Fermentation, Aging, and Storage Temperatures

[ejcrist]

I'm new to the forum (1st post) and cider making; haven't made a batch of cider yet but I'm reading up on it. I've made a couple of batches of wine from backyard grapes, and mead so I'm familiar with those processes.

One of the things I learned recently was that a lot of ale yeasts ferment best between about 55F-70F which is below the ambient temperature in my house. I live in Phoenix AZ (hot!) and keep the thermostat at 75F which works well for primary and secondary of wine and mead with the yeasts I've used so far. I know I don't have to use ale yeasts but I prefer to since there are a lot of varieties available and I don't wish to make high alcohol cider but rather keep it around 5%-6%. I've been planning to get a chest freezer and install one of the thermostats sold at Midwest Supplies to maintain temps between 60F-65F for white wine fermentation and now cider. While I was thinking about this I thought of two other questions that I haven't found the answer to yet. (1) Should you maintain the same temperatures as you did during primary fermentation during secondary aging in a carboy? And (2) what's the best storage temperature post bottling for cider? I noticed the hard cider sold in Walmart is refrigerated alongside beer, but I'm guessing it should be stored at white wine temperatures (~ 50F) since it is a sort of white wine.

If anyone could help me out with these two questions, or point me in the right direction I'd certainly appreciate it. It would be nice if you don't have to maintain cooler temperatures for the secondary but I'm guessing like with white wine it's best to do so you maintain certain aromas and flavors. You can probably ferment, age, and store at any temperature within reason, even if you use a yeast that has a range below that, but like D47's lower temp requirements when fermenting wine, you probably will end up with a substandard cider, which of course is something I don't want.

Thanks, Gene

 

[Maylar]

D47 would be a poor choice at warmer temperatures. I would pick a more tolerant yeast like Lalvin K1V-1116 or EC-1118. Those bad boys are good to over 90°.

I don't think it's important to match primary and secondary temps. Just keep them within the range of the yeast. Storage should be your basic "wine cellar" - a cool, dark place.

FWIW, I don't make summer ciders any more. My last batch was a winter ferment with ale yeast at about 65°F and the results were so superior that I'll never do a hi temp cider again. I'm waiting for my basement to get below 70 so I can start my next batch.

 

[ejcrist]

Thanks for the info Maylar. I've never used D47 for just that reason even though one mead batch called for it. I know it'll ferment but the results wouldn't have been very good at my indoor air temp. I know there's a lot of good yeasts that'll work for cider such as Lalvin 71B-1122 which works great in meads but I wanted to play around with some of the ale yeasts such as SO4 since I heard they can produce a great low-alcohol cider. For that it'd be best if I drop the temp so I already got the thermostat control and just need to pick up a chest freezer for the task. I didn't know if you need to maintain the cooler temps though post primary but like you said I think it's only necessary during the primary ferment. After that I think I'm ok to age in the carboy at room temperature.

 

[MindenMan]

SO4 is a very popular cider yeast, and it has a fairly high alcohol tolerance. I will guess you already know there are more fermentables in cider than in ales, so the only way to make a low alcohol cider is to ferment just the juice and no added sugar. As far as bulk aging in a warm room goes, keep head space to a minimum, and keep your airlock full. For long aging I would use vodka in my airlock. Keep us posted.

 

[Parsaver]

Sorry to Necro an old thread but I'm in a similar situation. I live in the desert and the ambient temperature in my house during the summer is 78-72. I just got a keg system and I want to be able to age in the keg after the cider as been stabilized. Will I have problems with cider made from S-04 yeast if after I stabilize it I store it in a keg in the closet?

I know from experience that S-04 HATES warmer temperatures during fermentation.

 

[MindenMan]

The warmer the conditioning space is, the faster the product "ages". Unless you are making low pH and high alcohol ABV ciders,your storage life may be greatly diminished.

 

[Parsaver]

Sounds like I need to build another climate controlled fermentation/storage chamber. Thank you for your response!

 

[MindenMan]

There are options for you as in, how many "blue ice" or water bottles do you have that you have can you donate to brewing? Do you have an "extra" shower or bathtub that can be designated fermentation space?
The electric "heat pump on a chip" work really well for many application; the company that builds one into a fermenter the "Lager anywhere" or some such thing. Once an environment or space is brought to temperature with enough mass in there (a couple of 5 gallon containers or so) the temperature changes should be gradual enough for the "cooling module" to keep it in check.
Due to the fact I have no idea how much space you have to work with, this entire post may just be a pipe dream...

 

[Parsaver]

Today it was 116 degrees outside. In an effort to avoid $500 plus electric bills, I have the AC on a ridiculous schedule so the ambient temperature in the parts of the house I could use an extra tub is about 85. We keep the doors and vents to the rooms we don't use closed until we use them. When winter time comes and the outside Temps drop to 50 (night) - 80 (day), I could store kegs in a nice or spare room without to much hassle. I have a fridge that we were going to upgrade from, I think it's headed for the garage and I'll set it to stay at 60. I could probably get about 6-7 months of aging in that before I had to shut it down for summer

As hot as it is I think you can understand the need for lots of cold beverages :]