First batch ever, all grain, jumping in the deep end

[GeorgeH2013]

Well, mission complete. I finally got all my stuff together, and attempted by first batch of beer today. Of course, I went all out, going all grain the first time. Why not, right? I tried a Racer 5 Clone recipe out of BYO magazine. I wanted something I knew I could find easily locally, so I could compare. I'm using (2) keggles, one for mash tun and one for the boil. I copied a buddy of mines system, and he makes darn fine beer. Here's how it went, and my questions/concerns are in here:

My OG came in pretty low, at 1.048 (recipe said it should have been 1.071), and my boil volume was close to 5.75gals (that's what beer smith guided me to, although I'm sure I could have made a mistake with that thing). By the time I boiled for the 90 minutes, I was down to around 4.50-4.75gals (rough guess. I didn’t have a good way to measure…yet). My gravity was still at 1.048. I put the corn sugar (6.7oz) in at the start of the boil, so I guess I thought that would raise it some, especially with the boil off. Hmmmm. Then, it took me around 45 minutes to cool the boiled wort down to 80 degrees, and I just decided to drain to the fermenter, and pitch 2 packets of the Fermentis US-05 dry yeast. It’s super cloudy, and I have it in the middle of my room with the fan on it to try and cool it down. It’s been about 2 hours 20 minutes, and it’s still around 76F, according to thermometer strip on the car boy.

I’ve been reading online about repitching, but of course, I don’t have extra yeast in my back pocket. Also, what do you think about boiling water and adding to the fermenter to bring the volume up? Won’t that lower the gravity even more? When the gravity is low out of the mash, do people add malt extract(?) to bring the gravity up. Does that sound right?

Bottom line, I know I can make adjustments going forward, no big deal. I’m just glad the equipment all worked correctly, no leaks, spills, disasters, etc. Overall, not a bad first effort. At least I have a starting point now.

Any help is greatly appreciated. I've been trolling this site for months, trying to figure it all out. I'll get there. I'm excited for the journey!

-George

 

[wilserbrewer]

You have already pitched plenty of yeast, so no worries there. You also likely pitched the yeast too warm....o5 prefers mid sixties. What temp did you take gravity readings, sampling too hot will give a false low reading. Find a way...make a dip stick for your kettle so you know your volumes. Adding top up water is ok, but it decreases your efficiency.

 

[kh54s10]

Well, mission complete. I finally got all my stuff together, and attempted by first batch of beer today. Of course, I went all out, going all grain the first time. Why not, right? I tried a Racer 5 Clone recipe out of BYO magazine. I wanted something I new I could find easily locally, so I could compare. I'm using (2) keggles, one for mash tun and one for the boil. I copied a buddy of mines system, and he makes darn fine beer. Here's how it went, and my questions/concerns are in here:

My OG came in pretty low, at 1.048 (recipe said it should have been 1.071), and my boil volume was close to 5.75gals (that's what beer smith guided me to, although I'm sure I could have made a mistake with that thing).

I think you need to work more on your equipment profile in Beersmith. I need to collect 7.3 gallons of wort to end up with 5.25 after a 60 minute boil. The configuration of the pot and degree of heat will have differing effects on your boil off rate.

By the time I boiled for the 90 minutes, I was down to around 4.50-4.75gals (rough guess. I didn’t have a good way to measure…yet). My gravity was still at 1.048.

If you started off with 1.048 and boiled off 1 - 1.25 gallons it is impossible for the gravity to stay the same. Did you cool your hydrometer sample?

I put the corn sugar (6.7oz) in at the start of the boil, so I guess I thought that would raise it some, especially with the boil off. Hmmmm. Then, it took me around 45 minutes to cool the boiled wort down to 80 degrees, and I just decided to drain to the fermenter, and pitch 2 packets of the Fermentis US-05 dry yeast. It’s super cloudy, and I have it in the middle of my room with the fan on it to try and cool it down. It’s been about 2 hours 20 minutes, and it’s still around 76F, according to thermometer strip on the car boy.

80 degrees is too warm to pitch the yeast. It will not kill the yeast, in fact they will love the warm temperatures. Warm ferments will lead to off flavors or biting fusel alcohols. If you have a tub large enough to but the fermenter into you can fill it with 6-10 inches of cold water and add ice to control your temperature. Try to get the wort temperature to the mid sixties as soon as you can. At least get it below 70 degrees.

I’ve been reading online about repitching, but of course, I don’t have extra yeast in my back pocket. Also, what do you think about boiling water and adding to the fermenter to bring the up? Won’t that lower the gravity even more? When the gravity is low out of the mash, do people add malt extract(?) to bring the gravity up. Does that sound right?

At this point you will not want to add water, as you expected it would lower the gravity. You could boil up some extract, but I would just take it as it is. There is no need in this case to pitch any more yeast. Learn from this one and make the next one better.

