Actually that terminology was used before yeast was really well understood and porters referred to any very dark beer whereas ales were lighter colored beers that were not lagered.
Funny things you've overheard about beer
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Actually that terminology was used before yeast was really well understood and porters referred to any very dark beer whereas ales were lighter colored beers that were not lagered.
PhelanKA7 said:
Interesting, but still, the relationship of the last three to beer is still displayed wrong in this list. The wording here suggests that these are 4 completely different types of beverage of their own, when we all know that ales and lagers, different from each other, are not different from beer. All of the last 3 listed fall under beer (even by those outdated definitions). A colon or semicolon rather than comma after beer would be more appropriate, and by the -current- definitions of ale and porter, it should not be listed as a separate entity categorized with ales and lagers, but under ales. But I'm assuming you know all this and just like to skew things for arguments sake. I don't usually play grammar police, but this is a published book we are talking about not just a forum post, this is either poor writing, or as someone earlier suggested, a misunderstanding of these relationships by the author.
To put it more simply you could not say, "I don't like beer, but I like ale."
Or
"I like porters, but I do not like ales." at least not by the current definition anyway (unless you specified Baltic porters I suppose, or you existed back when the definitions you mentioned were current.)
GrogNerd
mean old man
I would buy this argument if the book was published in 1824
WesleyBrewViking
Well-Known Member
That's the one. I've got the hardcover edition, too. After reading a bit, I realised the "beers, lager, ales, porters" thing on the cover was probably added by someone at the publishing company, because the inside uses much better terminology.
Yes, lagers came before the invention of porters which came before the knowledge of yeast's role in brewing, but to quote GrogNerd:
Here in the 21st century, I wouldn't ask a guest "What kind of beer do you want? We've got beers, lagers, ales and porters. Take your pick."
I agree that at least a semi colon should've come after "Beer". It's a generic term.
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Point being the terminology is not incorrect. It's slightly archaic is all. Like naming your antique store "Ye Olde Shoppe."
WesleyGatzke said:Here in the 21st century, I wouldn't ask a guest "What kind of beer do you want? We've got beers, lagers, ales and porters. Take your pick."
I think a lot of the people we have quoted in this thread for saying funny things about beer might answer this question without skipping a beat to sound knowledgeable haha might be fun to try one time. Then give them something completely different from what they ask for, and come back and tell us about it...
GrogNerd
mean old man
technically, it IS incorrect.
it's like writing a book called BEEF OF THE WORLD: over 350 classic beef, burgers, steaks and sirloins
or like telling me, "meet my wife and my sister" and there's only one woman with you
It's how the word "beer" is used in this context. It's a generic term being used as a pronoun. Hence the need for a colon. Even my comm profesors would argue this point.
GrogNerd
mean old man
Either drop all after the word beer,or insert a colon.
It's an English brown ale. Goes down easy and most certainly drinkable, albeit the style not being my favorite anymore.
GrogNerd said:
Here in Arkansas we wouldn't even bat an eye...
Of course most don't even know what a porter is either.
GrogNerd
mean old man
watching Big Fat American Gypsy Wedding and one of the couples was from West Virginia & had to get married in Virginia because they were first cousins
another funny about that show (out of many) is that the brides try and outdo each other on the size and sparkle of their wedding dresses. One bride's dress was delivered in THREE large boxes and she didn't put it on, she ENTERED IT
was nearly impossible for her to get through doorways out of her house and it would NOT FIT into the limo to take her to the church for her ceremony
and I'm thinking, "hmmm... wonder why there aren't more female ENGINEERS"
No, technically it ISN'T. It is archaic, not incorrect.
Bierliebhaber
Well-Known Member
The following review, though not authoritative, may shed light on whether the author's understanding and title are likely "inaccurate" or benefit of the doubt lends to "archaic."
OK so this book does a descent job of introduction to beer for the novice. And when I say novice, I mean someone who has never drinken or been to a place that sells beer. So does anyone really need to know about Bud, Labbats, Molson, Coors, Old Milwaukee, Miller, or any other of the crap macros??? Really???
So on to the innacuracies:
P. 42. Hair of the Dog Fred is not a lager, it is a strong golden ale. None of HOTD beers are lagers.
P. 59. Post Road is a brewery owned by F.X. Matt and it is brewed in Utica, not Brooklyn.
P. 66 Stone Ruination is not an IPA, it is an Imperial (or Double) India Pale Ale. In addition, most IPAs are not in the range of 5-5.5% abv. Oficcially speaking, IPAs are anywhere between 5.5-7.5% abv.
I have found many others but I will stop here. No need to beat a dead horse.
Now, onto what it is missing.
