Hello! New guy here

[eighteez]

Hello!

New guy here.

I've been pondering this hobby for a long time and decided to give it a shot.

I bought "Dave Miller's Homebrewing Guide" and am currently reading that.

My biggest question so far, is the purchase of a kit.

They seem to range all over the place in price. From $59.95 to several hundred.

So far I am eyeballing this: Brewing Intermediate Kit w/Two 5 Gallon Glass Carboys :: Midwest Supplies Homebrewing and Winemaking Supplies

To my amateur eyes it seems to be pretty complete for a beginner and I can add on as I get more experienced and want to try different things.

It also appears that I need a 5 gal brewing stock pot. Aluminun or stainless is fine according to the nOOb links I read.

Does anyone have any opinion on this kit?

Thanks!

 

[McGarnigle]

Arguably that's more than you need to start. Ale pail, bottling bucket, and two 5g carboys. It might be a while before you use both those carboys (then again, maybe not).

I'd personally rather apply some of your money to a wort chiller or other toy rather than two carboys, but of course they don't have a kit like that.
Pot: I use stainless, but aluminum is fine. You could also go with a bigger pot, assuming your stove can handle it (or you could get a turkey fryer...).

 

[YeastGardener]

I'm wondering whether it would be a quicker introduction for you to simply buy a malt extract-based kit and brew up using your current kitchen equipment? (You'll then find by experience the more important pieces of equipment.)

When I started, I went crazy buying everything ... a lot of which is still in storage!

The best parts of that set you show are:

the buckets (i.e. white plastic fermenters)

The best parts missing from that set are:

the bottles or the barrels to hold your beer!

Of course, everything in that set is useful, but don't go thinking that you will be ready to complete the whole cycle!

BTW, if you want to go full mash straight away, then you've got a LOT more to buy after that set! Still, whatever you do, it's a GREAAAT hobby, and WELL worth it.

Good Luck.
YeastGardener.

 

[HOOTER]

If I had to do it all over again I'd probably purchase the Deluxe starter kit w/ glass carboys from Northern Brewer. It's about the same price as the one I purchased from my LHBS but a little better.

You'll also need a brew kettle. The 5 Gallon would be sufficient for a partial boil.

A little over $200 and your good to go.

BTW, I don't work for Northern Brewer, I just like their products and service.

 

[YeastGardener]

BTW did I emphasis BARRELS (with proper vent valves and cylinder inlets) rather than bottles?

I certainly appreciated not messing about with bottles - in fact, still do!

YeastGardener.

 

[McGarnigle]

For bottles: if you drink a lot of craft beer or imports, save those and de-label. You might need to buy some bottles to supplement (maybe Grolsch type!), but I don't think you should need to buy 50 longnecks.

To clarify: my main problem with those carboys is they're both 5 gallon, which will be messy to use for primary. I don't know when you'll get to the point where you'll need two secondaries.

 

[SteveM]

I started years ago with a very basic kit - a 6.5 gallon plastic fermenter, a bottling bucket and the usual accessories. Since then I've added a couple of glass carboys (both given to me) but I seldom use them. However, this says as much about my brewing technique as it does about the need for carboys. I will say this, though, I have NEVER used both simultaneously.

As for bottles, you should know that imports have a slightly different size opening than North American ones. You can compensate but I stick with using domestic craft brew bottles to keep life simple. If I spend $25 or $30 for a case of craft beer, I think of it as buying the beer for $15 or $20 and getting $10 worth of bottles along with the beer. I hate buying empty bottles!

 

[DOGBOY]

I would get a kit, it has stuff like the capper and hydromete rand the filler and racking tubes,some even have beer kits and bottles,see coopers kit.go with a kit and get started, you can always build the ultimate system later,cheers

 

[SteveM]

I took a second look at the kit choices. What I use 99% of the time is the equivalent of the $59 kit. If I wanted to upgrade it, I would get the additional Better Bottle plus that kit for $79.

For extract brewing, this would be great to get started. Keep in mind that I'm not a fanatic about having top of the line gear, but the $59 kit will brew you up some damn good beer.

 

[eighteez]

great info guys, thanks!!!!!

I'll look this over in more detail and see whats what.

For the 5 gal boiling pot.... I'm hearing aluminum is as good as stainless. But a friend of mine said that aluminum has been linked to some serious diseases. Dunno how true that is, she's a bit of a worry wort...

