Graff (Malty, slightly hopped cider)

[Neonsilver]

I've made two batches of this so far using Mott's apple juice. The first one I followed the recipe to a T and used Mt. Hood hops. I found out that it is very good but has some tartness on the end of it and not as much head retention as I would like. So, for my second batch I still used the Mt. Hood and the 1/2 lb crystal 60 but also added another 1/2 lb of aromatic and one more ounce of torrified wheat. I threw in some cinnamon sticks for a little extra Holiday cheer as well. From the first taste of it while bottling I like it more already, real nice flavor and very smooth when going down.

 

[defenestrate]

4 gal juice
1 gal water
1 oz wheat
2 lb dme
10 oz c60, steeped.
S-04

SG 1048
FG 1004

carbed @ 3 weeks @ 35 psi for 48 hrs, im guessing 2.8-3 volumes?

still a tart/dry finish. next time i will go a full lb of crystal i think.

 

[Tonedef131]

What would happen if you used it in a beer? What kind of flavors would that kick out? Pardon the ignorance I've nerver done a cider before.

The biggest problem would be underattenuation. When yeast ferment monosaccharides they lose the ability to make the enzymes to break down disaccharides and will have a hard time fermenting the maltose.

 

[thepyrofish]

I'm very excited to try this cider out. I'm steeping my crystal as I type this!
I helped my dad with a couple beer kits in the last few years but this is my first brew on my own with my own equipment. Thanks to Brandon for the recipe and to everyone who posted in this thread for their input.

 

[chefchris]

I'm very excited to try this cider out. I'm steeping my crystal as I type this!
I helped my dad with a couple beer kits in the last few years but this is my first brew on my own with my own equipment. Thanks to Brandon for the recipe and to everyone who posted in this thread for their input.

long shot here, but are you a member of cigarsmokers.com?

 

[thepyrofish]

long shot here, but are you a member of cigarsmokers.com?

Sure am! Not that long of a shot really, I'm the only pyrofish online as far as I know. I haven't been posting much there lately but I'm still smoking. How have you been?


*To keep my post on topic, I've got about 10 minutes left in the boil. I'm using some fuggles (4.8% AA) I found at the brewshop earlier today. From what I've read I think these will work out much better for the graff than the cascade I already had.

EDIT: I've got everything together now. My OG ended up at 1.054 (I used 2.2lbs LME and another .5-.75 lbs DME so I figured it'd be higher). It turns out all 4 of my 5 gallon carboys are actually 6.5 gallon carboys!
I used Sun-Rype "fresh pressed opalescent apple juice", it's not from concentrate and it's just juice and vitamin c. It was a little pricey at $15 for 10.88L but it seems like the highest quality juice I could find. Maybe next batch I'll cheap out and see if I can tell the difference.

 

[greencoat]

Check out my recipe for Gunslinger's Graff. I made it based off the description from the Dark Tower books. Cheers!

 

[chefchris]

Sure am! Not that long of a shot really, I'm the only pyrofish online as far as I know. I haven't been posting much there lately but I'm still smoking. How have you been?

Been pretty good. Still have a ton of cigars as I haven't had time to smoke much lately. Too hot here in Florida.

 

[veeellgee]

Looking forward to brewing a batch of this on the weekend!

The boy is about to brew up a batch of Dark Saison, and has some White labs Saison 565 yeast left over - I think this will be a good fit as an alternative to Nottingham - any thoughts on that? Any feedback appreciated.

Probably going to use either progress or hallertau hops, depending on what the LHBS has when I drop by today

Will keep you posted on the progress!

 

[huknbuk]

So, I experienced a first for me. I cooked this up the other night (just a few, small tweaks). I used Safale US-05, didn't hydrate it, sprinkled it right in, it was bubbling through my blowoff tube in under an hour.

 

[titobandito]

So, I experienced a first for me. I cooked this up the other night (just a few, small tweaks). I used Safale US-05, didn't hydrate it, sprinkled it right in, it was bubbling through my blowoff tube in under an hour.

I don't hydrate Safale US-05 anymore either. It's just one more step that could possibly introduce an infection. It's always worked great so far.