BREWPUBS!!! There is not a single mention of beers at brewpubs. As such PP Solano beach, PP Carlsbad, PP San Clemente, Oggi's, Elysian, Russian River, Sly Fox, Vermont Pub and Brewery, The Cambridge house, Flossmoor Station, The Town Hall, and oh so many other great beers are not in the American section.
Ok so lets say that he only wanted to cover the breweries that were mainly bottlers. I can live with that. So where are Dogfish Head, Three Floyds, Alesmith, Avery and Jolly Pumpkin. Oh wait, their space must have been taken up by the pages of Michelob Ultra and Old Style.
Canada: One of the finest brewers in the world is in Motreal. While Dieu Du Ciel! is a brewpub, they do bottle and a discussion of current Canadian beer cannot be complete without them.
Britain: Pardon me but isn't the writter Brittish? Where are Samuel Smith's, J.W. Lee's, Thomas Hardy's, Courage RIS, and oh I don't know...Bass No. 1???
Austria and Switzerland: The most recognizable and noteworthy beer that either one of these countries ever made is Samichlaus. Not even a mention?
Belgium: Well I could write a lot about what is missing from this, I'll try to keep it short. He starts the chapter with a short discussion of Lambic beers. That's good. Then he states that sometimes the beers are mixed with fruit to make Gueuze. This is an incorrect statement and shows a serious lack of understanding by the author. Gueuze, in most cases, is a blend of 1, 2, and 3 year old lambic unless it is Oude Gueuze and then it is just the 3 year old. Lambic mixed with fruit is named by the fruit it is mixed with; Framboise, Kriek, Cassis, and so on. He then shows only two examples in the chapter of lambic producers, Mort Subite and Lindeman's. Ever heard of Cantillon??? A discussion of lambic cannot be made without the mention of Cantillon. They are the most traditional and well respected of Lambic producers. Lindeman's Gueuze is the only Gueze shown. That is the least respected of the Gueuze style because it is pasteurized and has artificial sweetners. If he wanted to stick to Lindeman's, the Cuvee Rene would have been a much better choice as it is a more authentic beer. There is also no mention of the beer Orval's brett characteristics or of how the beer has changed since they have moved to closed secondary feremnters. I would also like to mention that none of the Westvleteren line were included, easily the most sought after beers of Belgium
Australia: Foster's gets it's own page and Cooper's doesn't even get a mention. Nuff said.
OK so this book does a descent job of introduction to beer for the novice. And when I say novice, I mean someone who has never drinken or been to a place that sells beer. So does anyone really need to know about Bud, Labbats, Molson, Coors, Old Milwaukee, Miller, or any other of the crap macros??? Really???
So on to the innacuracies:
P. 42. Hair of the Dog Fred is not a lager, it is a strong golden ale. None of HOTD beers are lagers.
P. 59. Post Road is a brewery owned by F.X. Matt and it is brewed in Utica, not Brooklyn.
P. 66 Stone Ruination is not an IPA, it is an Imperial (or Double) India Pale Ale. In addition, most IPAs are not in the range of 5-5.5% abv. Oficcially speaking, IPAs are anywhere between 5.5-7.5% abv.
I have found many others but I will stop here. No need to beat a dead horse.
Now, onto what it is missing.
BREWPUBS!!! There is not a single mention of beers at brewpubs. As such PP Solano beach, PP Carlsbad, PP San Clemente, Oggi's, Elysian, Russian River, Sly Fox, Vermont Pub and Brewery, The Cambridge house, Flossmoor Station, The Town Hall, and oh so many other great beers are not in the American section.
Ok so lets say that he only wanted to cover the breweries that were mainly bottlers. I can live with that. So where are Dogfish Head, Three Floyds, Alesmith, Avery and Jolly Pumpkin. Oh wait, their space must have been taken up by the pages of Michelob Ultra and Old Style.
Canada: One of the finest brewers in the world is in Motreal. While Dieu Du Ciel! is a brewpub, they do bottle and a discussion of current Canadian beer cannot be complete without them.
Britain: Pardon me but isn't the writter Brittish? Where are Samuel Smith's, J.W. Lee's, Thomas Hardy's, Courage RIS, and oh I don't know...Bass No. 1???
Austria and Switzerland: The most recognizable and noteworthy beer that either one of these countries ever made is Samichlaus. Not even a mention?