Bottom line, I know I can make adjustments going forward, no big deal. I’m just glad the equipment all worked correctly, no leaks, spills, disasters, etc. Overall, not a bad first effort. At least I have a starting point now.

Any help is greatly appreciated. I've been trolling this site for months, trying to figure it all out. I'll get there. I'm excited for the journey!

-George

Since you collected less volume than you should have your gravity should have been higher than the recipe not lower. Usually the culprit in these cases is a poor crush on the grain. Did your LHBS crush the grains? If so ask it they can tighten the mill or double crush the grains.

It sounds like thing went pretty well and you should have a decent beer, just a little lower on the ABV that intended.

Look more into the use of Beersmith, look at all the instructional videos, especially about setting up your equipment profile. As you work with your system you will fine tune things in Beersmith. After a while you will put in your recipe and will be very close on the numbers most of the time.

Welcome and good luck.

 

[theseeker4]

Well, mission complete. I finally got all my stuff together, and attempted by first batch of beer today. Of course, I went all out, going all grain the first time. Why not, right? I tried a Racer 5 Clone recipe out of BYO magazine. I wanted something I new I could find easily locally, so I could compare. I'm using (2) keggles, one for mash tun and one for the boil. I copied a buddy of mines system, and he makes darn fine beer. Here's how it went, and my questions/concerns are in here:

My OG came in pretty low, at 1.048 (recipe said it should have been 1.071), and my boil volume was close to 5.75gals (that's what beer smith guided me to, although I'm sure I could have made a mistake with that thing). By the time I boiled for the 90 minutes, I was down to around 4.50-4.75gals (rough guess. I didn’t have a good way to measure…yet). My gravity was still at 1.048. I put the corn sugar (6.7oz) in at the start of the boil, so I guess I thought that would raise it some, especially with the boil off. Hmmmm. Then, it took me around 45 minutes to cool the boiled wort down to 80 degrees, and I just decided to drain to the fermenter, and pitch 2 packets of the Fermentis US-05 dry yeast. It’s super cloudy, and I have it in the middle of my room with the fan on it to try and cool it down. It’s been about 2 hours 20 minutes, and it’s still around 76F, according to thermometer strip on the car boy.

I’ve been reading online about repitching, but of course, I don’t have extra yeast in my back pocket. Also, what do you think about boiling water and adding to the fermenter to bring the volume up? Won’t that lower the gravity even more? When the gravity is low out of the mash, do people add malt extract(?) to bring the gravity up. Does that sound right?

Bottom line, I know I can make adjustments going forward, no big deal. I’m just glad the equipment all worked correctly, no leaks, spills, disasters, etc. Overall, not a bad first effort. At least I have a starting point now.

Any help is greatly appreciated. I've been trolling this site for months, trying to figure it all out. I'll get there. I'm excited for the journey!

-George

If you give more specifics, such as recipe, mash method and temperatures, times, how you confirmed that you had conversion, etc. I am sure people can help you more. I do see one problem right off the bat, and that is the fact that your SG did not change between pre and post boil, despite your volume decreasing. That is not possible, so one, or both of those values are definitely off. What did you use to measure, refractometer or hydrometer? What temperature were the samples at when you measured? Did you stir very well before taking the sample?

You just pitched the yeast a couple hours ago, you should wait a MINIMUM of 72 hours to allow for fermentation to start before even thinking about re-pitching. If you have a clear carboy as your fermenter, you should look for krausen at the top as proof that the yeast are doing their thing.

I wouldn't add water to bring volume up unless your specific gravity was above your target. Better to have 40 bottles of good beer than 50 bottles of watered-down beer, at least IMO.

Why did you put the corn sugar in? Was this corn sugar that was supposed to be used for bottling? If so, you will need to add more sugar at bottling time. There are lots of threads on here that describe methods of priming for bottling. That little sugar won't have a huge effect on your OG.

Welcome, and good luck!

 

[Subdivisions]

As far as your OG being off that could be many different factors. I'll touch on things that I can get from your post.

5.75 gallons at the start of a 90 minute boil will leave you low on final volume 99% of the time for a 5 gallon batch. I use two burners on my stove and I lose .75 gal/hr. If you're using a propane burner then I see where your volume went.

When you say OG are you talking about pre-boil volume or post-boil. Your post makes it sound like you had the same gravity pre and post boil. If you boiled down 1.25 gallons then science says that you MUST have a higher gravity after that. How are you measuring this?? If using a hydrometer then you have to let the sample get down within 10-20 degrees of the calibration point (usually 68 or 60F).

Corn sugar can be added at any time. It's usually added late to prevent caramelization. It sounds like you thought it would add more gravity if added early, it won't. The boil off of water will increase gravity but the sugar amount stays the same. Whether you add it early or late makes no difference.

