Hill Farmstead Double Citra IPA Yeast?

[troxerX]

I was lucky when my neighbors brought me a few four packs of Double Citra this past October from their trip to Vermont. Curious enough, I decided to collect some dregs and get a starter going. I had a starter already set before a week from canning date so I’m presuming I collected sufficient viable healthy yeast. I noticed a few things from the starter that surprised me:

1. Yeast was extremely clean and neutral (minimum to no esters or phenols).
2. Yeast left no residual sugars, completely bone dry.
3. Yeast was a very slow fermenter and almost had no foaming (very thin surface foaming, I didn’t use a stir plate/no agitation though), I didn’t detect much aroma which is probably a result of been a slow fermenter,
4. Very subjective but by visual observation this yeast seems to do most of the work from the bottom and very slowly with minimum yeast in suspension.
5. Yeast cake looks a little bit darker (tan as opposite to off-light cream) than most ale yeasts I’ve seem in the past.
6. Also subjective but this Yeast seems to be a good flocculator

I’ve seen posts and other threads were there is a mention that HF’s house yeast might be London III or Conan. In my experience brewing with these yeasts, and what I noticed with the starter there seem to be a disconnect. This yeast was extremely clean with no esters at all, completely opposite to what a LIII produces (my experience with Conan is limited though). I’ve brewed with LIII for almost 10 years and I can tell from both the beer and starter that this is not LIII. Whatever this yeast is, it seems it was chosen as its characteristic and behavior are just for the purpose of retaining hop presence (low scrubbing) in the beer while maintaining a clean profile. I recognize the limitations of my sensory and I’m no way a yeast scientist but just sharing just in case someone has additional experience/information. I wouldn’t be surprised if this is a 1056 or just any neutral clean ale yeast unless someone has more details that could match Conan.

Cheers

 

[couchsending]

It’s wonderful yeast and no where close to LAIII. It’s supposedly Conan but a much earlier generation. I wouldn’t say it’s a slow fermenter but yeah it forms virtually no krausen. Floccs like a rock, doesn’t mask hops, drops pH well but not overly lactic, etc.

 

[troxerX]

@couchsending right?, definitively you can recognize the LIII peach esters from space. This is not LIII for sure. The HF one is so clean and neutral it’s just amazing.

I took pictures of two yeast starters I did with the same exact (split) wort, on the left is Omega Cosmic Punch and on the right is the HF yeast. You can see the big difference in color. HF has a much darker tone, while other yeasts tend to be much lighter cream noted. Not that this is critical but just another physical clue.

I have a double citra batch now in the works with this yeast and it’s looking phenomenal. The aroma reminds me of all those homebrews with 1056 and 001. Also the bright orange color it gives it’s just beautiful. The kettle pictures is since I pitched 1/2 the yeast early directly to the kettle after whirlpool, once I hit the 110F mark during cool down and it transformed the beer into that Orange Juice looking bomb. The other 1/2 was added once transferred to the carboy. Can’t wait to taste this brew!.

 

[Callacave]

@couchsending right?, definitively you can recognize the LIII peach esters from space. This is not LIII for sure. The HF one is so clean and neutral it’s just amazing.

I took pictures of two yeast starters I did with the same exact (split) wort, on the left is Omega Cosmic Punch and on the right is the HF yeast. You can see the big difference in color. HF has a much darker tone, while other yeasts tend to be much lighter cream noted. Not that this is critical but just another physical clue.

I have a double citra batch now in the works with this yeast and it’s looking phenomenal. The aroma reminds me of all those homebrews with 1056 and 001. Also the bright orange color it gives it’s just beautiful. The kettle pictures is since I pitched 1/2 the yeast early directly to the kettle after whirlpool, once I hit the 110F mark during cool down and it transformed the beer into that Orange Juice looking bomb. The other 1/2 was added once transferred to the carboy. Can’t wait to taste this brew!.

