Hey Sleep Apnea folks!

[troy2000]

The real remedy for apnea is to get the weight under control. Apnea is common among overweight people, that is people with a BMI over 25. Over 30 BMI and it's incredibly common. Reduce the BMI to less than 25 and apnea almost always disappears.

With all due respect, you're generalizing and oversimplifying the problem; you should be more careful about making broad, sweeping statements. I had sleep apnea clear back in my teens, when I was a wiry, fit wrestler with a BMI of about 19.

 

[troy2000]

No, the problem arises when you live in a country with a capitalistic medical system that would rather push sales than health.

Getting a little smug and self-congratulatory while looking down our noses at America again, are we?

Once again, you're making a sweeping generalization. I assure you the doctor I've had for years spends his time practicing medicine, not selling me things.

 

[podz]

Getting a little smug and self-congratulatory while looking down our noses at America again, are we?

Just saying that, in a capitalistic medical system, financial incentives cause the patient’s best medical interest to come in direct conflict with the physician’s best financial interest. This is not a theory; it has been proven.

On the other hand, have a look at how the medical system inside the military functions. Doctors are on a fixed salary and they don't make or lose money according to the amount of medicines, machines, or operations they transact or don't transact. They are, additionally, not subjected to tort, so they don't need to do unnecessary stuff just to cover their individual asses against malpractice lawsuits.

 

[betarhoalphadelta]

But don't listen to me. There's doctors on drug company commissions, machines and medicines waiting to be bought.

You know what my doctor told me? He said that you're ****ing fat and if you don't lose weight then first you're going to start shooting insulin and you're going to die of a heart attack before you're 50. There were no drugs or machines prescribed. He gave me a mental ass whopping and that was enough.

Remember, just because people are doing something less-than-efficient or not entirely in your interest doesn't mean that there's a conspiracy.

The fact is that doctors know that most patients don't WANT to or have the willpower to lose weight and go from BMI of 36.2 to 23. We're Americans! Give us a pill or a machine so we can continue doing whatever we want. Hell, we'll watch TV and even tell the doctors what pill we need!

Does the doctor want a patient dying due to an apnea-induced heart attack because he didn't prescribe a CPAP, even though the patient never actually did what the doctor ordered (lose weight)? No. That doesn't mean the doctor is getting kickbacks from the CPAP maker, it means the doctor is trying to get his patient to do SOMETHING to stay alive.

I'm going on a diet because I'm pretty sure I have apnea, I'm getting acid reflux, I'm not sleeping well and I feel like **** even when I wake up. Not only that, I look down at my gut and ask myself how the hell I got to this point? (Even though it's pretty obvious). If I lose the weight and my wife *still* complains about the snoring, I'll start looking into a sleep study. But I know what the MAIN problem is right now. I'm overweight.

But most people don't want to change their lifestyle. We *like* our lifestyle. Food and beer are DELICIOUS. Exercise sucks. So we try to find ways to live like gluttons while treating the symptoms rather than making a hard change.

That's not a CONSPIRACY by the medical industry. That's the medical industry being enablers. It's still terrible, but it's not a conspiracy.

 

[HoppyDaze]

When 43 years old, I had a BMI of 36.2. I was diagnosed with severe sleep apnea and borderline type 2 diabetes. I snored very heavily and I woke up at least once per night in a condition where my body had been sufficiently oxygen deprived that I could actually physically feel the toxicity beginning in my lungs and running through my blood, out through my entire body. A condition where it would take me an hour or more to return to sleep, a condition where I needed to keep the bedroom window open all night long even when it was -20 celcius outside just so I could have an oxygen rich environment. I almost had a heart attack when I was carrying a rack of Franziskaner (20 x 0.5 litre bottles) through Duesseldorf airport one time. I also couldn't manage to get busy without the help of Cialis. A pitiful state of affairs.

I went on a mission to lose weight. And you need to understand that when I go on a mission, I don't try - I do. Over the course of 8 months, I lost 85 pounds and my BMI went down to 23. 5 years later (48 years old now), I am still holding steady. My snoring disappeared entirely, my apnea disappeared entirely, my blood sugar is completely stable, I can ride my mountain bike UP a ski slope in the summer, haven't touched a Cialis in 4 years and my drive is higher than ever before in my life.

