Help with Coconut Cream Stout recipe

[kbuzz]

My wife has been asking me to make her a Coconut Cream Stout ever since we had one at a beerfest a couple months back. I finally feel like I can start brewing darker beers, so I started working on a recipe for her...any advice would be fantastic...thanks!

Fermentables:
Pale Malt (2 Row) US Grain 7.500 lb 79% 2 L
Chocolate Malt (US) Grain 16.000 oz 60% 350 L
Caramel/Crystal Malt - 80L Grain 12.000 oz 74% 80 L
Carafa III Grain 10.000 oz 70% 525 L
Flaked Rye Grain 8.000 oz 78% 2 L
Milk Sugar (Lactose) Sugar 9.000 oz 76% 0 L (@ flameout)
Cocoa Powder Adjunct 8.000 oz 0% 8 L (@ flameout)

Hop Additions:
Fuggles 4% 1.500 oz Boil 1.000 hr Pellet 22.0
Fuggles 4% 0.500 oz Boil 30.000 min Pellet 5.6

Add 20 oz Coconut to Secondary for 7-14 days depending on taste.

Safale S-04

Mash just a little high...say at 156.

I'm hoping for this to be a sweet chocolate coconut sort of thing. Is there anything I can do to help counteract the oils in the coconut or should I just count on no head with this beer?? Will the caramel malts help at all, maybe?

 

[smagee]

You could try adding a bit of head retention with a bit of carapils, since it won't have as strong an impact on the flavor as other caramels. I'd also add a bit of roasted barley, just to get it into proper "stout" territory.

I haven't brewed with cocoa powder myself, but I've seen a lot of folks recommending using nibs instead, as the powder tends to clog things up and hurts the head retention more. Are you planning on using fresh or dried coconut?

 

[manticle]

Two things you can do.

The first is to toast the coconut which will bring out a lot of the oils. Let it sit on greaseproof paper to drain and cool before adding.

The second is to counteract any possible loss of head by step mashing. I find beers that have a 5 minute rest at 55 deg Celcius (not sure of the faranheit conversion sorry) and another 10 minute rest at 72 Celcius (obviously around whatever sacch rest you are using) gives beer a head that just won't quit even when carb is low.

I would second the recommendation for nibs - toast them too and be amazed at the aroma.

 

[kbuzz]

You could try adding a bit of head retention with a bit of carapils, since it won't have as strong an impact on the flavor as other caramels. I'd also add a bit of roasted barley, just to get it into proper "stout" territory.

Noted about Carapils, I might give that a shot instead of all that caramel 80. Regarding the Roasted Barley - I thought Carafa III was just supposed to be a smoother (and even darker?) version of Roasted Barley - less "astringent" in flavor. As far as color, it's over 500L, so I'd think that would be plenty dark for a stout. So do you mean for flavor/aroma? Will the Carafa not provide that?

Two things you can do.

The first is to toast the coconut which will bring out a lot of the oils. Let it sit on greaseproof paper to drain and cool before adding.

The second is to counteract any possible loss of head by step mashing. I find beers that have a 5 minute rest at 55 deg Celcius (not sure of the faranheit conversion sorry) and another 10 minute rest at 72 Celcius (obviously around whatever sacch rest you are using) gives beer a head that just won't quit even when carb is low.

I would second the recommendation for nibs - toast them too and be amazed at the aroma.

Good advice on toasting the coconut...I'll definitely do that. Unfortunately, I don't have the proper equipment for step-mashing (at least I don't think), so I have to rule that out. I think I will definitely substitute the cocoa powder for the nibs...can I use the same weight? Or should I use more since there will be less surface area exposed to the wort?

 

[smagee]

Noted about Carapils, I might give that a shot instead of all that caramel 80. Regarding the Roasted Barley - I thought Carafa III was just supposed to be a smoother (and even darker?) version of Roasted Barley - less "astringent" in flavor. As far as color, it's over 500L, so I'd think that would be plenty dark for a stout. So do you mean for flavor/aroma? Will the Carafa not provide that?

Well, yes and no. Carafa III is darker (500 lovi vs. 300 for roasted barley) and certainly imparts less bitterness, but the impact from roasted barley is precisely what makes a traditional "stout". I suggested the addition partially due to simple pedantry, as purists tend to point out that a stout with no barley is no longer a stout.

That said, I think you'll be missing something without the barley, as it will enhance the coffee aspect that you're shooting for. I just wouldn't go heavy-handed with it--perhaps use around 4oz or so. That will end up using less than a traditional dry stout and still give you some nice flavor components to balance out the profile you're shooting for. If you're worried about overdoing the bitterness with both barley and carafa (a valid concern), I'd suggest using carafa special (dehusked) instead and still go with barley. It's too vital a component for me to recommend omitting entirely.

But your mileage may vary, so go with what feels right to you .

 

[sweaterman]

I can't find it now, but there is a thread on here somewhere from someone who was in a food course where they talked about how the various cocoa sources were processed, fat content, etc. The consensus was to use cocoa powder for less fat (retaining the head on the beer while getting the full cocoa flavor). I have read on here that 8oz is the common usage, not sure how strongly that flavor comes out. I recently used 6oz in a milk stout and am waiting for this to finish in the secondary right now.

To add it to the beer you put the cocoa in a saucepan on the oven, slowly add water to it while stirring so as not to make clumps (like you are making a roux), and heat it to approximately 180F. Then when you are cooling your wort, you add it to the wort at about 180F, stir it in, and continue cooling. If you are using cocoa from a package and previously boiled water there is virtually no risk of infection.

Hope this helps.

EDIT: Found the link: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f12/what-you-need-know-about-chocolate-brewing-94804/

 

[kbuzz]

great stuff, you guys...thanks.

last question - rice hulls for the flaked rye or no?

 

[smagee]

If you already have them on hand, sure, toss a handful in. Otherwise, I wouldn't worry about it; you'll have plenty of husk material from the 2-row.