Resurrecting this cause I’ve always been interested in what Shaun uses for yeast. I’ve always thought the same thing, that i could never detect anything regarding esters or phenols from his yeast. He always allows his hops to be the expressing. Have you still been experimenting with propagating his yeast? I currently have a bunch of cans of his various beers, and I think I’m going to save one to resurrect the dregs.

I know he originally used Conan when he first began, but switched to something else. I feel like it’s something so simple, and we’ll all be laughing when we find out someday.

His beers have been and always will be my favorite, and the ones I’ve always strived for and judge all from.

I know that he does ferment under some pressure, so maybe it’s a yeast we’re familiar with, but he’s been able to suppress any esters or phenols by dialing in just the right amount of pressure?

 

[couchsending]

HF yeast is a earlier gen of “Vermont ale” than Conan. Same strain but different gens. It’s amazing yeast. Really nothing like LA3.

Prop it up from cans of Edward and take it to 15 gens, no prob.

 

[Callacave]

HF yeast is a earlier gen of “Vermont ale” than Conan. Same strain but different gens. It’s amazing yeast. Really nothing like LA3.

Prop it up from cans of Edward and take it to 15 gens, no prob.

Thanks @couchsending good to hear from you! Haven't seen you around these parts in a while. I hope your Pro-Brewing adventures are going well.

I'm definitely going to prop some up in the near future.

How did you find out it was an early gen? Interesting. I wonder who he has banking his culture.

 

[couchsending]

Thanks @couchsending good to hear from you! Haven't seen you around these parts in a while. I hope your Pro-Brewing adventures are going well.

I'm definitely going to prop some up in the near future.

How did you find out it was an early gen? Interesting. I wonder who he has banking his culture.

Just some info from someone who might know… it’s the yeast we use and it’s amazing. Very fast, floccs insanely well, haze stable, crazy good viability, consistent attenuation and pH drop over and over.

I believe what Bootleg Biology now sells as Conan might also be this yeast or close. What the other yeast banks sell as Conan is very unpredictable. Diacetyl, weird attenuation, drops clear randomly, only good for a few gens. We’ve taken it to 17 gens with zero issues.

It can be a bit nutty, flavor wise. We haven’t tried fermenting it under pressure yet but one of the days we’re going to try 7psi for a few days and see.

Pro brewing is going well. I actually rarely brew but that’s fine. A sh*t load of work and beer is in a weird place right now. The Untappd crowd seems to enjoy us even though we really only make a handful of beers over 5%. Stoked on where the beer is now but always trying to improve. Learned a lot but haven’t changed a ton. Making the beers we want to make and making them the way we believe is best.

 

[Callacave]

Just some info from someone who might know… it’s the yeast we use and it’s amazing. Very fast, floccs insanely well, haze stable, crazy good viability, consistent attenuation and pH drop over and over.

I believe what Bootleg Biology now sells as Conan might also be this yeast or close. What the other yeast banks sell as Conan is very unpredictable. Diacetyl, weird attenuation, drops clear randomly, only good for a few gens. We’ve taken it to 17 gens with zero issues.

It can be a bit nutty, flavor wise. We haven’t tried fermenting it under pressure yet but one of the days we’re going to try 7psi for a few days and see.

Pro brewing is going well. I actually rarely brew but that’s fine. A sh*t load of work and beer is in a weird place right now. The Untappd crowd seems to enjoy us even though we really only make a handful of beers over 5%. Stoked on where the beer is now but always trying to improve. Learned a lot but haven’t changed a ton. Making the beers we want to make and making them the way we believe is best.

Good for you! I'm glad you are still going strong with your brewery, especially in this weird/tough climate.

Glad you're able to make the beers you want, and not compromise. I'm not sure what passes for beer these days when I see kettle sours with puree thrown in and called beer. Forgive me if you guys have had to go in that direction on occasion, but I would understand to keep the lights on, but I've got a feeling from you here that you're not in that crowd.

Maybe I'll grab some from Bootleg, and also propagate some from Hill cans just for comparison.

Thanks again!