What would you recommend for a 5 gal stainless pot?

 

[eighteez]

BTW, if you want to go full mash straight away, then you've got a LOT more to buy after that set!

I'm assuming this means vs malt extract?

I should have mentioned... I do know I need bottles.

 

[ZBrewMan]

I am newb at this too. I just bought my setup a few weeks ago and already have 4 brews under my belt.... two of which have sadly had some trouble

But! After having gone through the confusion myself and the inevitable mistakes that come along with it I think I can help with a couple things.

I think you have to ask yourself a question first. Is this a hobby that you think you'll stick with long term or just a passing interest?

There are only a few things that are really necessary to brew some beer

A pot to boil in
A bottle/bucket to ferment in
A bucket to bottle from
A thermometer & hydrometer
Tubing for siphoning and bottling (including an auto-siphon!)

The most important decisions you will probably make will be about your brew kettle and your fermenter. If you are not totally sure about this hobby then I would recommend something like a 7-gallon enamel pot and two buckets. One for fermentation and one for bottling. These are things that you can and probably will use even if you really get into this hobby and want to upgrade. The 7 gallon brew kettle will allow you to do full boils and will therefore accommodate you as you progress. Finally... DO NOT go for 5 gallon main fermenters! This is the mistake I made. Most batches of beer and recipes are made for 5 gallon batches. You will need a larger volume than 5 gallons in you fermenter to accommodate for the active fermentation.

Anyway... I'm definitely loving the hobby and hope you will too!!

Good luck and cheers

 

[SteveM]

There are claims that aluminum pots and pans are linked to Alzheimers. To my knowledge, this is unproven. However, I use stainless just in case. I got a four or five gallon pot at Kohl's for $16 - since I do partial boils, this is fine. If you start doing full boils, you will need to think about wort chillers.

 

[eighteez]

full boil / partial boil

I'm not clear on what this is... I see that recipes come in 5 gal sizes? so I figured I'd need a 5 gal pot.

When do you do a partial boil vs a full boil? Partial batches? What is partial?

DO NOT go for 5 gallon main fermenters!

in the kit I listed. The fermenters are the 6.5 gal buckets? Or the 5 gal carboy?

Brewing Starter Kit :: Midwest Supplies Homebrewing and Winemaking Supplies

I'm now leaning to this kit as a starting point since it seems I wont need the 2nd carboy. (what would I need 2 for anyway?)

The carboy is for secondary fermenting and storage until bottling yes? So I'd need 2 if I were doing 2 5 gal batches before bottling?

 

[ZBrewMan]

Also, have you checked out this post yet? A lot of great info here courtesy of llazy_llama!

 

[GunnerMan]

I think aluminum needs to first get disolved into your stuff to have any negative effects. I read somewhere that once you boil in it a few times it builds a coating that protects the metal from your beer or vice versa. I have a stainless steel 7.5 gal pot and a 5 gal stainless pot and a few other aluminum pots around for cooking. Any claims to aluminum are unproven and usually don't have much scientific backing. Probably just stainless companies trying to steal market share.


With that said I started out brewing with a 6 gal bucket, a bucket from the hardware store, a 2.5 gal pot, and a few feet of hose from the hardware store. If I could do it over I would have bought a basic kit with racking cane, hydrometer, capper, carboys etc all in one kit. Also if it is something you think you will get into I would "go big" first instead of buying small stuff and upgrading like I do/did. I would buy a turkey fryer(60 bucks) and a 60qt aluminum pot off ebay for 90 bucks. Now you can easily do full extract boils and if you want to go all grain you have a boil kettle, a sparge water pot, and a burner all capable of doing 10 gallon batches. Then all you need is a MLT and chiller.
Dunno if I could do it all again thats what I would have done but even if I only drink 1 beer a night around my house 5 gallons is gone within a week.

Also most 5 gallons buckets(like the ones in the hardware store) actually hold close to 6.5 gallons when topped off so they are def acceptable for fermentation especially if you are brewing smaller beers in cooler temps.

 

[ZBrewMan]

full boil / partial boil

I'm not clear on what this is... I see that recipes come in 5 gal sizes? so I figured I'd need a 5 gal pot.

When do you do a partial boil vs a full boil? Partial batches? What is partial?



in the kit I listed. The fermenters are the 6.5 gal buckets? Or the 5 gal carboy?