But don't listen to me. There's doctors on drug company commissions, machines and medicines waiting to be bought.

Having doctors subjected to a legal system that includes TORT, combined with the idea of insanely high monetary awards, is never in the best health interest of people.

You know what my doctor told me? He said that you're ****ing fat and if you don't lose weight then first you're going to start shooting insulin and you're going to die of a heart attack before you're 50. There were no drugs or machines prescribed. He gave me a mental ass whopping and that was enough.

That was what happened to YOU. One effing case out of millions. Not to mention the subject is borderline bigoted against the way USA does things so his opinions are obviously skewed and baseless . I'll go with the well respected Doctor who went to Stanford, thank you. Let's get back on track here. This is about sleep apnea, not US health care.

 

[normonster]

LOL @ you guys getting pissed on this thread when neither of you give a s#%t about the other.

 

[SteveH aka shetc]

I have severe sleep apnea (both obstructive and central). The f'ing CPAP machine was a disaster -- it sounded like a jet engine on my face. Now, it sits, gathering dust.

My question: How can I make home brew yet keep my weight under control? I do aerobics and weight training, 5 or 6 days a week, but I can tell that the beer is impacting the waist line.

 

[bob1852]

That was what happened to YOU. One effing case out of millions. Not to mention the subject is borderline bigoted against the way USA does things so his opinions are obviously skewed and baseless . I'll go with the well respected Doctor who went to Stanford, thank you. Let's get back on track here. This is about sleep apnea, not US health care.

 

[bob1852]

My question: How can I make home brew yet keep my weight under control?

Make it all you want! Just don't drink it.

 

[normonster]

Hacksaw Jim DuggAn!!!! Yeah!

 

[HoppyDaze]

u.s.a. !!!!

 

[HoppyDaze]

LOL @ you guys getting pissed on this thread when neither of you give a s#%t about the other.

Not pissed at all. Just no tolerance for the condescending anti folks. Always the same banter ...

 

[HoppyDaze]

I have severe sleep apnea (both obstructive and central). The f'ing CPAP machine was a disaster -- it sounded like a jet engine on my face. Now, it sits, gathering dust.

My question: How can I make home brew yet keep my weight under control? I do aerobics and weight training, 5 or 6 days a week, but I can tell that the beer is impacting the waist line.

When was this? The machine I got doesn't make a sound except when I exhale and that's only because it's at such a high pressure. They're probably not all created equally.

 

[troy2000]

Just saying that, in a capitalistic medical system, financial incentives cause the patient’s best medical interest to come in direct conflict with the physician’s best financial interest. This is not a theory; it has been proven.

On the other hand, have a look at how the medical system inside the military functions. Doctors are on a fixed salary and they don't make or lose money according to the amount of medicines, machines, or operations they transact or don't transact. They are, additionally, not subjected to tort, so they don't need to do unnecessary stuff just to cover their individual asses against malpractice lawsuits.

Being a Vietnam veteran who spent six months in the Navy Hospital at Camp Pendleton, I've had an intimate, up-close look at military medical care. I mean no offense to those who provide it, because they're good folks and dedicated, but I'll take my current medical insurance and my current 'capitalistic' doctor any day.

Your assumption that doctors in the US habitually put profit first, and the health and lives of their patients a distant second, is deeply flawed and more than a little insulting. Especially since the best way to make a profit is generally to meet and exceed your customers' expectations on a regular basis, not to screw them over for an extra buck every time you have a chance.

add: and your belief that military healthcare providers, with both a military chain of command and a civilian bureaucracy on their back, are under no pressure to cut costs and do things the cheap way instead of the best way is almost touchingly naive.

 

[thatjonguy]

How long did it take everyone to get used to wearing the mask all night?

 

[b-boy]

I went on a mission to lose weight. And you need to understand that when I go on a mission, I don't try - I do. Over the course of 8 months, I lost 85 pounds and my BMI went down to 23. 5 years later (48 years old now), I am still holding steady. My snoring disappeared entirely, my apnea disappeared entirely, my blood sugar is completely stable, I can ride my mountain bike UP a ski slope in the summer, haven't touched a Cialis in 4 years and my drive is higher than ever before in my life.

