How dumb are your state/province's liquor laws?

[kombat]

The only thing I can think of that comes close is strip clubs. You can have a bikini bar that serves, or a full nude club that doesn't. Usually door admission at a full nude club gets you a wrist bad good for two... cans of soda. -.-

I've heard other states have similar laws. That blows my mind.

I live across the river from Quebec, where the drinking age is 18, and all "strip clubs" are full-nude, with alcohol. There's no such thing as an "alcohol-free" strip club, or a "bikini" strip club. It's all nude, all booze.

No-touching lap dances are $10/song, or for $20, you're permitted to touch the girl (with the exception of between the legs). Lap dances can happen either at your table, or in a private cubicle in back (the "champagne rooms").

 

[thadius856]

I've heard other states have similar laws. That blows my mind.

I live across the river from Quebec, where the drinking age is 18, and all "strip clubs" are full-nude, with alcohol. There's no such thing as an "alcohol-free" strip club, or a "bikini" strip club. It's all nude, all booze.

No-touching lap dances are $10/song, or for $20, you're permitted to touch the girl (with the exception of between the legs). Lap dances can happen either at your table, or in a private cubicle in back (the "champagne rooms").

This blows my mind. All clubs I've been to are strictly a "sit on your hands" operation.

 

[OrdinaryAvgGuy]

I've heard other states have similar laws. That blows my mind.

I live across the river from Quebec, where the drinking age is 18, and all "strip clubs" are full-nude, with alcohol. There's no such thing as an "alcohol-free" strip club, or a "bikini" strip club. It's all nude, all booze.

No-touching lap dances are $10/song, or for $20, you're permitted to touch the girl (with the exception of between the legs). Lap dances can happen either at your table, or in a private cubicle in back (the "champagne rooms").

Where I'm from any touching will result in being promptly escorted out the door by some guy named big Ed who has more muscle than brains. The worst part is we still pay $20. $10 would be a deal for a lap dance!

 

[454k30]

My Navy career has brought me through a couple states. In Colorado the only thing you could buy in the grocery store was 3.2%, and it seemed to me like you could only get the big 3 (miller, bud, coors). To get real beer and anything else you had to go to a liquor store. I believe those are all independently owned.

Washington state finally changed their archaic rules, which someone already mentioned. Taxes on hard liquor are high though; something like 25%.

I just got into Maryland so this what I know so far. You can only buy from liquor stores, except some grocery stores which have a liquor store inside of them; those are treated like seperate stores though so you have to make a seperate purchase at a different counter. Liquor stores are really well stocked but they all seem to have the exact same selection.

We have been lucky though as I can always go on base and buy tax free hooch at competitive prices, even on Sunday. Our package stores (class 6) even carry some really good beer, wine and booze. The selection is really determined by whomever is in charge of that particular class 6.

 

[Texastrooper]

In Texas we have the usual annoying dry (no alcohol), semi dry (beer and wine) and wet areas (everything including liquor). Up to this day and after 12 years in Texas I still have not understood how it exactly works.... lol
Plus no alcohol sales on Sunday before noon. No open container in the car but then we have drive through liquor stores.....
And then there are these stupid laws for breweries and brew pubs. Breweries are not allowed to sell directly to the public and brew pubs are not allowed to sell to wholesalers or liquor stores.

 

[OrdinaryAvgGuy]

In Texas we have the usual annoying dry (no alcohol), semi dry (beer and wine) and wet areas (everything including liquor). Up to this day and after 12 years in Texas I still have not understood how it exactly works.... lol
Plus no alcohol sales on Sunday before noon. No open container in the car but then we have drive through liquor stores.....
And then there are these stupid laws for breweries and brew pubs. Breweries are not allowed to sell directly to the public and brew pubs are not allowed to sell to wholesalers or liquor stores.

Texas may have some crazy laws on alcohol but y'all at least have your gun laws right.

 

[Brewsit]

We have been lucky though as I can always go on base and buy tax free hooch at competitive prices, even on Sunday. Our package stores (class 6) even carry some really good beer, wine and booze. The selection is really determined by whomever is in charge of that particular class 6.

I second this statement. It's nice to have a Federal Installation with a 24/7 Class 6. Stocking up last minute at 3AM on Christmas morning is what America is all about!

It took me a while to get used to Texas laws, the first time I ever saw a chain across the beer section in a gas station confused me more than anything.

