Give me a reason to not taste my beer yet!

[Stocktonbrew]

I say try one so you can see how much it changes over the weeks ahead. I tried mine that was only a week old last night....dumped it. It did help take the edge off of waiting though.

 

[homebrewdad]

I say try one so you can see how much it changes over the weeks ahead. I tried mine that was only a week old last night....dumped it. It did help take the edge off of waiting though.

I think that a lot of you folks must be the kind who peek at Christmas presents or even try to open the paper and rewrap them. I'd be pretty disappointed if I opened a bottle and it was so green that I felt the need to dump it. For me, it's so much better to wait and enjoy good beer.

Again, I said "for me". All you early testers should keep testing bottles - even pouring them out, if it makes you happy. Yay for the personal aspects of this hobby, you can do whatever you want.

 

[Yooper]

I think that a lot of you folks must be the kind who peek at Christmas presents or even try to open the paper and rewrap them. I'd be pretty disappointed if I opened a bottle and it was so green that I felt the need to dump it. For me, it's so much better to wait and enjoy good beer.

Again, I said "for me". All you early testers should keep testing bottles - even pouring them out, if it makes you happy. Yay for the personal aspects of this hobby, you can do whatever you want.

But here's the thing- I've NEVER poured out a "green beer". Never.

A well made beer doesn't need that long to condition. I can drink it as soon as it's carbed up, if made properly. I have one recipe I make all the time (oatmeal stout) that needs about two weeks after fermention is over to meld and condition a bit, for the flavors to blend. Otherwise, they are fine at bottling or kegging.

A long conditioning time might cover up some brewing mistakes, but I'd rather just fix the brewing mistakes and forgo the lengthy conditioning. I've made over 300 batches of beer, so I'm speaking from experience on this.

 

[Jayhem]

I usually taste my bottled beer at 7 days and then 14 days to see how the carbonating is going only if I'm impatient. If you brew more you will have a batch or 2 in bottles for a month before you even think to try one and THAT is the best thing to do! If you get the urge to try one premature...just brew another batch instead!

 

[homebrewdad]

But here's the thing- I've NEVER poured out a "green beer". Never.

A well made beer doesn't need that long to condition. I can drink it as soon as it's carbed up, if made properly. I have one recipe I make all the time (oatmeal stout) that needs about two weeks after fermention is over to meld and condition a bit, for the flavors to blend. Otherwise, they are fine at bottling or kegging.

A long conditioning time might cover up some brewing mistakes, but I'd rather just fix the brewing mistakes and forgo the lengthy conditioning. I've made over 300 batches of beer, so I'm speaking from experience on this.

I am well aware that you have brewed a TON of batches, have your process dialed in, and don't really need any aging. I bow to your prowess!

Do note that I gave my opinion, but also stated my respect for the position of those who try their beer even if it's not ready (their process is still inferior to yours, perhaps) - even if they want to try beer that they can't choke down.

I did not mean to imply that all who drink young beer are wasting it; if it's ready, it's ready... and if it isn't ready - but you're okay with that fact - have at it.

I would not dream of telling others what they SHOULD do with their beer. It's theirs, not mine. I share what I do and why (the OP did ask for opinions), but it's no skin off my back if somebody wants to guy buy an extra long silly straw, stick it through the airlock, and start sucking up beer right out of the fermenter. It's their beer, no?

Incidentally, though I am a "patience" guy, I haven't posted anything about long conditioning in this thread.

 

[Yooper]

I am well aware that you have brewed a TON of batches, have your process dialed in, and don't really need any aging. I bow to your prowess!

No need to be a jerk to people who don't subscribe to your method.

 

[homebrewdad]

No need to be a jerk to people who don't subscribe to your method.

Yooper, I sincerely, apologize if I came across that way. That was an honest statement, not a sarcastic one. I view you in the same light that I view some of the other real pros on the forum - the Dennys and Revvys of the world.

What you say about conditioning time not being needed due to great process makes complete sense. Since I am improving my own setup - I have temperature control now, and my next batch will be my first with oxygen - I will hopefully start to see some of this same benefit.

Again, my only intent here was to share my opinion on my why the OP should wait (opinions he asked for). I've discussed with others, yes, but in every post, I have attempted to establish that I don't think anyone is "wrong" for doing it differently than me.

 

[Hugh_Jass]

But here's the thing- I've NEVER poured out a "green beer". Never.

A well made beer doesn't need that long to condition. I can drink it as soon as it's carbed up, if made properly. I have one recipe I make all the time (oatmeal stout) that needs about two weeks after fermention is over to meld and condition a bit, for the flavors to blend. Otherwise, they are fine at bottling or kegging.

