Full volume grant/transfer cistern

[Bramling Cross]

Having recently donated a kidney, I’m restricted from lifting heavy stuff for several weeks. A long-standing flaw in my 5-6gal, three vessel apartment brewery is transferring the boil kettle from its position below the MLT for wort collection to its position on the gas range top where it boils the wort with the aid of a heatstick. This didn’t used to be an issue, but as I approach fifty, that 7-8gals of pre-boil volume seems to be getting heavier with each year.

In other words, I’ve already been putting some thought into this issue and it seems that repurposing an old 10gal kettle below the MLT, filling it with the pre-boil volume, then pumping the entire volume up to the boil kettle is a low-cost solution with little downside, apart from added HSA concerns.

So here’s the question: Is there anything sexy or clever that I can build into this full volume grant/transfer cistern? I get clear runoff from the MLT, so filtering is deep into diminishing returns. There’s no need for float switches like you’d see on a conventional grant since this vessel will be full volume.

The vessel’s design is currently a 10gal kettle with a ball valve and dip tube.

Anyway, I figured I’d run the design past you clever, clever boys before I start drilling.

Appreciate your time!

 

[bailey mountain brewer]

If you're gonna add a pump, why not just pump from the mash tun to the boil kettle already resting on the stove and skip the grant altogether? You could then begin heating the wort as you transfer to cut down on the wait time to boiling.

 

[ba-brewer]

I do a similar thing when I do 10gal batches but use a smaller kettle and do multiple transfer while the mash drains.

I added a back flow valve to the pump output to keep the brew kettle from reverse flowing back into the grant if the pump turns off.

I use a little tan solar pump for the transfer and it need to be primed to get going which can be issues at time.

edit: I believe the back flow valve is really a check valve

 

[OakIslandBrewery]

First off congratulations for donating your kidney. That's a huge sacrifice considering the hobby we are in.

To your question, I use exactly what you are pondering. I use my build as a filtering grant. I drain from the mash tun then pump to the boil kettle and again from the boil kettle to the plate chiller. It also acts as an accumulator so I can regulate the flow between equipment. I have a valve at the bottom and also one on the outlet of the pump.

I fabricated it from a legally purchased quarter barrel, top cut off, added a bottom drain, wheels and a 400 micron basket.

I brew 10-15 gallon batches and use it on all of my brews so no heavy lifting of hot wort. Yeah it's another piece of equipment to clean but it saves a lot in other ways.

 

[Climb]

A pump is a good option for you and are always handy to have around. But if you don't already have a full size grant and pump, why can't you stop the launter from the MLT when the BK is only partially full. Transfer the BK to the stove top. Then use another pot to continue the launter and transfer this to the BK before is gets to heavy. You might need to do this several times to drain the MLT while keeping the weight manageable.

 

[Broken Crow]

Apologies if I'm just not understanding your setup correctly, but why not just pump it to the stovetop through a filter such as this?:
https://www.brewershardware.com/Wor...lover-Compatible-Strainer-with-3-OD-Body.html

 

[Bobby_M]

Having recently donated a kidney, I’m restricted from lifting heavy stuff for several weeks. A long-standing flaw in my 5-6gal, three vessel apartment brewery is transferring the boil kettle from its position below the MLT for wort collection to its position on the gas range top where it boils the wort with the aid of a heatstick. This didn’t used to be an issue, but as I approach fifty, that 7-8gals of pre-boil volume seems to be getting heavier with each year.

In other words, I’ve already been putting some thought into this issue and it seems that repurposing an old 10gal kettle below the MLT, filling it with the pre-boil volume, then pumping the entire volume up to the boil kettle is a low-cost solution with little downside, apart from added HSA concerns.

So here’s the question: Is there anything sexy or clever that I can build into this full volume grant/transfer cistern? I get clear runoff from the MLT, so filtering is deep into diminishing returns. There’s no need for float switches like you’d see on a conventional grant since this vessel will be full volume.

The vessel’s design is currently a 10gal kettle with a ball valve and dip tube.

Anyway, I figured I’d run the design past you clever, clever boys before I start drilling.

Appreciate your time!

I always pause before avoiding the specific question and playing devil's advocate, but I think I should anyway. If your 3-vessl process is cumbersome and strenuous, I don't think adding another vessel, pump and plumbing is going in the right direction at all.

I'd be looking at the Foundry 10.5 or brewzilla and a double pulley to lift the basket out.

Even if you just do what you're doing now, just collect the wort runoff in a pair of half gallon pitchers pouring it into the kettle. Put the heat on as soon as you have a gallon collected.

 

[OakIslandBrewery]

Those AIO systems certainly have an appeal to cut down on work. A lot of folks I know have made the switch.