But don't listen to me. There's doctors on drug company commissions, machines and medicines waiting to be bought.

Having doctors subjected to a legal system that includes TORT, combined with the idea of insanely high monetary awards, is never in the best health interest of people.

You know what my doctor told me? He said that you're ****ing fat and if you don't lose weight then first you're going to start shooting insulin and you're going to die of a heart attack before you're 50. There were no drugs or machines prescribed. He gave me a mental ass whopping and that was enough.

Sounds like you've got a good doctor. Mine is like that. I was at a concert enjoying a beer and an Italian Sausage. I felt a tap on my shoulder. It was my doctor. He said 'Mr. Black - with your cholesterol, do you think an Italian Sausage is something you should be eating.' He laughed and walked away. Completely freaked me out. I still finished the Italian Sausage though.

 

[Sir_niveda]

My girlfriend recently self diagnosed me with sleep apnea, and I was completely unaware that there was anything up. My BMI is about 20 so weight has nothing to do with it in my case. I've come to the conclusion that the only way to heal myself of this is to cut back on cigarettes (I know, gross, time to quit), as well as the beer. Of course we all know how hand in hand these go.

 

[brewguyver]

My girlfriend recently self diagnosed me with sleep apnea, and I was completely unaware that there was anything up. My BMI is about 20 so weight has nothing to do with it in my case. I've come to the conclusion that the only way to heal myself of this is to cut back on cigarettes (I know, gross, time to quit), as well as the beer. Of course we all know how hand in hand these go.

Some people are just assembled differently - maybe you've got a tongue like Gene Simmons, or a thin neck ... or a giant neck from playing javelin with I-Beams. If your physiology works, you could sleep on your side (I do, even though it effs with my shoulders). For me, I need the machine. A dental appliance (mentioned here a few times) or surgery (tongue surgery is very painful and very dangerous ... Since it will swell and can block an already problematic airway). There's also surgery for the deviates septum I'd you have one.

If you have it and are skinny, it may be worth looking at your kids physiology. A sleep apnea dentist recommended I look at having my kid's pallette split when their a baby, if they have a small upper jaw like me. If it would help I might consider it, but that seems like a horrible thing to do to a child to avoid a disease that they may or may not get. My wife has a larger upper jaw but is tall and thin also - maybe our kids will get lucky and won't have it.

 

[brewguyver]

I have severe sleep apnea (both obstructive and central). The f'ing CPAP machine was a disaster -- it sounded like a jet engine on my face. Now, it sits, gathering dust.

My question: How can I make home brew yet keep my weight under control? I do aerobics and weight training, 5 or 6 days a week, but I can tell that the beer is impacting the waist line.

If you have central, a standard CPAP can make it worse. It's like the CO2 sensor in your brain is broken, so you won't breath until the CO2 builds up really high ... and then you hyperventilate it off ... and then you stop breathing again. The CPAP continually forces the CO2 out of your lungs, so you never actually breath.

What ended up working for me was an Auto-PAP with a full range. I also used the "ramp" focus on my mask. What may work for you that didn't work for me is Deadspace therapy. Dr. Thomas at Mass General was experimenting with it in the early 2000's.

It took me about 8-10 sleep studies to get my masks and pressures right. If the mask isn't calibrated on your specific machine, with your hose and the specific vent placement (assuming you have an unvented mask, it won't work. Even with that it could be a slog. Depending on how bad you are it may not be worth it.

As an aside - to the "doctors are capitalists" guy - it's more a problem that Doctors have high insurance and all this other BS, and can't spend proper time with a patient to figure things out. Mine put me on antibiotics and a bunch of creams for a rash that never cleared up ... Until I figured out it was caused by a change in laundry detergent. Had the doc ran through a swab for fungal/staph and gone through a questionnaire, we would have figured it out a year earlier. However, the mess and creams were **WAY** cheaper than the test, and got me out the door, so they prescribed those instead.