A long conditioning time might cover up some brewing mistakes, but I'd rather just fix the brewing mistakes and forgo the lengthy conditioning. I've made over 300 batches of beer, so I'm speaking from experience on this.

Well put, Yoop.

OP-follow meticulous sanitation procedures, pitch an adequate amount of healthy yeast, control your ferment temps to the lower 1/3 of the yeast's recommended range, and if you're an all grain brewer, understand your source water's chemistry. You'll have shorter "conditioning" times and will have a better product.

Slay that mythical beer-aging beast who lurks on this board!

 

[BrewinBromanite]

I always have a huge inner-battle going on with myself. I love to open that bottle of beer after it hits it's peak - usually somewhere between 3-5 weeks for mine. (I've only been brewing for a little over a year - with 12 batches under my belt). However, as much as I always tell myself I should wait longer, I always give in at the one week mark - to the minute. Just can't wait any longer. I never expect it to be perfect, and always try to wait at least 1 week (don't want to taste the priming sugar), and would prefer it slightly carbed. Most of the time they are under-carbed at 1 week - but I also LOVE to taste how the flavor came out (I also taste at bottling time), and to see how the aging process improves the flavor. A few days ago I broke my one-week rule, and opened a 6 day and 15 hour bottled Roasty RyePA. I was pleasantly surprised to find good carbonation, huge head, and awesome flavor (though still a little "rough" or "young" tasting). Experimentation and curiosity always gets the better of me. I say try it!!

And +1 to Yooper's 2-week point to reach delicousness! I'm not quite there yet (this last batch is my best tasting yet at 1 week, though...), but how will you ever know if your's are good to go sooner than 3 weeks if you don't try them!

 

[Homercidal]

I say just do it. Again.

What's the real risk?? One or two bottles that you don't get to enjoy later? It's worth it to see how beer can change flavor in a couple of weeks. You can make more.

Then when you see how much better it will probably be when it's really ready, AND you have a pipeline in place, you will not have a problem waiting.

I ALWAYS pour a glass from my taps even if it's not fully carbed. Who knows, maybe that first sip will be AWESOME?? It could happen.

That fist taste is probably not going to be too bad unless you are a NOOB who decided to throw everything including the kitchen sink in there, or fermented at 80 degrees.

 

[broadbill]

Is there some magical peak that is supposed to happen prior to week 3 in bottles, that I have somehow been missing?

I was going to ask you the same question...you were the only who mentioned "peak".

 

[MachineShopBrewing]

A well made beer doesn't need that long to condition. I can drink it as soon as it's carbed up, if made properly.

A long conditioning time might cover up some brewing mistakes, but I'd rather just fix the brewing mistakes and forgo the lengthy conditioning.

A little of topic, but, do you think if enough of us keep repeating this enough that it will ever catch on and rid us of the dogma of the long conditioning time being the best way to make beer?

Back on topic....

When I first started brewing I tried my beer every chance I could get. I did gravity readings, pH readings, taste tests all throughout fermentation and conditioning. I firmly believe that is the best way when you start out so that you can build a frame of reference going forward. I think it is important to do that in order to build a more complete knowledge what a beer tastes like in every stage and how the ingredients blend with fermentation and conditioning.

Once you have built your knowledge, then you can let things go, as you already know what it is going to taste like at each stage. Hell, I don't even take gravity readings on mine anymore until I am racking it to the keg.

 

[Bierliebhaber]

But here's the thing- I've NEVER poured out a "green beer". Never.

A well made beer doesn't need that long to condition. I can drink it as soon as it's carbed up, if made properly. I have one recipe I make all the time (oatmeal stout) that needs about two weeks after fermention is over to meld and condition a bit, for the flavors to blend. Otherwise, they are fine at bottling or kegging.

A long conditioning time might cover up some brewing mistakes, but I'd rather just fix the brewing mistakes and forgo the lengthy conditioning. I've made over 300 batches of beer, so I'm speaking from experience on this.

I agree, but I think there's more to it on certain styles. I've had 1.100 OG RIS batches fully enjoyable within 6 weeks. After kegging, carbing, and pouring off sediment for bulk aging I've had to stop myself partway through a keg to set it aside. While enjoyable young, there are a myriad of nuances that come with maturity/aging on a beer like this. Nonetheless, this really only applies to a few. On the other hand, there are certain beers I won't buy if their production date is too far gone, even a few months.

 

[Evan_L]

Taste it! Why not, a batch might get you ~50 bottles, 1 or 2 "wasted" is only 2-4% of the total, not enough to make a dent. It will give you great feedback on what happens to the flavors along the way! I bottled one last week, thought it would take 2-3 to even be decent. Tried it last night and whoa, pretty damn tasty and even fairly carbed! If anything tasting along the way has taught me the value of patience in the long run, my first batch was gone before the 4 week bottled mark, now they last longer cuz I know what will happen.

