Heat source for fermentation chamber

[stpug]

Well, I downvote the Lasko MyHeat. Even though the price might be right, it's still to much heat. The overheat protection is a good thing, but for safety, there are better options.
Look at this for example. 5m @ 50w is a few bucks more than the Lasko, but a lot less heat density.

I think your Overestimating how much heat this thing puts out..yes 200W sounds like its outputting a furnace but its really not. Its hard to explain if you havent used it but its meant to be a desk heater pointed at your face so obviously its not going to be blowing scalding air out...it puts out a mildly warm air I find similar to say turning the heat on in your car. It works great with a BrewPi I can attest to using it for well over a year, but i could maybe see it being too powerful for the STC1000 to not prevent wild overshoots but even then i doubt it? Still its not that hot and takes a long time to heat up my 7Cft stand up freezer..

I bought and used the Lasko MyHeat for fermentations.... ONCE! There's something intuitively wrong about putting a heater in a small enclosed and sealed space (same as putting a light bulb in a can). I overheated the unit the first time (within the first hour) of use and that sealed the deal for me - I'll use it for my feet while I work . I'm not going to risk my house/property/family for a fermentation. Additionally, everyone knows the most inefficient way of heating something is by heating the ambient air around the actual thing you want to heat. I needed a more robust solution for my brewing needs as I'm playing anywhere from 30 to ~105F.

Imagine how hot the air around a fermenter gets while a lasko heater is trying to heat the liquid inside the fermenter 10°F with a probe in a thermowell. It quickly overheats itself. It takes a long time for the volume to come to the desired temperature.

Once I ruled out ambient heating devices, I went the heat tape (reptile heat tape) route. This has worked out exceptionally well and inexpensive too. The entire setup was <$20 and gets wrapped on my fermenter where it heats the actual fermenter. It can maintain temperatures up to about 100-110F depending on ambient air temperatures and the thing never gets hot to touch. I don't heat the air around the fermenter so there's no overshooting, and being half a millimeter thick means once it shuts off (STC1000+ controlled) it cools to the fermenter temperature within just a few seconds.

With the requirement of two fermenters at once, it changes things up a bit. I would still opt for leaning towards heating the fermenter and not ambient. In this case I would probably start with making a tape heater that's long enough to wrap both fermenters. As long as you have about the same amount of tape touching each fermenter then they should heat fairly evenly.

..at least that's my take on it.

 

[user 163849]

I guess I must be doing something wrong as mine has never done anything like that.

I generally cool my beer to or very near to the set temperature of the STC before I put the fermenting bucket in the fermenting fridge. I bungee a patch of insulation to the side of the bucket and place the probe of the STC between this insulation and the bucket. The beer in the bucket seems to "try" to remain constant and I have never had the heater nor the refrigerator run for more than 10 or 15 minutes at a time, usually much less as I do live in Texas and my setup is in a detached garage. Around here the heater does not get all that much time in service anyway but it has done a dandy job for me. I cannot imagine the beer cooling to the point that the little heater would have to run for an hour.

As for electrical safety, a shorted supply to a 50 watt heater will draw the same current as a shorted supply to a 1500 watt heater. If it is the element you are worried about, just like a light bulb they fail by burning open, in which case the same applies. The open 50 watt heater would draw the same 0 amps as the open 1500 watt heater. Of course all this apples to the 200 watt heater or any other for that matter.

And the lack of a tilt switch on the Lasko doesn't matter a little bit as it fits the door shelf quite snugly. The only way to flip that thing over would be to flip the entire refrigerator (or the entire garage) in which case there are bigger problems than a 200 watt heater.

 

[FuzzeWuzze]

I bought and used the Lasko MyHeat for fermentations.... ONCE! There's something intuitively wrong about putting a heater in a small enclosed and sealed space (same as putting a light bulb in a can). I overheated the unit the first time (within the first hour) of use and that sealed the deal for me - I'll use it for my feet while I work . I'm not going to risk my house/property/family for a fermentation. Additionally, everyone knows the most inefficient way of heating something is by heating the ambient air around the actual thing you want to heat. I needed a more robust solution for my brewing needs as I'm playing anywhere from 30 to ~105F.

Imagine how hot the air around a fermenter gets while a lasko heater is trying to heat the liquid inside the fermenter 10°F with a probe in a thermowell. It quickly overheats itself. It takes a long time for the volume to come to the desired temperature.

Once I ruled out ambient heating devices, I went the heat tape (reptile heat tape) route. This has worked out exceptionally well and inexpensive too. The entire setup was <$20 and gets wrapped on my fermenter where it heats the actual fermenter. It can maintain temperatures up to about 100-110F depending on ambient air temperatures and the thing never gets hot to touch. I don't heat the air around the fermenter so there's no overshooting, and being half a millimeter thick means once it shuts off (STC1000+ controlled) it cools to the fermenter temperature within just a few seconds.

