from 1.056 to 1.000 in 6 days at 72° (with out simple suger). With 3711 I have good results chilling to 64° and letting it free rise to the mid 70s, wyeast recommends a slightly cooler temp. for this yeast vs. other strains.
I'll keep you posted on how this one frements out.
I love rye, I love a good saison; this recipe is simply brilliant.
Thanks for the inspiration!
 
At 72F it came out plenty peppery and citrusy.

userpers, did you experience this yeast taking a while to finish fermenting?
 
It kept dropping in gravity. Would have to check the notes but I don't think it hit 1.004 until around the 3rd week. Once the gravity stays flat, we like to give it a week or so to clean up after itself.

@Orangehero - this kind of answers your question too :)

How did you decide the beer needed 5 weeks in primary?
 
Just ordered the grain bill, and will be brewing this soon. Looks very interesting.

I always try to make a beer I can't buy, and this seems to fit that profile.
 
Brewed this on Friday

9 lbs pilsner
4 lbs rye
1 oz Stiryan goldings first wort hop
1 oz Stiryan goldings 60 min
1 oz Stiryan goldings @ flame out
1 lb D-180 in fermenter
2 L starter 3711

Mashed at 148 for 90 min
90 min boil
Og 1.066 with 5.5 gallons in fermenter

Needed blow off tube after 4 hours

The taste of the pils and rye is amazing. Rye is now my secret grain for all recipes!
 
I brewed this on May 2nd and it's just starting to carb now. I'll post some photos tomorrow. I'm wondering if the original poster can offer some tasting notes. I'm not exactly sure what to expect from this beer but my initial comment is it seems very well-balanced. I'm not getting explosive flavors of citrus although citrus is there. It's my first rye beer so I'm not exactly sure what to expect from the rye. One other note, I used jaggery instead of candi sugar.
 
The citrus won't be explosive. It has nice citrus notes throughout - the initial aroma is a mix of citrus, spice and that unique saison-yeasty aroma.

Rye is by far one of my favorites. The rye and the WY3711 pair up perfectly in this beer and to some extent the yeast profile masks the extremely high amount of rye that we used. Or as you put it, it is very well balanced.

The rye will usually lend itself to giving a sharp, somewhat spicy flavor up front. But then it blends pretty quickly with the yeast profile into that smooth, creamy (mouthfeel), slightly sweet and citrusy middle, finally finishing nice and dry like a saison should :)

If you really want to notice the rye, pour out a "normal" saison/farmhouse and you will notice how delicate the flavor is compared to this one.


I brewed this on May 2nd and it's just starting to carb now. I'll post some photos tomorrow. I'm wondering if the original poster can offer some tasting notes. I'm not exactly sure what to expect from this beer but my initial comment is it seems very well-balanced. I'm not getting explosive flavors of citrus although citrus is there. It's my first rye beer so I'm not exactly sure what to expect from the rye. One other note, I used jaggery instead of candi sugar.
 
Think it would be a problem to not have a starter on a 5 gallon batch? I want to brew it tomorrow...
 
^^^ Thanks usurpers26 ^^^

I appreciate the detailed response. This beer is so well-balanced and drinkable. I made your recipe and aside from changing the candi sugar to jaggery, everything was right on — even the numbers. But there was one thing... I dumped the wort onto a previously used 3711 yeast cake. Here's a photo of How Rye I Am:

20110616_howRyeIAm.jpg


Your recipe used a second generation 3711 yeast cake that wasn't washed or treated. The yeast cake was developed from another farmhouse ale (pale malt, flaked wheat and flaked oats with ginger, grains of paradise, and orange zest). Here's How Rye I Am next to Brewshed Ale:

20110616_howRyeIAm_brewshed.jpg


Now you know where I'm coming from. It's fun to put these two beer side-by-side. Youra is so subtlety complex and balanced while Brewshed is much more spicy, estery, and more in your face. Although the style is completely different (Belgian IIPA), the feeling I'm getting is like when one puts an Urthel Hop-It next to a L'Achouffe Houblon.
 
Well, if you go by Mr. Malty - 5 gallons of 1.058 with an 86% viable yeast (June 1st, 2011 prod date) would need ~200 billion cells (two packets).

Now will it ferment out with one packet? Most likely. You will definitely stress the yeast a lot though pitching at a 50% pitch rate.

Think it would be a problem to not have a starter on a 5 gallon batch? I want to brew it tomorrow...
 
Edit: I can see the pics fine from my iPhone. No need to repost. We actually would love to use that photo for our website if that is ok with you?

