How Long to Grow Scoby?

[Flarn]

How much longer should I grow this scoby? It's been 6 days since I started it.

I don't want to let it go to the point of vinegar... Or should I? I'm still in the scoby growing phase.

I just need to know when I can begin the second fermentation.

 

[Corey22]

Hey Flarn,

See my post in this thread about "thin scoby's" you can wee the development from my first batch to my second.

This is perfectly fine, go as long as you want to where you want the flavor, and extract and go again. I would recommend trying to float the scoby at the top if you're worried and want it to form nice, but other than that you're fine.

 

[Flarn]

Okay I held out a little longer. This is 10 days. Keep going or use this to start my 2 gallon batch?

 

[Owly055]

The obsession with so called "scobies" is a bit absurd. The scoby as it is called is NOT a symbiotic colony of bacteria and yeast as the acronym implies, nor is it a living organism, nor does it produce kombucha, nor is it even necessary, though it's growth indicates a healthy population of acetobacter, which are what sour kombucha (and vinegar). It is a pellicle in scientific terms, which is a mat of microcellulose produced by the acetobacter as a byproduct. There is so much mythology involved in kombucha it's almost laughable. What you need is a healthy population of yeast and acetobacter to make kombucha. I tossed my "scoby" into the compost heap a few days ago. It was getting too thick to be convenient. I do continuous brew and have for years. I don't do the absurd nonsense of reverently removing the scoby and separating layers....... I don't handle it at all while making kombucha. It floats in my brew vessel, I draw kombucha from the tap, and pour sweet tea right over it, and occasionally fish it out and throw it away. I've done that from the beginning, and get good product.

H.W.

 

[Flarn]

@Owly055- That is really interesting and I've never heard it before. I'm not saying you're wrong, and I'm new to this, but everything I've read so far places a ton of weight on the importance of the scoby and it's protective role during the brewing process.

Could you please reference your source(s) for not needing a scoby?

I'm not opposed to changing my thinking on this, but I need more information.

Thanks!

 

[KombuchaJim]

Interesting...as long as you keep a good starter fluid in their, the brew will produce. That is the way people make scobys from "scratch".

How often do you throw your scoby away?

 

[Owly055]

I don't have a "reference" for this, just years of experience.... I AM the reference you might say. There are many scientific discussions on pellicles, some of which are on the net. It's important to remember that the community of kombucha producers deal in folk lore, not science, and the "authority" of most of what we read is based not on any sort of science, but on repetition. Constant repetition breeds common beliefs, the foundations of folklore, not of science.
On the average I toss my scoby every 2-3 months. I went to continuous brew because it results in a strong healthy culture, rather than starting with a small amount of starter in a lot of sweet tea, which invites other microbes to take up residence.... the PH is always low. I harvest 25-50% on about a weekly basis. I took to pouring the sweet tea right over the scoby from the very beginning. The reason being to avoid handling which was in my opinion absurd and counter productive. What better way to introduce undesirables than to remove the scoby, and handle it? It also gives the scoby a "bath" in the acidic solution as it sinks and tumbles around before refloating. This keeps the PH low enough to prevent mold growth, which has been a problem for some, but never for me. I've encouraged others to do the same when they repeatedly had mold problems, and this does correct that problem.

Hope this helps. You do it your way, I'll do it mine. I've brewed over a hundred gallons of booch, at one time supplying a local microbewery that wanted it for in house consumption of employees and owners to tamp down on constant alcohol consumption. It also has NOT proven necessary to keep the containers open and cover with a cloth. There is enough oxygen introduced when you open it weekly to serve. I've brewed a great deal in ordinary 6 gallon brew buckets without drilled lids. It is indisputable that both acetobacter and yeast need oxygen, but we get sufficient aeration without leaving the container open.

H.W.