 

[HoppyDaze]

I'm realizing how lucky I got with my sleep study. They called it a split study. Half the night to see how many events I had and then the other half hooked up to the CPAP to see how effective it was. I went from 49 events/hr down to like 5 after they hooked me up. I have no idea about (obstructive vs. central) and CO2 levels...etc. My oxygen levels were as low as 83% which he said anything under 93% is not good for you. I'm going to have to get a full copy of all my results so I can better understand my condition.

 

[Banjorium]

Subbing this... It's comforting to know there are others suffering from this in the homebrew world

 

[normonster]

Subbing this... It's comforting to know there are others suffering from this in the homebrew world

Lol...yes....misery loves company.

 

[podz]

Lol...yes....misery loves company.

Misery loves a good bottle of DOC Ripasso.

From my observations, USA people are diagnosed with a hell of a lot of health issues. Given that the gene pool is extremely diverse, this seems more than a bit fishy to me. Probably has a lot to do with lack of sidewalks and bike paths, etc.

 

[betarhoalphadelta]

From my observations, USA people are diagnosed with a hell of a lot of health issues. Given that the gene pool is extremely diverse, this seems more than a bit fishy to me. Probably has a lot to do with lack of sidewalks and bike paths, etc.

I will say that years ago when I was in Versailles, I did notice far more fat people than I expected...

...I'll be damned if they didn't all speak perfect English, tho!

 

[Yaksha808]

I was diagnosed with sleep apnea almost a year ago, something around 55 events/hour. I was given an APAP machine and I still have many nights where I can't handle wearing the mask still. I'm 6'1" and just over 200lbs... so I don't think weight is a major issue... but I am no doctor.

 

[Beernik]

I accidentally fell asleep on the sofa with my mask off last night. Woke up in less than 8 minutes because I'm not used to the sound of my own snoring anymore.

I think I adapted to wearing a nose cup quickly because I worked a job for a couple years that sometimes required me to wear a 1/2 face respirator. Breathing with the two on is remarkably similar. So it was basically getting used to the idea of sleeping with it on.

Here's my question: what do you all do with your hoses? I've left a 1" gap between my mattress and headboard. I run the tube through there if I'm sleeping facing away from my machine.

 

[troy2000]

Misery loves a good bottle of DOC Ripasso.

From my observations, USA people are diagnosed with a hell of a lot of health issues. Given that the gene pool is extremely diverse, this seems more than a bit fishy to me. Probably has a lot to do with lack of sidewalks and bike paths, etc.

You don't let up, do you? Apparently you love negative stereotyping of Americans.

 

[brewguyver]

I accidentally fell asleep on the sofa with my mask off last night. Woke up in less than 8 minutes because I'm not used to the sound of my own snoring anymore.

I think I adapted to wearing a nose cup quickly because I worked a job for a couple years that sometimes required me to wear a 1/2 face respirator. Breathing with the two on is remarkably similar. So it was basically getting used to the idea of sleeping with it on.

Here's my question: what do you all do with your hoses? I've left a 1" gap between my mattress and headboard. I run the tube through there if I'm sleeping facing away from my machine.

I just have the Cpap on my night stand and the hose free floating on the bed up to my face. I don't move much when I sleep though.

It's remarkably similar to how my AV wires and brewing hoses are managed (or not managed). Then again, I tend to travel a lot, so there's no value to a preeminent routing.

 

[Beernik]

It's remarkably similar to how my AV wires and brewing hoses are managed (or not managed). Then again, I tend to travel a lot, so there's no value to a preeminent routing.

What do you do for distilled water for the humidifier when you are on the road? the few overnight trips I take, I've been using hotel tap water because I don't want to pack a gallon of distilled around with me for a day.

Im not sure what I'm going to do next year when I'm out and about for a week at a time.

 

[Banjorium]

Here's my question: what do you all do with your hoses? I've left a 1" gap between my mattress and headboard. I run the tube through there if I'm sleeping facing away from my machine.

What I ended up doing, and I'm not sure if this could cause rainout for some, is take a rubber band, place it around the bed post on the headboard and then tie another rubber band to that one. Then I ran the hose through the second rubber band. This way the hose has more than enough give should I wander into SWMBOs side of the bed unintentionally.