Brewing Starter Kit :: Midwest Supplies Homebrewing and Winemaking Supplies

I'm now leaning to this kit as a starting point since it seems I wont need the 2nd carboy. (what would I need 2 for anyway?)

The carboy is for secondary fermenting and storage until bottling yes? So I'd need 2 if I were doing 2 5 gal batches before bottling?

Ah, I misunderstood. Should have looked more closely. Yes the primary buckets in either kit are large enough for active fermentation. But I only think one of them comes with a lid. The bottling bucket might not. My bottling bucket did not come with a lid (which is necessary to ferment).

A partial boil is good when you don't have a very strong stove and/or don't have a big enough pot. You just boil 2-3 gallons of the brew (wort), then add the rest of the water needed to reach 5 gallons directly to the fermenter. Supposedly there is a sizable difference in the quality of the final product.

The kit you are now looking at is not bad at all. If you feel good about it, make the purchase. As you're beginning I wouldn't worry so much about secondary storage. Many of the veterans don't even use them for many of their batches.

 

[McGarnigle]

full boil / partial boil

I'm not clear on what this is... I see that recipes come in 5 gal sizes? so I figured I'd need a 5 gal pot.

The carboy is for secondary fermenting and storage until bottling yes? So I'd need 2 if I were doing 2 5 gal batches before bottling?

You can only brew about 3 gallons of beer in a 5 gallon pot because (a) lots of water boils off and (b) the boil is foamy, and you'd have boil overs. So with a 5 gallon pot you'd be doing a partial boil, and then "topping" off with water at the end to make 5 gallons. Full boils are better than partial, but require a huge kettle and a strong heat source.

You don't need to do any secondary for many beers, thus the two 5 gallon carboys may not be crucial.

 

[eighteez]

Well, now I'm leaning towards this kit:

Brewing Intermediate Kit- with Two 5 Gallon Better Bottle Carboys :: Midwest Supplies Homebrewing and Winemaking Supplies

I'm just not reading enough to tell me that glass carboys are a must. I like the idea of staggering batches so having 2 bottles for secondary seems like a must. The auto siphon is also in there.

This looks to be a good value. 7 gallons too.
Austin Homebrew Supply

and then I need to determine if I can do this on the stove. Something tells me I dont want to though... I think it'll be a safety issue... So perhaps a propane burner is a must.

After that, I need bottles. (I'll start saving them from store bought beer)

I'll need bottle caps. Any reason NOT to use Oxygen Absorbing caps?

I'm still not clear on the wort chiller. I'll need to investigate this more.

And I'll need a few recipes to start with.

I appreciate all the help, thanks a ton guys!!! (and gals, whatever applies)

 

[McGarnigle]

Well, now I'm leaning towards this kit:

Brewing Intermediate Kit- with Two 5 Gallon Better Bottle Carboys :: Midwest Supplies Homebrewing and Winemaking Supplies

I'm just not reading enough to tell me that glass carboys are a must. I like the idea of staggering batches so having 2 bottles for secondary seems like a must.

Glass carboys aren't a must vs. Better Bottles, but I still question why you'd need two vessels for secondary right now (those Better Bottles are both 5g). Many (most?) of us don't even do a secondary for most of our beers. I personally would rather have two ale pails to begin with.

I'll need bottle caps. Any reason NOT to use Oxygen Absorbing caps?

Cost. Unless you're bottling for long-term storage, they aren't necessary.

 

[eighteez]

but I still question why you'd need two vessels for secondary right now

Well... I'm not real sure.

Once batch 1 is fermenting, I'll want to be able to prepare another one. So I guess I need a 2nd fermenting bucket. Then either do all fermenting in the 1st buckets or xfer them to carboys/better bottles for secondary.

So 2 primaries and no secondaries. Or 2 of both. Depends on the method used I guess.

I'm looking at this from the "'Id rather get it upfront and be prepared vs halt everything and have to order again & pay more shipping." standpoint.

Does this make sense?

I guess if primary only is turning out good results I can skip the better bottles altogether.

 

[McGarnigle]

It certainly would benefit you to order more of it now, provided you think you'll really get into this and won't just quit after one batch.

I'd personally prefer two larger for primary and one 5 gallon for secondary. It's unfortunate that Midwest adds a second secondary rather than a second primary.

What if you went with their $89.95 kit (one primary pail, one bottling bucket, one glass 5g secondary) and just tacked on one more ale pail for $12?

