Force carb 7.5 gallon sanke keg

[Minjin]

Is the process the same as force carbing a corny? 24 hours at 30 psi then a day or two at serving pressure? What is the recommended serving pressure for that type of keg?

 

[audger]

the type or size of container doesnt matter to gasses and liquids

recomended serving pressure is dependant on your dispensing equipment and temperature of the beer, not the keg itself.

 

[TopherM]

The 24 hours at 30PSI and two days at serving pressure meathod is VERY inconsistent. I'm absolutely not exaggerating when I say that most people who use this method overcarb and undercarb way more often than they get it right.

I started off trying all of the the "quicky" methods, and all of them are inconsistent.

The only way to consistently get good carb is to hit the keg with 30PSI just long enough to seat the o-rings, dial it down to serving pressure, purge the keg to balance the pressure, then let it sit for about two weeks. That works EVERY time.

 

[Minjin]

It's going in a fridge. It's a brown ale, what's the recommended serving pressure and temp?

 

[Minjin]

Good info topher

 

[TopherM]

Here's a calculator:

http://www.tastybrew.com/calculators/carbonation.html

 

[CidahMastah]

The 24 hours at 30PSI and two days at serving pressure meathod is VERY inconsistent. I'm absolutely not exaggerating when I say that most people who use this method overcarb and undercarb way more often than they get it right.

I started off trying all of the the "quicky" methods, and all of them are inconsistent.

The only way to consistently get good carb is to hit the keg with 30PSI just long enough to seat the o-rings, dial it down to serving pressure, purge the keg to balance the pressure, then let it sit for about two weeks. That works EVERY time.

Totally disagree.

been kegging with consistent results with the boost carb method (no shaking) below for well over 1.5 years.

I take a room temp keg:
1. hit it with ~55PSI and put into my keezer for about 24hours
2. Then I burp the keg and lower to serving pressure (you can sample the carb level immediately).
3. Your carb will be about perfect in about 2-4 days, depending on your desired carb. It will be drinkable carbed after the initial boost carb.

I get consistent, repeatable results EVERY single time I have done it this way.

 

[Spartangreen]

Doesn't volume matter?
I would think it would take longer to saturate a larger volume of liquid with CO2.
I should have paid attention in Chemistry class.

 

[TopherM]

Cidah, I don't doubt your personal results, but trust me, you are the exception, not the rule.

Read the kegging forum for about a month and you'll find hundreds of kegging newbies with overcarbed beer that tried to rush their force carb, and very very few with consistent results. It seems to be about 8 in 10 have bad results. I'm not sure the real hard stats would be much different from my anedoctal evidence in this case!

We can disagree, but I'm pretty certain that slow carbing at serving pressure produces the best results for the most people the most of the time!

P.S., funny enough, we had a guy give a instructional presentation on kegging in corny kegs, including force carbing at my last HBC meeting. The guy had a powerpoint instructing everyone to do the 30 PSI, shake the keg BS. It took everything in my power not to speak up, only because I thought it would be disrespectful, but I feel bad for any of the 35 or so in that room that went home and followed his instructions for their first time.

It isn't that the speedy methods don't work, it's just that they leave WAYYYY more room for error, and you really have to watch your timing! Get busy and forget that you have your beer at 55PSI one night and leave it an extra night, and you've got a big overcarb to undo. I just like to keep it simple and as idiotproof as possible when I'm giving a newbie advise, as that is the kind of advise I myself appreciate from others!!!

 

[wailingguitar]

I agree with Topher, jacking pressure up and down can lead to all kinds of issues. I am a huge proponent of using CO2 stones in a corny to carb with. 48 hours at serving temp/pressure and you're there.

As to the sanke keg, I really wouldn't recommend using a high pressure method to carb it because you don't have that simple little ring to release pressure. In other words, if you miss your level it is much harder to fix. In that case, I would definitely say "get it cold, set your pressure and wait"

 

[CidahMastah]

Topher - like anything you have to be consistent to get the same results. So yes, if you forget it, you would likely overcarb. But that isn't the processes fault - it is the person who forgot So the process isn't any less consistent in result.

All that said if you set and leave for 3 weeks, sure you will get the same result as I do when I use the boost method. But you have to wait 3 weeks. For hefes I would hate to wait that long.

My main point is, all the methods are reliable (even shaking) if you follow the process. That said I hate shaking. Stirs up all that sediment I have been letting settle in the keg while conditioning.

To each his/her own. Just wanted to present options

 

[zachattack]

Doesn't volume matter?
I would think it would take longer to saturate a larger volume of liquid with CO2.
I should have paid attention in Chemistry class.

Don't worry, this stuff isn't taught in chemistry classes! It's taught in transport phenomena class if you're a chemical engineer though

The volume relative to surface area is what matters, not necessarily the volume itself. By using a carb stone or shaking the keg you expose much more of the beer surface to the gas inside the keg, making it come to equilibrium faster. That's because the gas is diffusing into the liquid at a fixed rate along the beer-liquid interface, so the bigger that interface is the more gas can diffuse.

You can also speed up the diffusion by bumping up the pressure, but as Topher said that generally gives inconsistent results. Just set it to your carbonation pressure (which in a balanced system is the same as the serving pressure), wait a few weeks, and you'll be good to go.

CO2 pressure and dissolved CO2 concentration are very much analogous to heat and temperature.

Think about it like cooking a turkey in the oven: You ultimately want the turkey to be at 160 degrees. You could do this by cooking it for a few days with the oven set to 160 degrees, and it'll be impossible to overcook (not that this will yield a tasty bird, but ignore that for this analogy ). This is analogous to the "set and forget" force carbing method. Or you can set the oven to 400 degrees and cook it in a few hours, but you risk overcooking it if you don't time it perfectly. This is analogous the "burst carbing" method.

It takes a while to cook because the heat is diffusing from the hot oven into the mass of cold turkey. The heat can only diffuse in at the turkey/oven interface, so cooking time is really a function of surface area, not weight. This is why old school cookbooks that say "cook it at xx minutes per pound" are usually wrong. You can speed up the diffusion of heat by turning up the oven temperature or increasing the surface area.

So if you cut the turkey up into legs, thighs, wings, breast, etc. you'll increase the surface area, which will let the heat enter a lot faster. This is analogous to the shaking the carbing keg or using an aeration stone.