Belgium: Well I could write a lot about what is missing from this, I'll try to keep it short. He starts the chapter with a short discussion of Lambic beers. That's good. Then he states that sometimes the beers are mixed with fruit to make Gueuze. This is an incorrect statement and shows a serious lack of understanding by the author. Gueuze, in most cases, is a blend of 1, 2, and 3 year old lambic unless it is Oude Gueuze and then it is just the 3 year old. Lambic mixed with fruit is named by the fruit it is mixed with; Framboise, Kriek, Cassis, and so on. He then shows only two examples in the chapter of lambic producers, Mort Subite and Lindeman's. Ever heard of Cantillon??? A discussion of lambic cannot be made without the mention of Cantillon. They are the most traditional and well respected of Lambic producers. Lindeman's Gueuze is the only Gueze shown. That is the least respected of the Gueuze style because it is pasteurized and has artificial sweetners. If he wanted to stick to Lindeman's, the Cuvee Rene would have been a much better choice as it is a more authentic beer. There is also no mention of the beer Orval's brett characteristics or of how the beer has changed since they have moved to closed secondary feremnters. I would also like to mention that none of the Westvleteren line were included, easily the most sought after beers of Belgium
Australia: Foster's gets it's own page and Cooper's doesn't even get a mention. Nuff said.
You were wrong. I corrected you. No shame in that.
GrogNerd
mean old man
technically, you attempted to correct ME
Marauder was just explaining why your attempt failed
so! back on topic
whole famn damily over to my brother's house this weekend for late Christmas get together and I bring some of my homebrew
sister: it tastes like BEER!
Marauder was just explaining why your attempt failed
so! back on topic
whole famn damily over to my brother's house this weekend for late Christmas get together and I bring some of my homebrew
sister: it tastes like BEER!
Well back to some humor...
My fiance isn't a big drinker and when she does it pretty much consists of either Michelob Ultra or moscato wine. I do have her try almost everything I have but have rarely been able to break her of her habits. One night though....She said she could pick Mich Ultra out of a blind taste test of light beers without question.
Me and my buddies laughed a bit and set up 5 samples - Mich Ultra/Bud Light/Coors Light/PBR/Miller Lite.
She ranked as follows:Best->Worst
Coors Light
Bud Light
PBR
Mich Ultra
Miller Lite.
She looked at me when she had the Coors Light and said that it was most definitely Mich Ultra and was the best. She absolutely hated Mich Ultra when she tried it in the test.
I keep telling her I'm going to buy her Coors Light whenever we go out as that was her favorite, and she keeps giving me the death stare. I still laugh about it though.
My fiance isn't a big drinker and when she does it pretty much consists of either Michelob Ultra or moscato wine. I do have her try almost everything I have but have rarely been able to break her of her habits. One night though....She said she could pick Mich Ultra out of a blind taste test of light beers without question.
Me and my buddies laughed a bit and set up 5 samples - Mich Ultra/Bud Light/Coors Light/PBR/Miller Lite.
She ranked as follows:Best->Worst
Coors Light
Bud Light
PBR
Mich Ultra
Miller Lite.
She looked at me when she had the Coors Light and said that it was most definitely Mich Ultra and was the best. She absolutely hated Mich Ultra when she tried it in the test.
I keep telling her I'm going to buy her Coors Light whenever we go out as that was her favorite, and she keeps giving me the death stare. I still laugh about it though.
Ostomo517
Well-Known Member
While on vacay in Chicago Ohare AP, we decided to go to the Goose Island Brew Pub while we waited for our delayed plane. Walked up to the bar and couldnt read the taps so I asked the bartender, which of thier beers they had on tap he stopped walked to the taps and read them back to me (Im thinking ok maybe they get changed often thats why the bartender in a craft pub doesnt know thier own brands) Next I order Goose Island Green Line, and ask him what type of beer it is. Once again he stops and pulls out a "cheat card" and after about 30 seconds informs me its a very sessionable pale ale. Maybe not so funny but blows my mind how you would have someone so ignorant of your brews working behind your bar.
A friend opened a Smoking Wood from the Bruery, which he bought and paid for, had much trouble with his serving, and later stated by him and the wife, that it might make a good marinade. Needless to say, I ended up going home with the other half of the bottle.
rifraf
Well-Known Member
You would have had a very different experience at the GIs in the city. I believe the ones in the airports are nothing more than a a generic bar with HMS Host employees. Sucks that it happens though, and people associate it with Goose Island.
bigebrewer
Active Member
So if someone says the world is flat, they aren't wrong, they are just being archaic?
My favorite thing said was when one of my buddies came over right after I started making home brew. I showed him my equipment, etc, and showed him the cabinet that I keep my bottles in when they were carbing up. He told me that my beer was going to be ruined, I asked him why, and he said that once beer made you have to keep it in the refrigerator all the time or it will skunk.
Ostomo517
Well-Known Member
Pretty sure your right on that one, being Chicago wasnt the final destination didnt get to hit the ones in the city but should be spending a few days there soon.
WesleyBrewViking
Well-Known Member
I had a friend (a self proclaimed hophead) help me brew a batch of American Amber Ale a little while ago, that i calculated in the mid-40s IBUs (a bit on the high side for an AAA). When I told him the style we were brewing, he said that he's "never had an amber ale that he liked" and that he prefers something hoppier, like a Corona. I just smiled and said "Don't worry, I'm putting lots of hops in this batch."