6.5 Gallon plastic fermenter with lid :: Midwest Supplies Homebrewing and Winemaking Supplies

 

[eighteez]

yeah, I can look into that. I think there were some other differences too, auto-syphon etc....

Good point though.

 

[ZBrewMan]

You can use primary sized better bottles for secondary, but it's much trickier to use secondary sized (5g) bottles for primary fermentation. At this point I would go for all primaries.... (1,2, or 3?). With 3 you could leave each beer in primary for 3 weeks before bottling, and still be able to brew a new batch every week.

You're getting a lot of good advice, but I'm sure it's also confusing. I think you've got the basic idea... so just take a good guess and pull the trigger on something... chances are it'll work to get you started, and you'll be happy you did it!

 

[eighteez]

Yeah, I follow most of it. And the stuff we are talking about isn't an enormous expense if I change a few things later.

 

[BackBayBrewing]

If I had to do it all over again I'd probably purchase the Deluxe starter kit w/ glass carboys from Northern Brewer. It's about the same price as the one I purchased from my LHBS but a little better.

You'll also need a brew kettle. The 5 Gallon would be sufficient for a partial boil.

A little over $200 and your good to go.

BTW, I don't work for Northern Brewer, I just like their products and service.

Completely Agree! This is the kit that I bought when I started brewing about a year and a half ago. This kit rocks, and it will be plenty to get you really hooked on homebrewing. I also bought the 5 gal brew kettle mentioned and it works fine. Won't be long at all until you are completely hooked and ready to brew up your first All-grain batch. Happy brewing!

 

[eighteez]

So here is where I am headed now.

Brewing Starter Equipment Kit List:
Instructional Homebrewing Video or DVD
• 71 page instructional book
• 5 Gallon Better Bottle
• 6.5 Gallon Plastic Fermenter with Lid
6.5 Gallon Bottling Bucket with Spigot
• 8 Oz. of Easy Clean No-Rinse Cleanser
• Drilled Universal Carboy Bung Airlock (Keeps air out of the fermenter)
• Hydrometer (Determines alcohol content)
• Bottle Brush
• Carboy Brush
• Twin Lever Red Baron Bottle Capper
• Bottle Caps
• Liquid Crystal Thermometer
• Bottle Filler
• Fermtech AutoSiphon upgrade
• Siphon Tubing
• shutoff clamp

ADD Fermentor #2 with lid - 6.5 Gallon plastic fermenter with lid :: Midwest Supplies Homebrewing and Winemaking Supplies

$92

QUESTION - ?? airlocks for fermenters? Its not real clear if the fermenting buckets have airlocks. Are these needed? wanted?

 

[BackBayBrewing]

Yes, you absolutely want airlocks. These are essential to keeping bad stuffs out of your beer when in primary/secondary. Also, You are going to want to have at least one length of blow off tubing, which I don't see on that list. It may be that the kit includes it, but if not, you are going to want one.

I would suggest that if you are going to order the kit from Midwest, but are not completely sure if airlocks are included, call them up and ask. No sense spending the extra $ and then finding out that you have five air locks or something like that.

 

[BackBayBrewing]

If you are trying to make this as cheap as possible, then you should stick with the plastic fermenters. However, if you have the extra cash, I really like glass carboys, at least one. The major advantage is that they are less likely to scratch. If you get scratches in your plastic fermenters, bad things can grow in the scratches ruining later batches of beer. If you go plastic, just take care when cleaning and never use abrasive cleaning tools.

Another thing I really like about glass carboys or better bottles as opposed to plastic fermenting buckets: you can see through them and thus are able to peek at all the craziness going on inside when the yeast really start to party.

 

[eighteez]

Its not a cheap vs spending more thing. its the durability vs fragile thing with glass or plastic.

What I was gathering from my reading is that no one really had any strong reason for going glass. Except it looks cool, & you can see the fermenting process. But its more expensive and heavier to ship, easier to break etc.

 

[McGarnigle]

I suspect that airlocks are included with the kit, but if you order that extra fermenter, you need to add another airlock. It's cheap.

 

[McGarnigle]

If you go plastic, just take care when cleaning and never use abrasive cleaning tools.

Which also means not using that carboy brush they're sending you. Still, plastic is fine and, IMO, a better choice.

 

[eighteez]

Which also means not using that carboy brush they're sending you.

Right, I think thats an error. Elsewhere it says it doesnt come with it.

