First brew done - Now the questions

[Xanthocryptus]

Hi there! I completed my first brew recently and I was hoping I could get some answers to my questions about the process and the result.

Heres the recipe I used (its essentially the basic 'Cincinnati Pale Ale' in Palmer's How to Brew but tweaked to accommodate local ingredients):
23L
1kg pale dry malt extract
1.8kg amber liquid malt extract
24g Taiheke 60min (6AAUs bittering)
20g Taiheke 30min (5AAUs finishing)
6g Taiheke 0min (The rest of the hops packet, YOLO)
1 Packet Safale S-04

(Taiheke is similar to Cascade. I made a 23L batch because my amber extract came in a slightly larger amount than in the original, so I scaled up a bit)

I boiled about 12L in a 50L stainless pot on a 60,000 BTU 'Hurricane burner', dissolved the dry extract, waited a few minutes for the 'hot break' (eggy stuff), then timed the hour and added hops on schedule. Chilled in bath, added to fermenter that already contained 11L of preboiled water, rehydrated yeast, pitched, fermented 2 weeks, bottled, conditioned 2 weeks (well, 1.8 weeks).

First question - I added the liquid extract at the end with about 5 minutes to go because that was a common theme in all the advice I was reading. Why is it best to do that?

Second question - I decided to rehydrate the yeast prior to pitching. I accidentally rehydrated too early, and the yeast was left in a sterile jar in 1 cup of water at about 35-40C (95-105F) for about an hour. Could this have had a negative impact on fermentation?

Third question - What is the optimal temperature schedule for S-04? It seemed to go nuts for the first couple of days and then appeared to drop off in activity. I had it at about 14C ambient (58F) for a few days, then when activity dropped I moved it to 15-16C (60F), then moved it to about 17-18C for the rest and also let it bottle condition at that temp (63F). I know that low to mid 60'sF is recommended but I've also read that slowly increasing the temperature up to about 21-22C (70F) is best (sort of like what I did although I didn't know at the time).

Fourth question - Why is the beer slightly undercarbonated? Well, I guess it could be because I'm drinking it a day or 2 before the official 2 week bottle conditioning period is up (and I understand that some beers take longer than that to carbonate). I used 110g of table sugar, and the fermentor volume was 23L. Does that sound right? Do I just need to wait a while to see if it carbs up better?

Fifth question - When using a yeast like S-04 that settles to the bottom quite rapidly, should I be agitating the brew before I rack to bottling bucket to ensure there is enough suspended yeast to carry out priming?

Lessons for next time:
- Use the stick on thermometer to measure fermentor temp, don't rely on ambient.
- Take gravity readings (too frantic during the brew - siphons were slipping out of buckets, plastic spoons were scorching on the pot, equipment was getting unsanitised everywhere!).
- Use some StarSan solution in a spray bottle rather than making up 20L of the stuff to soak equipment in!
- RDWHAHB

 

[jmitchell3]

See inline below:

Hi there! I completed my first brew recently and I was hoping I could get some answers to my questions about the process and the result.

Heres the recipe I used (its essentially the basic 'Cincinnati Pale Ale' in Palmer's How to Brew but tweaked to accommodate local ingredients):
23L
1kg pale dry malt extract
1.8kg amber liquid malt extract
24g Taiheke 60min (6AAUs bittering)
20g Taiheke 30min (5AAUs finishing)
6g Taiheke 0min (The rest of the hops packet, YOLO)
1 Packet Safale S-04

(Taiheke is similar to Cascade. I made a 23L batch because my amber extract came in a slightly larger amount than in the original, so I scaled up a bit)

I boiled about 12L in a 50L stainless pot on a 60,000 BTU 'Hurricane burner', dissolved the dry extract, waited a few minutes for the 'hot break' (eggy stuff), then timed the hour and added hops on schedule. Chilled in bath, added to fermenter that already contained 11L of preboiled water, rehydrated yeast, pitched, fermented 2 weeks, bottled, conditioned 2 weeks (well, 1.8 weeks).

First question - I added the liquid extract at the end with about 5 minutes to go because that was a common theme in all the advice I was reading. Why is it best to do that?

Some claim it tastes less "extracty" if one adds near the end rather than at the beginning. Only difference would be a higher hop utilization in the boil due to lower gravity wort (higher gravity being reached at the end with the addition of more extract).​

Second question - I decided to rehydrate the yeast prior to pitching. I accidentally rehydrated too early, and the yeast was left in a sterile jar in 1 cup of water at about 35-40C (95-105F) for about an hour. Could this have had a negative impact on fermentation?

Possibly. If it fermented out (which it sounds like it did) you didn't kill it lol. Taste may tell you.​

Third question - What is the optimal temperature schedule for S-04? It seemed to go nuts for the first couple of days and then appeared to drop off in activity. I had it at about 14C ambient (58F) for a few days, then when activity dropped I moved it to 15-16C (60F), then moved it to about 17-18C for the rest and also let it bottle condition at that temp (63F). I know that low to mid 60'sF is recommended but I've also read that slowly increasing the temperature up to about 21-22C (70F) is best (sort of like what I did although I didn't know at the time).

Per http://www.fermentis.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/SFA_S04.pdf, 15-20C is ideal for S04.​

Fourth question - Why is the beer slightly undercarbonated? Well, I guess it could be because I'm drinking it a day or 2 before the official 2 week bottle conditioning period is up (and I understand that some beers take longer than that to carbonate). I used 110g of table sugar, and the fermentor volume was 23L. Does that sound right? Do I just need to wait a while to see if it carbs up better?