Thank you for the kind words though, glad you are enjoying the beer :mug:

^^^ Thanks usurpers26 ^^^

I appreciate the detailed response. This beer is so well-balanced and drinkable. I made your recipe and aside from changing the candi sugar to jaggery, everything was right on — even the numbers. But there was one thing... I dumped the wort onto a previously used 3711 yeast cake. Here's a photo of How Rye I Am:

20110616_howRyeIAm.jpg


Your recipe used a second generation 3711 yeast cake that wasn't washed or treated. The yeast cake was developed from another farmhouse ale (pale malt, flaked wheat and flaked oats with ginger, grains of paradise, and orange zest). Here's How Rye I Am next to Brewshed Ale:

20110616_howRyeIAm_brewshed.jpg


Now you know where I'm coming from. It's fun to put these two beer side-by-side. Youra is so subtlety complex and balanced while Brewshed is much more spicy, estery, and more in your face. Although the style is completely different (Belgian IIPA), the feeling I'm getting is like when one puts an Urthel Hop-It next to a L'Achouffe Houblon.
 
Thanks for asking. Please go right ahead. If you're giving a photo credit please use Jonathan Healey at A View Of You. I just noticed you're in Connecticut. I am too. What's your website? Do you have a homebrew club?
 
Thanks Jonathan!

Our website is:
www.stubbornbeauty.com

We are actually just beginning the process of going for our CT Brewery License.

Thanks for asking. Please go right ahead. If you're giving a photo credit please use Jonathan Healey at A View Of You. I just noticed you're in Connecticut. I am too. What's your website? Do you have a homebrew club?
 
I'm brewing this up now. Did a starter yesterday. Not sure if it worked though, I may not have boiled the dme long enough due to a boilover, and fear for my life from SWMBO...

Guess I'll find out tomorrow, and might have to make a trip to LHBS.
 
Haha- my LHBS has one packet of Wyeast3711 left and I can't get to the store until tomorrow afternoon! I wish I could call dibs!
 
Brewed something very similar to this a few weeks ago.

10 Gallons

20# Pilsner
4# Rye
3# Cane Sugar (boiled)
3 oz (10% AA) Magnum @ 60 min
4 oz (4% AA) Saaz @ flameout
(Gypsum added to harden the water to accentuate dryness)
WLP565 w/ 1.2L starter

OG 1.067. Pitched in the low 70's, and when I started detecting fermentation (quickly), I raised the temp to 86 over a few days. Let it sit in primary @ 86 for three weeks. Checked it today, and it's finished at 1.004, tastes & smells nice and peppery, and so I'm crash-cooling it to keg on Tuesday.
 
I just kegged and bottled the origianl recipe. All I can say is WOW! Best Hydro sample I've ever tasted, and my FG was 1.002. That makes it over 7.8%.
 
This recipe looks awesome! I've never done a saison, but I've definitely enjoyed the fruits of other saison-brewers' labors. I'm also intrigued by the mention of using oats, so the president of my brew club and I are going in on a 10g batch in a few weeks with the following grain bill:

15 lbs Belgian Pils
5 lbs Rye
2 lbs Flaked Oats
2 lbs Turbinado

We had to special order the 3711 as my LHBS only carries White Labs liquid yeasts. We're planning on doing two 1.5L starters.

Totally stoked to brew this!
 
Even though we did not use oats in the original recipe, the WY3711 will compliment that addition beautifully. WY3711 on its own gives the beer such a unique silky mouthfeel.

Let us know how it turns out and enjoy!

This recipe looks awesome! I've never done a saison, but I've definitely enjoyed the fruits of other saison-brewers' labors. I'm also intrigued by the mention of using oats, so the president of my brew club and I are going in on a 10g batch in a few weeks with the following grain bill:

15 lbs Belgian Pils
5 lbs Rye
2 lbs Flaked Oats
2 lbs Turbinado

We had to special order the 3711 as my LHBS only carries White Labs liquid yeasts. We're planning on doing two 1.5L starters.

Totally stoked to brew this!
 
Thanks and will do! This looks like an awesome (and surprisingly simple) recipe.

We debated on using flaked vs. oat malt - and if the desire is really only to get an increased silkiness into the saison (and it'd only be <10% of the grainbill anyway), then it seemed easier just to go the flaked route.

My buddy (the brew club pres) can't help himself from being overly creative. He's prepared to lose his mind by splitting his 5g into 3 different saisons: 2g unmodified w/3711, 2g secondary(ed) with some brett to get a sour rye saison, and 1g dryhopped with Cascade or Citra.

I'm completely fine leaving as is and letting him do all the crazy stuff.

Even though we did not use oats in the original recipe, the WY3711 will compliment that addition beautifully. WY3711 on its own gives the beer such a unique silky mouthfeel.

Let us know how it turns out and enjoy!
 
Quick question- are you calculating these IBUs based on Tinseth or Rager scale?
 
Put this in the kegerator Friday night after 5 weeks of primary and 2 weeks of keg conditioning. I'm totally loving the flavor, but the particles floating in the beer are more than I've ever had. I'm hoping that it settles out soon, otherwise it's almost undrinkable.
 
Back
Top