Lifting the bag or basket out is probably the one task that can't be ideally made easy. Sure the pulley system would make it easier but you need to connect the other end to something that can safely take the weight. That might not be so easy depending on your brewing area.

The OP mentioned brewing in his apartment so I think he might not have the option to connect a pulley. Just a guess though.

Perhaps getting a helper would be a better solution until he heals up from surgery.

 

[Bobby_M]

Lifting the bag or basket out is probably the one task that can't be ideally made easy. Sure the pulley system would make it easier but you need to connect the other end to something that can safely take the weight. That might not be so easy depending on your brewing area.

Let's pick it apart a little more finely because it always comes down to how clever you are and what tools are available or can be built.

First, to be clear, all of the AIO systems have a method of resting the basket on the upper ledge of the kettle. Any assisted lift would just need to be temporary until you rest it in place. Also, many lifts themselves have a locking mechanism to let it go up and not come back down.

I sell these two locking rope hoists.. The second one has a built in upper pulley so you can use some body weight assist.

Even more mechanical advantage can be achieved with Harbor Freight's $12 block and tackle.

If you have no way of installing an overhead lifting point (I understand concern for making a hole in the drywall in a rental, but honestly patching a 1/4" hole is so easy that I don't think this should be a barrier), you can built a little makeshift tripod, gantry or derrick with tubing with EMT conduit Maker Pipe | Structural Pipe Fittings for DIY Builders

 

[OakIslandBrewery]

All great ideas and concerns for installing a lifting mechanism. I didn't mean to say it couldn't be done.

Thanks for adding more clarity. I was mostly referring to what I thought the OP had since he recently had surgery that would prevent him from lifting or even installing a pull system.

 

[Bramling Cross]

If you're gonna add a pump, why not just pump from the mash tun to the boil kettle already resting on the stove and skip the grant altogether? You could then begin heating the wort as you transfer to cut down on the wait time to boiling.

It’s a fly sparge rig and I like to lauter slowly for a number of reasons. The slow and variable outflow from the MLT will make it fiddly to keep the pump primed. If there’s anything I’ve learned about brewing, it’s that fiddly things make me grouchy.

I do a similar thing when I do 10gal batches but use a smaller kettle and do multiple transfer while the mash drains.

I added a back flow valve to the pump output to keep the brew kettle from reverse flowing back into the grant if the pump turns off.

I use a little tan solar pump for the transfer and it need to be primed to get going which can be issues at time.

Oh, right! A check valve is a great idea, thank you!

First off congratulations for donating your kidney. That's a huge sacrifice considering the hobby we are in.

To your question, I use exactly what you are pondering. I use my build as a filtering grant. I drain from the mash tun then pump to the boil kettle and again from the boil kettle to the plate chiller. It also acts as an accumulator so I can regulate the flow between equipment. I have a valve at the bottom and also one on the outlet of the pump.

I fabricated it from a legally purchased quarter barrel, top cut off, added a bottom drain, wheels and a 400 micron basket.

I brew 10-15 gallon batches and use it on all of my brews so no heavy lifting of hot wort. Yeah it's another piece of equipment to clean but it saves a lot in other ways.

Thanks for the proof of concept! I know I said filtering was deep into diminishing returns, but your 400 micron basket has my wheels turning. I like that a lot!

A pump is a good option for you and are always handy to have around. But if you don't already have a full size grant and pump, why can't you stop the launter from the MLT when the BK is only partially full. Transfer the BK to the stove top. Then use another pot to continue the launter and transfer this to the BK before is gets to heavy. You might need to do this several times to drain the MLT while keeping the weight manageable.

The primary reasons for why I’m going with the full sized grant have to do with my defining traits: 1) wretched cheapness, and 2) laziness. I already have an old ten gallon kettle and the full-size grant allows me to simply walk away and be lazy while it does the work.

I always pause before avoiding the specific question and playing devil's advocate, but I think I should anyway. If your 3-vessl process is cumbersome and strenuous, I don't think adding another vessel, pump and plumbing is going in the right direction at all.

I'd be looking at the Foundry 10.5 or brewzilla and a double pulley to lift the basket out.

Even if you just do what you're doing now, just collect the wort runoff in a pair of half gallon pitchers pouring it into the kettle. Put the heat on as soon as you have a gallon collected.

I know you’re a busy fella, Bobby, so I appreciate your having taken the time. Let’s just say that my rig has evolved with me for going on thirty years and it is pretty specialized for what I want it to do and where it needs to do it. Having recently helped a friend learn all grain on his brand new Anvil, I’ve got to concede that they are pretty amazing!

———

Thank you all for your time and ideas! I’m looking forward to putting this plan into place when I finally get back home and it’ll be a better plan thanks to the ideas you guys kindly offered.

Thanks!