It is undercarbed cause 1.8 weeks at that lower 60s (F) temp is too short a time. it'll likely be better at 3-4 weeks.​

Fifth question - When using a yeast like S-04 that settles to the bottom quite rapidly, should I be agitating the brew before I rack to bottling bucket to ensure there is enough suspended yeast to carry out priming?

You can if you like, but I think for average gravity beers you'll have enough in suspension even with a flocculant yeast like S04 to do the job even without doing it.​

Lessons for next time:
- Use the stick on thermometer to measure fermentor temp, don't rely on ambient.
- Take gravity readings (too frantic during the brew - siphons were slipping out of buckets, plastic spoons were scorching on the pot, equipment was getting unsanitised everywhere!).
- Use some StarSan solution in a spray bottle rather than making up 20L of the stuff to soak equipment in!
- RDWHAHB

Your lessons are correct. ​

 

[RM-MN]

If you add the liquid extract at the beginning of the boil it will darken and your beer will be darker than intended.
Leaving the dry yeast too long after rehydrating can cause it to use up some of its reserves. I doubt your extra time was too long though.
I start my beers that use S-04 at about 62F and let them sit at that temp for a week, then warm it to 72 for another week to 3 weeks. The higher temp at the start gets the yeast going a bit faster without the off flavors that temps in the 70's would and the 70's at the end helps the yeast with the final cleanup of any sugars and intermediate products.
Unless you have a way to control the fermentation temperature, using a stick on thermometer won't do too much.
Taking a gravity sample is not necessary with an extract brew. If you add the right amount of water and extract you can't miss. If you go to all grain brewing you have a chance to miss the OG and with taking samples you will know if you need to add extract. If you do go to all grain (easier than it sounds) a refractometer allows you to take a sample of about 5 drops and can be read instantly. It's a worthwhile investment. Also read up a bit on BIAB as it makes all grain very easy.
I never intentionally agitate the beer to get yeast into suspension. Even leaving it for a month won't cause too much to settle out.
Yeasts work faster at warmer temps. At 72F. the beer carbonates faster, but it still takes time. Not for the carbonation, that happens quickly, but for the beer to mature a bit so it forms a head.

 

[Xanthocryptus]

See inline below:

Your lessons are correct. ​

Thanks very much for your advice, I appreciate it

See inline text.

...
I start my beers that use S-04 at about 62F and let them sit at that temp for a week, then warm it to 72 for another week to 3 weeks. The higher temp at the start gets the yeast going a bit faster without the off flavors that temps in the 70's would and the 70's at the end helps the yeast with the final cleanup of any sugars and intermediate products.

So its fine to raise the temp up after that initial week-long period and it won't cause any off-flavours?​

...
Unless you have a way to control the fermentation temperature, using a stick on thermometer won't do too much.

I just meant in order to get a more accurate reading of what the temperature of the brew was - relying on ambient is less accurate because of the activity raising the temp inside the fermenter etc.​

...
If you do go to all grain (easier than it sounds) a refractometer allows you to take a sample of about 5 drops and can be read instantly. It's a worthwhile investment. Also read up a bit on BIAB as it makes all grain very easy.

Absolutely, I planned from the start to do BIAB after reading heaps about it on sites like this one and BIABrewer etc. Thats why I got the burner and larger pot, pretty excited to start BIABing but I want to do a couple more extract brews with some steeping grains before I plunge into it.​

...
I never intentionally agitate the beer to get yeast into suspension. Even leaving it for a month won't cause too much to settle out.

OK cool I can cross off that worry.​

...
Yeasts work faster at warmer temps. At 72F. the beer carbonates faster, but it still takes time. Not for the carbonation, that happens quickly, but for the beer to mature a bit so it forms a head.

OK cool I'll keep testing over the next couple weeks. I didn't think that getting the beer up to temperature would be an issue in the summer here. I thought I was going to be battling to keep it cool but it's been unusually mild so far.​

Also, How do people normally handle leftover ingredients? For example if I buy some vacuum packed hops and don't use all of them what should I do? Same with malt extract. For this batch I scaled up the water to match the extra malt on top of the base recipe because I could only buy certain size amounts and didn't want leftovers. But what if the differences are too great to do that?


Thanks so much for your input guys, really appreciate it!

 

[RM-MN]

I start my beers that use S-04 at about 62F and let them sit at that temp for a week, then warm it to 72 for another week to 3 weeks. The higher temp at the start gets the yeast going a bit faster without the off flavors that temps in the 70's would and the 70's at the end helps the yeast with the final cleanup of any sugars and intermediate products.

I'm sure I had my morning coffee before I wrote that but the second sentence makes no sense.

How about I rewrite it? The lower temp at the start keeps the yeast from going totally insane while looking at all the sugar so the yeast doesn't produce the off flavor esters and fusel alcohol. Now that you have the yeast under control, they sedately (sort of) eat the sugars and produce alcohol and CO2 plus a bunch of intermediate products. When the sugars are mostly gone, raising the temp will not get you off flavors but will encourage the yeast to find the last bit of fermentable sugar and break down the intermediate products to make you good beer.

Leftover ingredients? I have no leftover ingredients, just starters for the next batch.:rockin: I would refrigerate any ingredients until you can find a new recipe to put them into. Hops degrade fairly quickly at room temp but as you cool them they degrade slower. Putting them into a chest freezer would be about as good for them as most homebrewers can do.