I also couldn't get used to Maryland's liquor laws, even more strange to me than Texas. Texas seems to be derived from southern bible-belt type thinking, I can't wrap my head around East coast reasoning.

 

[fuzzy2133]

Wow. California doesn't have any of these weird laws that I know of.

Gas stations, corner stores, grocery stores, etc. all sell beer, liquor and wine every day. I'm pretty sure there's no time limit on when you can buy it either. Last call at bars is always no later than 2 am...

All Alcohol sales stop at 2am state wide. I can not remember if it is 6am or 7 am sales resume. ABC sets the number of alcohol sale licenses and there is a very lucrative black market to purchase (sorry; transfer) a license. Last I knew Wine in church is legal for underage kids to sip (at least catholic church).

 

[thadius856]

We have been lucky though as I can always go on base and buy tax free hooch at competitive prices, even on Sunday. Our package stores (class 6) even carry some really good beer, wine and booze. The selection is really determined by whomever is in charge of that particular class 6.

My class 6 section of the BX is terrible last I checked. Maybe half a dozen craft brews, and not great prices either. Then again, it's a small rural base.

Also, mine's not 24/7. Opens at 8 am. By the time 5pm closing rolls around, the base is a ghost town except for the Commissary.

 

[Brewsit]

My class 6 section of the BX is terrible last I checked. Maybe half a dozen craft brews, and not great prices either. Then again, it's a small rural base.

Also, mine's not 24/7. Opens at 8 am. By the time 5pm closing rolls around, the base is a ghost town except for the Commissary.

Sounds like you are describing Beale AFB. If so, I am sorry for your loss.

 

[thadius856]

Sounds like you are describing Beale AFB. If so, I am sorry for your loss.

On. The. Nose.

Will be at Travis this week. Will have to see what I'm missing.

 

[Brewsit]

On. The. Nose.

Will be at Travis this week. Will have to see what I'm missing.

Travis is like a metropolis, comparatively. I never went to the Class 6, but I know that they at least carry things people would buy at the BX.

 

[Hogarthe]

Yoop, I remember going to some restaurant/bars in the DFW area (1990's -ish) and in order to drink you had to a member of a "club". I think it was called the "uni-card." This allowed you to drink at any place that served alcohol (Chi-Chi's, etc.) around town. I believe they've since done away with it. I think that might have been what hogarthe was referring to.

yeah, that was it. My freind had said it was needed anywhere in Texas, but I don't know if that was true, or just the town/county he was in. this was maybe 4-5 years ago.

other things about TN laws... you can have an open container of alcohol in a vehicle, as long as you are not the one driving. you can not drink while riding an inner tube down a river. for some reason, that is considered boating while intoxicated. (how a n innertube is a boat is beyond me). I just read an article in the paper that said TN had the highest alcohol tax in the country, and that neighboring states are trying to lure our microbreweries away by offering them incentives. I don't know if the part about alcohol tax being the highest in the country is accurate though. it seems the prices are about the same when I visit family in VA, which I would think wouldn't be true if TN's tax was so much higher.

 

[Photopilot]

I live in Utah, and the Mormons have done a pretty good job of f***ing up everything related to alcohol.

I don't think you even touched on how stupid the Utard politics are and how badly they screw themselves to keep us from corrupting their state.

While I don't live there anymore, when I was there they had a budget crisis. Since the states budget was affected by the bad economy they had to cut back on all departments in the state, including the state run liquor stores which is the only place you can buy liquor, wine and real beer. They started closing stores and cutting back hours. Of all the departments in the state, which is a growing source of income, DMV, schools, state offices? No it was the liquor stores. They figured we drinkers would just rearrange our schedule to get our booze but as a result of the changed hours the income for liquor sales went down. I was under the impression that they reversed the cut back on budget cuts for the liquor stores, but maybe they just cut their children's education budget instead.

My other favorite crazy rule was no liquor sales on any holiday the state can think of. One time I went to a liquor store on a holiday obscure enough to be closed but not to give the unioned employees the day off, so there were employees sitting around getting paid, with the doors locked, but no sales of alcohol that day.

California law I hate. You can only fill a growler with a specific brewers silk screened beer. They call it a labeling protection issue. I call it BS, its not like I can resell the growler or put a wheat beer in a growler and tell someone it is an IIPA. With at least 10 Brew Pubs within 10 miles of my home, I am not going to buy 10 growlers to be able to take some home.