 

[MrInternet]

So... I have had this in primary for a bit over two weeks now, and the krausen still hasn't fallen. Has anyone else noticed this? I used Safale-05 and the basic recipe as posted, subbing flaked wheat and 1 gallon of cranberry/raspberry. The krausen o this went like 4 or 5 inches, and seems to be taking it's sweet time...

I know, I know... RDWHAHB. Let the yeast do their job. I am honestly just curious...

 

[tsrblke]

I'm at 2 weeks in the primary and although my Krausen has long ago fallen, I'm still getting some substantial bubbling in my airlock (about 1/minute, which seems a lot all things considered). It's not exactly a small brew (my initial estimates put it at about 6.5-7%ABV) so my guess is it's just a long fermenter.

 

[tsrblke]

Random Aside, Any one have any idea at the amount of sugar/other starches left in this at the end of fermentation? My Dad's a Diabetic and wants to know if he can have one. I'd imagine it's not many given that all the fermentable sugars should be converented to Alcohol.

 

[titobandito]

I'm at 2 weeks in the primary and although my Krausen has long ago fallen, I'm still getting some substantial bubbling in my airlock (about 1/minute, which seems a lot all things considered). It's not exactly a small brew (my initial estimates put it at about 6.5-7%ABV) so my guess is it's just a long fermenter.

It's probably just off-gassing a little and nothing to worry about. Take a hydrometer reading now and again in a few days to see if the SG is still dropping. It can be very difficult to gauge fermentation by watching your airlock.

 

[HalfPint]

Alright, it's been in the primary for two weeks now and the FG is 1.010. I followed the recipe to the "T" using 120L and Kent Goldings.

This stuff is fantastic. It goes down smooth and finishes with a hint of apple. It has a mild brown color that I'd say is a tad bit darker than plain Apple Cider.


Sorry Ed, but this stuff kicks Apfewein square in the teeth (and it's only at two weeks)! I'm going to let it go for another couple of weeks and then it will go straight into the kegerator.

Thanks for the recipe sir,
J

 

[Recluse]

I found the taste changes considerably on aging. I really liked it when I bottled after 3 weeks. Nice and apple-y. After priming and bottle conditioning for a couple of weeks, it tasted very malty. More like beer with little or no apple taste. Then after a few more weeks in the bottle, a little more carbonation and the balance between the apple and malt was coming back. I made a batch of Apfelwein at about the same time, and I have to say I like the Apfelwein better at this point...but BOTH are very young and changing flavors whenever I crack open one.

GRAFF: Started on 5-Sep-2009, bottled on 27-Sep-2009
Apfelwein: Started 27-Aug-2009, bottled 7-Nov-2009)

 

[HalfPint]

I found the taste changes considerably on aging. I really liked it when I bottled after 3 weeks. Nice and apple-y. After priming and bottle conditioning for a couple of weeks, it tasted very malty. More like beer with little or no apple taste. Then after a few more weeks in the bottle, a little more carbonation and the balance between the apple and malt was coming back. I made a batch of Apfelwein at about the same time, and I have to say I like the Apfelwein better at this point...but BOTH are very young and changing flavors whenever I crack open one.

GRAFF: Started on 5-Sep-2009, bottled on 27-Sep-2009
Apfelwein: Started 27-Aug-2009, bottled 7-Nov-2009)

Apfelwein is just a little boring to me. I really enjoy the smoothness that the graff has compared to Apfelwein.

This probably derives from the fact that I'm much more of a beer person than a wine person and Apfelwein tastes a lot like white wine.

They're both good in their different ways. I wonder if adding the priming sugar changed the taste a bit. That's one of the reasons I quit bottling. I noticed a certain taste every time I bottled through the years.

I'm sure it's delicious,
J

 

[oparea]

I found the taste changes considerably on aging. I really liked it when I bottled after 3 weeks. Nice and apple-y. After priming and bottle conditioning for a couple of weeks, it tasted very malty. More like beer with little or no apple taste. Then after a few more weeks in the bottle, a little more carbonation and the balance between the apple and malt was coming back. I made a batch of Apfelwein at about the same time, and I have to say I like the Apfelwein better at this point...but BOTH are very young and changing flavors whenever I crack open one.