You don't need to re-pitch the yeast. The temperature you pitched at didn't kill it. The problem is that you pitched at a high temperature. You really want to get the wort down below 70 before pitching to prevent off flavors from the yeast. If you can, get your fermenter in a tub of cool water to try and get the temperature down quickly.

As far as increasing the gravity, I'd just leave it go. Usually when people adjust with DME it's during the boil. You'll make beer and it should be OK. I'd be more worried about getting the wort temperature down right now.

EDIT: I must've been on here for a while because 3 other responses popped up. All are solid advice

EDIT2: @theseeker4 the corn sugar is part of the recipe for Racer 5

 

[GeorgeH2013]

Wow. Thanks for a great, quick responses, guys. I really appreciate it, and thanks for the constructive comments.

wilserbrewer: I took the first gravity reading pre boil, but it was very warm, just after mash and sparge runoff. I'd guess well over 140F. Same with the reading post boil. It was after cooling, but it was still at least 80F, but under 90F. Far too warm is what I am gathering from the comments here, and now that everyone mentions it, I do think I remember reading that somewhere, that the temp needs to be lower for an accurate reading. It was a lot to keep track of on my first day. I kept good notes though, and I will add this in there.

kh54s10: Yes, I definitely need to work with BeerSmith, but I don't want to have to count on it, and I'd like to get to the point where I know it is spitting out something is wrong (because of my inputs), but obviously, that takes time and experience.

No, I did not cool the gravity samples. A mistake on my part. How does everyone do this, if they are so hot when you are pulling them? I don't have a great way to cool it. I put it in the sink with tap water and some ice, but it only cover about 1/3 of the wort that was in the fermenter, and it was about 70 degrees, so it wasn't doing much. Now that I see everyone says I need to cool it down, I am going to go put the fermenter outside for a bit (it's 57 here right now).

I'm not going to add any more water or yeast. I'll go get it cold, and like you all suggest, just take this one for what it is and learn from it. (ok, I just took it outside. My back is loving how much weird objects I've lifted today!)

Yes, the LHBS crushed the grains. I'll be back there next week (there isn't one in town) to maybe pick up another fermenter. I'm itching to try this again! I'll talk to them as well about how it went. They are a great crew that everyone speaks highly of, so I'm sure they can help me out.

I do have a clear carboy. How long until I see some krausen?

I put the corn sugar in at the start of the boil. That is what BeerSmith said to do, but again, I could have input something incorrectly. I started playing with it yesterday, so I know I barely know how to use it, but I'll figure it out. The recipe has a separate line listed for the corn sugar for bottling.

theseeker4: I can give the whole recipe, mash method, etc, but I didn't know how much info to provide (yes, I know the more, the better). I didn't know what was too long of a post, especially being my first one. I wanted to make sure it got read at least!

The readings were with a hydrometer, and no I didn't stir. I did "spin" the hydrometer, to knock off any bubbles that would affect anything. That's something, right?

Yes, I agree 40 bottles of something is better than 50 bottles of "water down" something.

Subdivisions: Yes, I have a Bayou Burner, that sounds like a jet engine when it's going, so I'm sure the boil off is a big number. I didn't even have it up all the way. That thing is nuts. Fun item.

When you (everyone) refer to OG, is it pre boil or post boil? I'm still trying to get all the lingo down. It's a little overwhelming at this point, but I feel like the last 2 days have been a great crash course. I feel a lot better about everything already. I was a little nervous (and excited) this week. I'm glad the first one is done.

Like I mentioned above, I have the fermenter outside on the front porch. It's cold (for Santa Barbara) right now, so I should be able to get it down pretty good before I go to bed tonight. What temperature should I be aiming for. I guess I thought 70F was the magic number, but lower seems to be preferred?

Again, everyone, thanks for your comments. It's great to know I can get on here and get fast, helpful responses. Much appreciated.

-George

 

[theseeker4]

Wow. Thanks for a great, quick responses, guys. I really appreciate it, and thanks for the constructive comments.

wilserbrewer: I took the first gravity reading pre boil, but it was very warm, just after mash and sparge runoff. I'd guess well over 140F. Same with the reading post boil. It was after cooling, but it was still at least 80F, but under 90F. Far too warm is what I am gathering from the comments here, and now that everyone mentions it, I do think I remember reading that somewhere, that the temp needs to be lower for an accurate reading. It was a lot to keep track of on my first day. I kept good notes though, and I will add this in there.

kh54s10: Yes, I definitely need to work with BeerSmith, but I don't want to have to count on it, and I'd like to get to the point where I know it is spitting out something is wrong (because of my inputs), but obviously, that takes time and experience.

No, I did not cool the gravity samples. A mistake on my part. How does everyone do this, if they are so hot when you are pulling them? I don't have a great way to cool it. I put it in the sink with tap water and some ice, but it only cover about 1/3 of the wort that was in the fermenter, and it was about 70 degrees, so it wasn't doing much. Now that I see everyone says I need to cool it down, I am going to go put the fermenter outside for a bit (it's 57 here right now).