 

[Photopilot]

In Wyoming some cities had open container laws, others did not. When leaving the town of Jackson to head to Teton Village (the ski area), everyone would crack a beer at the Y-junction, meaning everyone. The driver could not be drunk but could be drinking.

"If you hold this bee for me I'd be glad to get you my license and registration officer."


The only wierd law I can think of Wyoming was bars had to shut down at 10 on Sunday. The Sunday routine was the stage coach bar in Wilson was named "Church on Sundays" Wyoming also had drive up liquor store windows.:rockin:


Louisiana has drive up daquiri bars, you did have to put the straw in yourself though.

 

[thadius856]

California law I hate. You can only fill a growler with a specific brewers silk screened beer. They call it a labeling protection issue. I call it BS, its not like I can resell the growler or put a wheat beer in a growler and tell someone it is an IIPA. With at least 10 Brew Pubs within 10 miles of my home, I am not going to buy 10 growlers to be able to take some home.

This is true, except the silkscreening. I've not had the issues you've had. Here's the letter of the law:

California Business and Professions Code § 25200. Label; Contents.
All beer sold in this State shall have a label affixed to the package or container thereof, upon which shall appear the true and correct name and address of the manufacturer of the beer, and also the true and correct name of the bottler of the beer if other than the manufacturer. No manufacturer, importer, or wholesaler of beer shall use a container or carton as a package or container of a beer other than such beer as is manufactured by the manufacturer whose name or brand of beer appears upon the container or carton, or use as a package or container of a beer a container or carton which bears the name of a manufacturer of beer or the brand of any beer other than those of the manufacturer of the beer contained in the container or carton.

I've only been to a few brewpubs, but the ones I have visited with a growler place a vinyl label on your unlabeled growler and then fill. When you finish the growler, just peel off the vinyl label and take it elsewhere. This skirts the law, but doesn't violate it or its intent.

One time the pub was out of labels. I was pretty disappointed. They bottle all of their brews like 20 feet from the counter. How do they run out of labels? I ended up having a lightbulb moment. I bought a bomber of the same beer, then let the bottle sit in a glass of ice water for a few minutes. The foiled label peeled right off, and I stuck it to the growler.

Can your brewpubs not be bothered to stock a roll of sticky labels?

 

[thadius856]

Just found this posted over at BA. It's fresh. Only from yesterday.

I saw this came up in the Societe tasting room thread, but I figured I'd give it the full treatment.

The CA ABC held a workshop yesterday for Southern California craft brewers, and the head of the ABC, Jacob Appelsmith, addressed a couple of specific issues in his introduction. One of those was growlers.

He said breweries (type 23, i.e. Small Beer Manufacturers) can fill any sealable vessel as a growler as long as they can cover up any previous label and convey the mandatory label information (name of brewery, city and state where it was brewed, name of beer, and ABV if the beer is over 5.7%. I believe the surgeon's general warning is a TTB requirement). Breweries must get label approval for however they choose to convey that information, even if it's just a sharpie on a piece of duct tape (they showed us several examples of label approvals that were just handwritten name tags from Office Depot). He also said you could theoretically have a common, blank growler (except for the surgeon's general warning, I imagine), if you could legibly fit all the mandatory information on a screw cap. A growler coozie with the mandatory info would also work if it covered everything.

There was lots of murmuring and confused looks in the room, and a couple of people asked questions to clarify. He admitted that there had been confusion within the ABC about it, and said local offices should now be on the same page. (Quite a few brewers told me afterward that they were specifically instructed by local ABC officers that they could only fill their own growlers.)

I talked to Tom McCormick, head of the CA Craft Brewers Association, and he said the ABC issued a reinterpretation of the code about 6 months ago that spelled this out. He said he's going to make an effort to make sure everyone knows about it.

This is obviously welcome news. As for Modern Times, I'm still planning to offer the standard 64oz. glass growler with our logo for interested parties, but I'm going to look into the screwcap idea and stickers.

Cheers!

 

[daksin]

Just found this posted over at BA. It's fresh. Only from yesterday.

I was at that workshop. Lots of good information. One thing to note is that there is a BIG disconnect between ABC at the State and the local ABC enforcement agents. San Diego enforcement is some of the toughest on growler fills. It's going to be a good long while before you can start filling up non-brewery growlers and cornies in CA.