GRAFF: Started on 5-Sep-2009, bottled on 27-Sep-2009
Apfelwein: Started 27-Aug-2009, bottled 7-Nov-2009)

I wonder how well graff would age and taste after say a year in the bottle...I still have 2 set aside from June.

 

[tsrblke]

It's probably just off-gassing a little and nothing to worry about. Take a hydrometer reading now and again in a few days to see if the SG is still dropping. It can be very difficult to gauge fermentation by watching your airlock.

I'm not worried, I can't bottle until after Thanksgiving anyway. Three weeks in the Fermenter oughtta do it.

 

[paint_it_black]

All right, guys. I've been wanting to give this recipe a shot for a few weeks now, and today I finally made it happen. I did a batch based on Skybrew's all grain recipe (page 46). Because of cash constraints, as well as being unsure of how I'll like this concoction, I did a small, 2.5 gallon batch. Everything went pretty well, though the only size fermenters I have available are 6 gal carboys. I'm a bit unsure how it'll so, being such a small batch in such a big carboy with all that headspace, but I'm hoping for the best. I'll keep ya posted.

 

[HalfPint]

All right, guys. I've been wanting to give this recipe a shot for a few weeks now, and today I finally made it happen. I did a batch based on Skybrew's all grain recipe (page 46). Because of cash constraints, as well as being unsure of how I'll like this concoction, I did a small, 2.5 gallon batch. Everything went pretty well, though the only size fermenters I have available are 6 gal carboys. I'm a bit unsure how it'll so, being such a small batch in such a big carboy with all that headspace, but I'm hoping for the best. I'll keep ya posted.

I think it will be just fine. Gas from the yeast should fill up the head space creating a barrier to the fermenting wort, so it's not that big of a deal.

 

[Capa]

Brewed a 5g batch of this last night before our Thanksgiving feast. It's a bit cold here so the fermentation was slow coming, but it's picking up now (put my fermenter heater wrap on it). Used half an ounce of Crystal hops and 4g of Martinelli's apple juice. It smells nice and appley and am looking forward to this in a couple weeks.

 

[mtlcafan79]

Started mine on 10/6. Cracked the first bottle last night. Delicious. Slightly over carbed, but that was my fault. 1/2oz of Cascades in mine.

 

[PintOfBitter]

wow. life happened, and my graff sat in primary for like 2 months. it sat on a lot of yeast because it fermented on a leftover cake of Pacman. Kegged the graff today, and my nose was met with a pretty powerful yeast odor. Hoping for the best, preparing to dump it and try again. This stuff is cheap to make, and I have no time to drink less than optimal brew!

 

[paint_it_black]

So... I have had this in primary for a bit over two weeks now, and the krausen still hasn't fallen. Has anyone else noticed this? I used Safale-05 and the basic recipe as posted, subbing flaked wheat and 1 gallon of cranberry/raspberry. The krausen o this went like 4 or 5 inches, and seems to be taking it's sweet time...

I know, I know... RDWHAHB. Let the yeast do their job. I am honestly just curious...

I too used Safale 05, and mine has been in primary for a week, bubbles have slowed to one every 40-45 seconds, and I still have a few inches of kraeusen. Don't think I've ever seen that happen before, but then again, I've never made anything with apple juice before...

 

[MrInternet]

So... I have had this in primary for a bit over two weeks now, and the krausen still hasn't fallen. Has anyone else noticed this? I used Safale-05 and the basic recipe as posted, subbing flaked wheat and 1 gallon of cranberry/raspberry. The krausen o this went like 4 or 5 inches, and seems to be taking it's sweet time...

I know, I know... RDWHAHB. Let the yeast do their job. I am honestly just curious...

Ok... week 3.5 and the krausen is holding steady and 1.5 inches with large bubbles... I know it will fall eventually, but dang. Anyone had a krausen go this long? Is it peculiar to this brew?

 

[elbajista]

So NorthernBrewer.com doesn't have Crystal 60L, so will Caramel 60L be a good substitute?

 

[Freezeblade]

So NorthernBrewer.com doesn't have Crystal 60L, so will Caramel 60L be a good substitute?

Crystal malt = caramel malt

same thing.

 

[PintOfBitter]

So NorthernBrewer.com doesn't have Crystal 60L, so will Caramel 60L be a good substitute?

crystal 60 is another name for caramel 60. all good.