 

[IffyG]

I say taste it - it will help you understand how a beer develops. Not helping am I?

Agreed. I wouldn't make a habit out of it, but I believe it's a great exercise for a new homebrewer to see exactly how the beer carbs and conditions over the course of a few weeks. I'd say try a bottle every third day or so and take notes. Once you do this once or twice, the urge to 'sample' early on will be greatly diminished.

 

[IffyG]

A little of topic, but, do you think if enough of us keep repeating this enough that it will ever catch on and rid us of the dogma of the long conditioning time being the best way to make beer?

Unfortunately, a very vocal minority pushes the long primary as gospel around here. However, as with almost everything else in homebrewing, there is quite a bit of personal preference.

 

[citingzero]

Funny. I've started a war here...

 

[MachineShopBrewing]

Funny. I've started a war here...

Hahahahaha..... You are new to this forum, aren't you?

But seriously, there are some great discussions on many sides of all issues with passionate people on all sides. That is what makes the forum great. If we all got together to sing kumbaya all the time, the forum would be boring and people wouldn't discuss things.

 

[JLem]

Unfortunately, a very vocal minority pushes the long primary as gospel around here. However, as with almost everything else in homebrewing, there is quite a bit of personal preference.

I think the "push" for a long primary/conditioning thing is really a statement that it is OK, and sometimes preferred, to have a long primary/conditioning time. When in doubt, wait it out. Too many folks rush their beers. So, as a way to deter this, the mantra has been "3 weeks in primary, 3 weeks in bottles". I have come around to the idea that 3 weeks is not necessary, though it certainly will not hurt. Some beers are done in 7 days and fully carbed in another 10. But this doesn't mean you can't leave it for 21 days in primary (or more) and 21 days in the bottle (or more).

Unfortunately, this has lead to the idea that a beer MUST be left in primary for 3-4 weeks and bottle conditioned for 3 weeks otherwise you risk having bad beer. Brewing is much much too dynamic to pigeonhole every beer into the same timeline.

 

[Yooper]

I think the "push" for a long primary/conditioning thing is really a statement that it is OK, and sometimes preferred, to have a long primary/conditioning time. When in doubt, wait it out. Too many folks rush their beers. So, as a way to deter this, the mantra has been "3 weeks in primary, 3 weeks in bottles". I have come around to the idea that 3 weeks is not necessary, though it certainly will not hurt. Some beers are done in 7 days and fully carbed in another 10. But this doesn't mean you can't leave it for 21 days in primary (or more) and 21 days in the bottle (or more).

Unfortunately, this has lead to the idea that a beer MUST be left in primary for 3-4 weeks and bottle conditioned for 3 weeks otherwise you risk having bad beer. Brewing is much much too dynamic to pigeonhole every beer into the same timeline.

Yeah, I think that's what it is. I'm glad that the tide has turned- it used to be mantra that you must "get your beer off of the yeast as soon as possible to avoid autolysis!". I'm happy to see that dogma has been overturned.

But that fact that you "may" leave the beer in the primary for longer without ill effect seems to have turned into you "must" leave the beer in primary for XX weeks or your beer will be bad.

Neither of those is true.

What IS true: leaving the beer in the fermenter until finished, and then a few more days (1-3+) will ensure that the yeast have a chance to finish fermentation, and then go into their "clean up" phase and finish. It will start to clear. It's fine to package then, but no harm will come if it stays in the fermenter longer to clear more.

Some differences in flavor will appear after a long primary- some prefer these yeast characters, and some don't. That's personal preference. There is a difference between preference and fact, though!

 

[BrewinBromanite]

I know this has now gone a little off topic - but... Obviously you can still make beer with minimal time in the primary (just long enough to finish fermentation), and minimal time in the bottle (long enough to carb up). This is in fact what was on the first set of instructions from my LHBS. And...the beer wasn't that good. Granted, it was a canned pre-hopped kit, so I really had no knowledge or control over what was really going into it at the time, and the instructions didn't really mention temperature control at all (other than coolest, darkest place in the house).

However, this forum has taught me more than any instruction-set ever could. From my limited experience, at least 2 weeks in the primary is better than 1 in most cases (3-4 even better if you can wait), and at least 2 weeks in the bottle is better than one. This is, IMO, the best part about homebrewing. There's a million ways to make good beer - and tasting along the way is part of the fun in this hobby, if you choose to. It's how I've learned to get better. As Yooper has noted, if your process is down to a science, then it will probably be great in a short period of time. If it's not perfect, then some aging will probably benefit - but not every time.