 

[Brewer-Joe]

Owly likely has more experience then I do... I just recently started fermenting sweet tea again, after about a 15 year lull in my activity. I too am, a bit dismayed by the amount of ... well malarkey that gets spread around about Kombucha. Some would have you believe that only Kombucha brewed with a scoby that's been around for years is worthy or truly kombucha.

anyway, what I can tell you is that in recent weeks, I've made kombucha without a scoby, with a scoby, and... well... back when I first made Kombucha, some 15 years ago, I never used starter, only a fresh batch of sweet tea , and the scoby from my last batch. So, I do know , that you can make kombucha with or without a scoby. And if with a scoby, you can make it without starter...

With some second hand information, I've been told that people actually have made kombucha literally from scratch, with some sweet tea, a little yeast... a little bacteria.. wa la... Kombucha.

Meanwhile... The most silly thing I personally find... is that you have to let your 'starter' become sour enough to make you pucker , before you can make a full batch. Well that is just BS... all you need is some healthy kombucha, even some that is only a little tart.

Glad to see that some of the myths are being dispelled ... ( I hope I'm not perpetuating any, as I am not a expert in all things Kombucha, I just know that there's a lot of misinformation out there)

 

[Flarn]

Hi Owly055 and Brewer-Joe,

Thanks for your replies! Here's what I've done: I used the recipe off the "cultures for health" website to make 5 quarts of kombucha. The ratios are about half-way down the page here.

I put my starter tea and my scoby in last night. Since that time, it appears that my scoby has had explosive growth. Whereas before, it was in a small quarter inch think disc, now it's apparently unraveled and it's taking up a massive portion of the container.

I've also got little "spider webs" of yeast growing all around the scoby and just under the surface.

Three questions:

Does all of this sound/look normal to you?

How will I know when it's ready to drink?

Which portion of the liquid should I retain for the starter tea for the next batch? I've read there is a difference between the top and bottom if left unmixed? Or should I just mix it all up evenly?

Thanks in advance!

 

[Brewer-Joe]

yup, all that sounds pretty normal. How long it takes, depends on many factors, one of the biggest factors is temperature of the area you are fermenting in. But factors are related to how much yeast and bacteria were in your stater and/or scoby when you started. It's not practical to try and predict exactly how long it will take, there are just too many variables.

Short answer is typically it takes between 5 and 15 days for kombucha.. you should probably start tasting at day 5... if it tastes good to you.., well that's all that really matters. Some say that to start your next batch, you ideally want rather sour kombucha, so it may be helpful to allow your 'starter' to mature a bit beyond the point were you like the taste ( assuming you don't really like to drink anything too sour ).

I can tell you that recently I've been getting good tasting kombucha in as little as 5 days. I've been fermenting at roughly 80F, and it's typical that things move pretty quickly at that temperature... I've since lowered the temperature a little , I'm trying to keep it around 78F right now, in part just to slow it down a little, but also because I've been reading that there might be a better balance of yeast to bacteria at temperatures around 75F , vs 80F... As I understand it, yeast tends to thrive more then bacteria at higher temperatures, where bacteria sort of wins at lower temperatures.

As far as I know, the only thing you REALLY want to watch out for is mold. If you see fuzzy stuff growing on the top of your scoby/kombucha, you should throw it out. More acidic starter should help avoid mold, but cleanliness and keeping the stuff away from other food items that might mold is also a good idea.

Hi Owly055 and Brewer-Joe,

Thanks for your replies! Here's what I've done: I used the recipe off the "cultures for health" website to make 5 quarts of kombucha. The ratios are about half-way down the page here.

I put my starter tea and my scoby in last night. Since that time, it appears that my scoby has had explosive growth. Whereas before, it was in a small quarter inch think disc, now it's apparently unraveled and it's taking up a massive portion of the container.

I've also got little "spider webs" of yeast growing all around the scoby and just under the surface.

Three questions:

Does all of this sound/look normal to you?

How will I know when it's ready to drink?

Which portion of the liquid should I retain for the starter tea for the next batch? I've read there is a difference between the top and bottom if left unmixed? Or should I just mix it all up evenly?

Thanks in advance!

 

[Flarn]

Excellent advice all around, brewer joe! Thanks for the input!