I'm not going to add any more water or yeast. I'll go get it cold, and like you all suggest, just take this one for what it is and learn from it. (ok, I just took it outside. My back is loving how much weird objects I've lifted today!)

Yes, the LHBS crushed the grains. I'll be back there next week (there isn't one in town) to maybe pick up another fermenter. I'm itching to try this again! I'll talk to them as well about how it went. They are a great crew that everyone speaks highly of, so I'm sure they can help me out.

I do have a clear carboy. How long until I see some krausen?

I put the corn sugar in at the start of the boil. That is what BeerSmith said to do, but again, I could have input something incorrectly. I started playing with it yesterday, so I know I barely know how to use it, but I'll figure it out. The recipe has a separate line listed for the corn sugar for bottling.

theseeker4: I can give the whole recipe, mash method, etc, but I didn't know how much info to provide (yes, I know the more, the better). I didn't know what was too long of a post, especially being my first one. I wanted to make sure it got read at least!

The readings were with a hydrometer, and no I didn't stir. I did "spin" the hydrometer, to knock off any bubbles that would affect anything. That's something, right?

Yes, I agree 40 bottles of something is better than 50 bottles of "water down" something.

Subdivisions: Yes, I have a Bayou Burner, that sounds like a jet engine when it's going, so I'm sure the boil off is a big number. I didn't even have it up all the way. That thing is nuts. Fun item.

When you (everyone) refer to OG, is it pre boil or post boil? I'm still trying to get all the lingo down. It's a little overwhelming at this point, but I feel like the last 2 days have been a great crash course. I feel a lot better about everything already. I was a little nervous (and excited) this week. I'm glad the first one is done.

Like I mentioned above, I have the fermenter outside on the front porch. It's cold (for Santa Barbara) right now, so I should be able to get it down pretty good before I go to bed tonight. What temperature should I be aiming for. I guess I thought 70F was the magic number, but lower seems to be preferred?

Again, everyone, thanks for your comments. It's great to know I can get on here and get fast, helpful responses. Much appreciated.

-George

OG is original gravity, and refers to post boil, pre fermentation gravity. Boil gravity is the pre boil specific gravity of your wort after your mashing and sparging is complete. FG is the final gravity after all fermentation is complete.

Any time you measure gravity prior to fermentation, make sure you stir the entire batch very well, in a circular motion as well as from top to bottom, etc. After fermentation has begun, you don't want to stir the beer because oxygen exposure can lead to off flavors, but prior to fermentation starting, stir away! Once it is very well mixed, I take a sample and put it in a glass measuring cup, cover it with plastic wrap, and cool it in a water bath if necessary. The plastic wrap prevents water loss due to evaporation (might not be significant, but I do it anyway). I then put the sample in my hydrometer test cylinder and float my hydrometer in that. Check your hydrometer's paperwork, it should say what temperature it is calibrated at, which is the temperature you should try to have the sample at when you measure the specific gravity. There are conversion charts online if you test at a different temperature, but I still try to avoid testing hot wort myself.

As far as cooling, I just use a water/ice bath that I put my kettle in. I plan to upgrade to an immersion chiller eventually, but don't have the money at the moment.

As far as fermentation, mid to low 60's ambient temperature is a good goal for most beers, and understand that the temperature of the actual beer can be several degrees above the ambient temperature during active fermentation, since the process is exothermic. If you can, a temperature controlled chamber such as a chest freezer with a temperature probe is ideal, but might be out of your budget (it certainly is out of mine at the moment). Sitting outside might work, but I would be cautious of huge swings in temperature, and definitely have it covered by something to reduce light exposure.

 

[GeorgeH2013]

Thanks, seeker. Your explanation of of gravity is appreciated. I'll do the OG reading at a more proper temperature next time. That was something I overlooked how I was going to do it, when I was worrying still about getting the whole process correct.

I think I am going to get one of those party keg buckets and fill that with ice, along with the immersion cooler, and see how fast I can get the temp down post boil next time. Seems like an easy and inexpensive way to go about it.

I left the fermenter outside until 12:30am, and the temp strip still said 70F. It was well past bed time, so I brought it in, and this morning it still says 70F. The house usually sits between 66-72 through out the year, so I think that will work for now. Fluctuation is minimal, which is nice. I might look into one of those temp controlled jackets you can put the carboy in. That would fit the space I have to work with nicely (next to none. Our place is pushing 300sf, maybe. My girlfriend really enjoyed listening to the bubbling of the fermenter last night.). I thought about leaving it out all night, but I assumed if I did, I'd get up and it would be 50F on the fermenter, and I'd have a new set of problems.

Cheers,

-George