My 1st canned bock kit from 14 months ago, now actually tastes like a crisp, clean lager after aging in the bottle for over a year (which tasted pretty terrible for most of the past year). I saved a few just to see what a year of aging did. It did take that long to clean up all the nasty off-flavors from fermenting probably in the mid-80's. And now 14 months later, with so much more knowledge, changes in setup, process, etc..., my last batch was carbed and tasted great at one week. Either way, for me it's part of the fun to taste along the way.

Some of my batches are great between 3-5 weeks,... but then go down hill pretty rapidly from there - so I've actually learned to not worry so much about over-aging (unless you screwed up somewhere along the way in the brewing process), and to just enjoy them if they taste good. But I guess I'm rambling now. Sorry for the long reply - I think I need a beer! Is it Friday yet?

 

[the_trout]

I made a beer last year that was truly awful. It tasted like someone mixed brown sugar and gasoline. I let it sit for about 6 weeks and it didn't get any better so I ended up dumping all but a 12pk of it. I needed the bottles. I forgot all about that 12pk until last week when I was moving some stuff around the basement and noticed it sitting in a forgotten corner. On a whim I put one in the fridge and tried it a few days later.

Lo and behold, my hot mess of a beer had finally grown up. Now its still not a great brew but its more than drinkable. What was once an overwhelming sweetness had mellowed into a nice malt backbone. The hot alcohol burn had completely disappeared. And while the flavor of centennial hops was not distinguishable there was a pronounced bitterness that balanced the malt well. In retrospect I wish I had cellared it all but for now I'll enjoy my CT-A3 Centennial American Amber Ale and know going forward that time truly is on my side.

 

[homebrewdad]

I made a beer last year that was truly awful. It tasted like someone mixed brown sugar and gasoline. I let it sit for about 6 weeks and it didn't get any better so I ended up dumping all but a 12pk of it. I needed the bottles. I forgot all about that 12pk until last week when I was moving some stuff around the basement and noticed it sitting in a forgotten corner. On a whim I put one in the fridge and tried it a few days later.

Lo and behold, my hot mess of a beer had finally grown up. Now its still not a great brew but its more than drinkable. What was once an overwhelming sweetness had mellowed into a nice malt backbone. The hot alcohol burn had completely disappeared. And while the flavor of centennial hops was not distinguishable there was a pronounced bitterness that balanced the malt well. In retrospect I wish I had cellared it all but for now I'll enjoy my CT-A3 Centennial American Amber Ale and know going forward that time truly is on my side.

Heh. Not exactly what the OP was after, here, but a great entry to Revvy's "never dump your beer" thread.

 

[the_trout]

Heh. Not exactly what the OP was after, here, but a great entry to Revvy's "never dump your beer" thread.

Right, Im completely off topic but I just wanted to tell my beer story.

I should go find that that thread and post there.

 

[Avocet]

Taste it after 5-6-7 days--it will probably be flat, sweet, insipid, pretty lousy. Barely a 'whoosh' as you pulled the cap. The experience will probably even bum you out a bit. Lot of work for nothing! Give it 4-5 more days. Better. Not as flat. Certainly not good-you would be embarrassed to share with friends--to put your name on it. Another week. Hmm. Drinkable at least. Yet another week. Wow this stuff is straightening out pretty well!

And forget a couple bottles or a sixer down in the very corner of that closet-you know way behind the bottles you've washed and are parked upside-down in the original cartons for another life---dig them out after 75-90 days-you just slap forgot about those didn't you! -dust 'em off--put them in frig---and kick your own ass for drinking the other 42 so early!!

 

[homebrewdad]

Right, Im completely off topic but I just wanted to tell my beer story.

I should go find that that thread and post there.

lol good thing you're in a place that likes beer stories.

 

[Hackwood]

Where I'm from, only "Girly-boyz" drink beer before 3 weeks!!!!

 

[citingzero]

My original post wasn't exactly a serious post. I was totally planning on tasting a few along the way to begin with. I'm smart enough not to pass judgement so quick or be disappointed. I just like to see how the beer changes. I was more just expressing excitement over the fact that it was pretty tasty at bottling (warm and flat).

Anyway I cracked one open tonight (after 6 days in the bottle... I'm not ashamed). There was no head but I could feel the tingle of carbonation. And the beer was really tasty. A little sweet still, but tasty. I would be satisfied if it was the final product. The fact that I know that it's only going to get better AND I have a reference point just makes it that much more exciting.

 

[Ridire]

You corrupted me, too. But my first green beer corrupted me to drink my second green beer.

 

[whitehause]

Screw it.....crack one open. :rockin:
I'm sittin here drinking a Pliny clone I put in the keg 2 days ago. Still not great carb, but tasty just the same.
Like others have said, at worst it'll give you and idea how beer changes with age.