With the requirement of two fermenters at once, it changes things up a bit. I would still opt for leaning towards heating the fermenter and not ambient. In this case I would probably start with making a tape heater that's long enough to wrap both fermenters. As long as you have about the same amount of tape touching each fermenter then they should heat fairly evenly.

..at least that's my take on it.

Again i am talking BrewPi..which has controls in place to prevent situations like yours from happening. Its just not possible for the fridge to be more than 15F above your set point unless you manually go and change the settings yourself. So the hottest your fridge will ever get is 85F-95F if your doing a Saison or something in the low 70's which is far from a fire hazard.

 

[ericbw]

I bought and used the Lasko MyHeat for fermentations.... ONCE! There's something intuitively wrong about putting a heater in a small enclosed and sealed space (same as putting a light bulb in a can). I overheated the unit the first time (within the first hour) of use and that sealed the deal for me - I'll use it for my feet while I work . I'm not going to risk my house/property/family for a fermentation. Additionally, everyone knows the most inefficient way of heating something is by heating the ambient air around the actual thing you want to heat. I needed a more robust solution for my brewing needs as I'm playing anywhere from 30 to ~105F.

Imagine how hot the air around a fermenter gets while a lasko heater is trying to heat the liquid inside the fermenter 10°F with a probe in a thermowell. It quickly overheats itself. It takes a long time for the volume to come to the desired temperature.

Once I ruled out ambient heating devices, I went the heat tape (reptile heat tape) route. This has worked out exceptionally well and inexpensive too. The entire setup was <$20 and gets wrapped on my fermenter where it heats the actual fermenter. It can maintain temperatures up to about 100-110F depending on ambient air temperatures and the thing never gets hot to touch. I don't heat the air around the fermenter so there's no overshooting, and being half a millimeter thick means once it shuts off (STC1000+ controlled) it cools to the fermenter temperature within just a few seconds.

With the requirement of two fermenters at once, it changes things up a bit. I would still opt for leaning towards heating the fermenter and not ambient. In this case I would probably start with making a tape heater that's long enough to wrap both fermenters. As long as you have about the same amount of tape touching each fermenter then they should heat fairly evenly.

..at least that's my take on it.

What are you fermenting at 100-110F??

 

[stpug]

What are you fermenting at 100-110F??

Lactobacillus. Some strains likes it up there to do their work quickly.

Saison. Some strains I'll take to 90-92F.

 

[alphaomega]

I think your Overestimating how much heat this thing puts out..yes 200W sounds like its outputting a furnace but its really not. Its hard to explain if you havent used it but its meant to be a desk heater pointed at your face so obviously its not going to be blowing scalding air out...it puts out a mildly warm air I find similar to say turning the heat on in your car. It works great with a BrewPi I can attest to using it for well over a year, but i could maybe see it being too powerful for the STC1000 to not prevent wild overshoots but even then i doubt it? Still its not that hot and takes a long time to heat up my 7Cft stand up freezer..

No, I don't overestimate. 200W is still 200W. Yes, since it has a fan, it won't get burning hot to the touch, as say a 60W light bulb (without a fan) will. But it still puts out way more power than needed. It is not a controller issue either, it is simply more heat than is needed.
You just need enough heat to slowly push the temp to where you want it. As long as you can reach it, you have enough. As it is an enclosed, insulated environment, a little heat goes a long way.
@stpug has got it right. The thing will be operating while you sleep and is at work, you won't be watching it like you would your home built brew controller on brew day. If your space heater works for you, then fine, I don't debate that it won't *work*.
Look at it this way, when were the last time you were in a car crash? I've never been. Guess, using seatbelts is pointless then.
I'm just saying that there are better and safer solutions. Something that won't overheat to the point where it could be dangerous, even if the controller fails, fan fails etc.

I've had this discussion before, and the replies I get are usually "It's worked for me for x years without a problem" and that I'm just crazy paranoid. That is ok, you make your own choices. I'm just putting in my opinion on the matter.

I'll give you that the space heater thingy isn't the worst thing I've seen, as it at least has overheating protection and is probably just about 4 times too much power.
But still, why should you, when you have the option, get something that is just somewhat unsafe and and out of spec, when you can get something that is safer AND better within specs for pretty much the same amount of money?

Finally, if you already have the space heater. Let me suggest opening it up, add a rectifying diode in series with the heater. This will halve the power output to 100W. While you have it open, also add a thermal fuse, if it doesn't have one (that is a thermal fuse, not the resettable overheating protection which is probably just a bimetal termostat).
Thermal fuse and a properly sized fuse is always a good idea.

 

[user 163849]

Wow, 100-110 degrees, you are way over my head. Nevermind, I have no idea how the little heater would work under those conditions. I have never tried to operate my system at those kind of temps.

I think I see now that not everybody expects the same thing from a ferm chamber heater. For my use, fermenting ales, in a somewhat mild environment, the Lasko 200 watt personal heater works fine under the control of my STC-1000. If you are not fermenting ales in my ferm chamber in my garage your mileage may vary..LOL