I'll check on the airlocks and the blow off tubing.

Is the blow off tubing how CO2 escapes from the airlocked fermenters?

 

[eighteez]

The blow off tubing - 1" Blow Off Tubing- per foot :: Midwest Supplies Homebrewing and Winemaking Supplies

It says that fits snug in the carboys. If I am not using the carboy for secondary fermenting but instead leaving it in the primary fermenter longer, how do we get blowoff tubing in there? Do we need to drill a 1" hole in the airlocked lid?

 

[McGarnigle]

You don't need a blowoff tube with an airlock. The airlock fits snugly into the lid of a plastic pale (small hole on top) and that's it.

For a carboy, whether glass or Better Bottle, you can either (a) put in a stopper with a hole and stick an airlock in that, or (b) shove the tubing you linked to into the opening itself without a stopper (it's wide tubing).

What's the difference? The blowoff tube allows more CO2 to escape. It would be used if you didn't have a lot of head space in your primary.

For the most part, ale pails need only airlocks. Carboys/Better Bottles can use stoppers + airlocks for secondary, as there isn't much fermenting going on then.

I don't think you actually need a blowoff tube now, though they're cheap and it cannot hurt.

 

[eighteez]

Fantastic.

I think I'm clear on equipment now. All I have left to decide is do I want a wort chiller and am I going to use a propane burner vs the stovetop.

On to recipes.

Would these 2 be good starter recipes?

Autumn Amber Ale w/ Munton's 6 gm dry yeast :: Midwest Supplies Homebrewing and Winemaking Supplies
Excelsior Altbier w/ Munton's 6 gm dry yeast :: Midwest Supplies Homebrewing and Winemaking Supplies

 

[BackBayBrewing]

Well, if the only thing you don't like about the glass carboys is that they are breakable, then I would recommend the Better Bottles. There is nothing wrong with the plastic fermenting buckets at all, but the Better Bottles are made out of a little bit harder plastic so they will be less likely to scratch, and also, they are see through. Finally, they are light, so they won't cost as much as a carboy to ship. But, if you go with the plastic buckets, they will certainly work great and make even greater beer. Just my 2 cents.

 

[BackBayBrewing]

You don't need a blowoff tube with an airlock. The airlock fits snugly into the lid of a plastic pale (small hole on top) and that's it.

For a carboy, whether glass or Better Bottle, you can either (a) put in a stopper with a hole and stick an airlock in that, or (b) shove the tubing you linked to into the opening itself without a stopper (it's wide tubing).

What's the difference? The blowoff tube allows more CO2 to escape. It would be used if you didn't have a lot of head space in your primary.

For the most part, ale pails need only airlocks. Carboys/Better Bottles can use stoppers + airlocks for secondary, as there isn't much fermenting going on then.

I don't think you actually need a blowoff tube now, though they're cheap and it cannot hurt.

This isn't entirely true. The need for blow off tubing is during the first few days of very active fermentation. Often times, depending on the beer you are brewing, the krausen will raise so high in the fermenter that it will actually come out of the top of the fermenter. This happens frequently. If you only have an airlock on your fermenter when this happens, the krausen will actually penetrate the airlock and sometimes come out the top and spill all over your fermenter, not to mention potentially clog up a double bubble type airlock. It makes sense to have the blow off tubing for the first few days of fermentation and then switch to an air lock after fermentation slows a bit.

 

[eighteez]

so how does a primary fermenter bucket with a lid and airlock use blowoff tubing? Does a hole need to be drilled?

 

[McGarnigle]

Fantastic.

I think I'm clear on equipment now. All I have left to decide is do I want a wort chiller and am I going to use a propane burner vs the stovetop.

On to recipes.

Would these 2 be good starter recipes?

Autumn Amber Ale w/ Munton's 6 gm dry yeast :: Midwest Supplies Homebrewing and Winemaking Supplies
Excelsior Altbier w/ Munton's 6 gm dry yeast :: Midwest Supplies Homebrewing and Winemaking Supplies

Sure, especially the Amber Ale. For the Altbier, that Munton's dry yeast won't do it any favors. I think Safale-K97 is the preferred dry yeast for it, and would be worth it even if you had to pay more. I would stay away from liquid yeast at first (though others may disagree).

You may want to spin "which recipe kit should i start with?" into a new thread. Get some new opinions from those who aren't following this one.