 

[thadius856]

Been filling growlers in NorCal for some time now.

Never thought of trying to fill a corny...

 

[oujens]

No, of course not. You can buy beer and wine in the grocery store (or gas station) and you can buy booze/wine/beer at any liquor store.

In Texas this is True. Now to add to it, finding a liquor store can be a challenge. I live in McKinney, which is about 30 miles north of downtown Dallas for anybody that does not know. My area and surrounding areas do not allow liquor stores. Only Beer and wine can be sold at a convenient store or grocery store.I have to drive 20 miles south, north, west, or east if I want liquor. Luckily I work in downtown Dallas and am near a couple stores with huge beer, wine and liquor selections. Beer selection in my area are decent at a couple stores, so at least I got that going for me. Another weird thing is you can be surrounded by wet areas and be in a dry suburb in Dallas. Drive a mile north, can't buy beer, drive a mile south can buy beer. Doesn't make sense.

Now Oklahoma.....Born and raised there. Only beer at 3.2% can be sold in grocery stores. anything above that has to be sold at a liquor store and cannot be refrigerated. Wine is only to be sold in a liquor store as well. All liquor stores are closed Sunday, so BMC owns that day if you need beer. Absolutely ridiculous. There have been some craft breweries open too, and they get limited to 6 days of beer sales in stores. I haven't been to one, but I know being Oklahoma there is no way they are allowed to sell beer on premise. And they want to know why people think Oklahoma is boring and behind the times. Don't get me wrong, I love OK, just had a better opportunity in TX. Truth is there are some good things happening in Oklahoma, they just need to change the way they think when it comes to some of this.

 

[daksin]

Been filling growlers in NorCal for some time now.

Never thought of trying to fill a corny...

It's all about your local ABC enforcement. The law allows for corny fills, but i expect it'll be a while before we get them.

 

[betarhoalphadelta]

What I really want in CA is the ability for Whole Foods to do growler fills. They jut opened a new WF down the road from me with a craft beer bar, but not being a brewery I'll bet this ABC re-interpretation of growler rules doesn't allow then to do fills.

 

[thadius856]

What I really want in CA is a Whole Foods with a craft beer bar.

FTFY.

Have two in nearby Roseville, as well as two Nugget Markets, a Sprouts, and a couple other similar stores. They all have a great selection of sixers and bombers (rivaling both Beverages & More and Total Wine & Spirits, which are also nearby), but I've never seen a craft bar in any of them.

 

[betarhoalphadelta]

Hmm... The new WF here in Laguna Niguel has one...

 

[dmboiler]

I don't think anyone has chimed in for the good 'ole state of Indiana yet, so here goes. Outside of maybe Utah, we probably have the most conservative laws, most of which date back to prohibition:

1.) Absolutely NO alcohol sales in stores on Sunday (wineries, brewpubs, restaurants, etc can sell)
2.) Cold beer can only be sold in liquor stores, most of which conveniently charge more for cold vs. warm
3.) I don't think liquor stores can sell soda. Most have it available in vending machines outside the stores, but not inside.
4.) Kegs have to be tagged with a sticker that shows who purchased it...if the sticker is removed or the keg falls into possession of someone other than the purchaser, the purchaser gets in trouble.

I'm sure there are more, but I can't think of them at the moment. Sad thing is these outdated laws were scheduled to come up for a vote in the state legislature, but the leaders decided to not even bring it up for debate/vote this year (methinks the liquor store lobby is lining some pockets).

 

[whoaru99]

There are all kinds of dumb-ass liquor laws but most of 'em aren't that hard to work around.

Want beer on Sunday? Well, buy some on Saturday. It ain't that hard.

 

[Photopilot]

FTFY.

Have two in nearby Roseville, as well ........ but I've never seen a craft bar in any of them.

NorCal and Socal are separate divisions for Whole Foods so different management, and policies. The craft bars are going into a bunch of Socal stores. By getting a liquor consumption license the customers can buy beers, wines, and different foods and enjoy them in house.

I am not sure how it will work in smaller stores but the flagship in Austin TX had a liquor license and many, many food bars. So someone could order from the hot food section, someone from the raw food area, and someone else from the Sushi bar and share it with wine or beers from the store. With craft beer bars here in Socal it will be even better.