[Feeler] Any Interest in Digital Tap Lists?

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I think the better idea would be something that could be done down the road and that's have an admin back end with analytics, have temperature flux, beer amount poured through each line etc.
 
My flow meters arrived last night. As Thadius said, the cables are close to 10 feet long and not 15cm like the listing states. Are we going to have to find some sort of hose barb to connect these inline in our beer lines?

Next up is ordering the pi...
 
skemp45 said:
I think the better idea would be something that could be done down the road and that's have an admin back end with analytics, have temperature flux, beer amount poured through each line etc.
Click to expand...

That would work. In the end, I see myself getting a cheap tablet just to serve as a web browser for my keezer. So as long as its easy enough for me to get this information, we could definitely hide if from the other people.
 
Posting to subscribe. I am happy to help out as well, but unfortunately it has been many years since I moved away from this kind of development. I am a pretty good debugger, but just not that familiar with PHP. I am an identity and access management architect / dev, so weird interfaces is my daily business. I just don't know how to do it in PHP yet =).

I'll hop in after someone establishes how to do the plumbing and gets the flow meters connected, and obviously after my parts arrive.

Thanks!
Sean
 
CadiBrewer said:
My flow meters arrived last night. As Thadius said, the cables are close to 10 feet long and not 15cm like the listing states. Are we going to have to find some sort of hose barb to connect these inline in our beer lines?

Next up is ordering the pi...
Click to expand...

I found some hose barbs that are supposed to work with the flow meters:

http://www.usplastic.com/catalog/item.aspx?itemid=34901&catid=714

I think these replace the grey end pieces. In the pics on kegnet, they had different barbs that clicked into the grey end pieces. Research is continuing on this...

Edit: found the other barbs:

http://www.freshwatersystems.com/p-2484-stem-barb-connector-38-od-stem-x-14-id-barb.aspx

I'll let everyone decide what way to go on their own.
 
skemp45 said:
I wouldn't imagine that would be too much trouble. Just a matter of displaying the output from a temp gauge fed into the Pi.

But that depends on which direction thadius wands to take this project.
Click to expand...

I don't see any reason not to include the feature. However, I'd like to get a basic production version out to the public before we start digging into features. IMO, a limited product with planned updates is superior to a product that isn't available but will be cool to have some day!

As with any feature, it should be able to be disabled. In fact, since this one requires additional hardware, it should be disabled by default. Same with flow meters and solenoids.

CadiBrewer said:
My flow meters arrived last night. As Thadius said, the cables are close to 10 feet long and not 15cm like the listing states. Are we going to have to find some sort of hose barb to connect these inline in our beer lines?

Next up is ordering the pi...
Click to expand...

John Guest acetal inch fittings are the preferred method to interface with these. See below.
 
JayUnt said:
That would work. In the end, I see myself getting a cheap tablet just to serve as a web browser for my keezer. So as long as its easy enough for me to get this information, we could definitely hide if from the other people.
Click to expand...

Tablet? Well, I guess you could go that way. You give up a whole lot of screen space to save a little cash tho.

AgentHubcap said:
I found some hose barbs that are supposed to work with the flow meters:

http://www.usplastic.com/catalog/item.aspx?itemid=34901&catid=714

I think these replace the grey end pieces. In the pics on kegnet, they had different barbs that clicked into the grey end pieces. Research is continuing on this...

Edit: found the other barbs:

http://www.freshwatersystems.com/p-2484-stem-barb-connector-38-od-stem-x-14-id-barb.aspx

I'll let everyone decide what way to go on their own.
Click to expand...

Correct.


To connect to a soft (vinyl) beer line, you need to use one of the following:

3/8" OD stem x 1/4" barb - John Guest PI251208S
3/8" OD stem x 5/16" barb - John Guest PI251210S
3/8" OD stem x 3/8" barb - John Guest PI251212S

I prefer to go one barb size up when using soft tubing. So for 1/4" ID beer line, I'd personally use a 5/16" barb.


To connect to a semi-rigid (LLDPE, icemaker, BevSeal, etc) line, you need to use one of the following:

(for 3/16" OD line) 3/16" hose x 3/8" stem - John Guest PI061206S
(for 1/4" OD line) 1/4" hose x 3/8" stem - John Guest PI061208S
(for 5/16" OD line) 5/16" hose x 3/8" stem - John Guest PI061210S
(for 3/8" OD line) YOU DON NEED NO STINKIN FITTINGS! Plug 'n' play.


I use 3/16" ID (5/16" OD) BevSeal Ultra (by far the most common), so I'll be buying PI061210S fittings. Two per flow meter.

I do recommend FreshWaterSystems. They did awesome with my last order.
 
I just bought a ton from Freshwatersystems. They also have pieces that fit on the shank where you slide the hose in (and on a sanke coupler). There are also 1/4" FFL x 5/16" OD hose (3/16" ID BevSeal) fittings for liquid lines on cornelius fittings. No more barbs to d*ck with!

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Home Brew mobile app
 
Lost_Arkitekt said:
I just bought a ton from Freshwatersystems. They also have pieces that fit on the shank where you slide the hose in (and on a sanke coupler). There are also 1/4" FFL x 5/16" OD hose (3/16" ID BevSeal) fittings for liquid lines on cornelius fittings. No more barbs to d*ck with!

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Home Brew mobile app
Click to expand...

Yep. This.

Using that same tubing on my 10-tapper with dual primary and 10-way secondary.

Every connection is a JG acetal inch fitting, except primary to the tank. Primary to secondary? Yep. Secondary to gas QD? Yep. Liquid QD to shank? Yep.

My last JG order with FWS was for 82 pieces. I installed all but 6 (spares). Not a single barb anywhere in my keezer, and zero leaks on the first attempt (except one warped keg lid, ugh!).

Was about to place an order for:

9 5/16 x 5/8 BSPP PI451015FS (to make some more beer lines)
9 5/16 x 1/4 Flare PM4508F4S (also to make some more beer lines)
24 5/16 x 3/8 Stem PI061210S (for 10 flow meters, plus spares)

I realized that the price discount kicks in at 10 and 50, so I went 10 on the first two. Now I can either add $7 more to my cart for $1.99 shipping, or pay $5 shipping. Choices, choices. :p
 
We converted the CSV database to mySQL and converted the hundreds of images to just a handful that automagically generate.

Much closer to release, but now we're realizing we need an interface for you all to manage it with. :\
 
AgentHubcap said:
I think these replace the grey end pieces.
Click to expand...

Btw, they do not. The grey end pieces grip the outside circumference of the tubing to create the seal and hold it in place. The stem-to-barb fitting splits right inside and has an endpiece of its own as well. Same with inserting hose... end piece stays in place.

Here's a 1-minute how-to video:



On second thought, my gas polyethylene tubing is no stiffer than vinyl. I think y'all could get away with using the reducer stem I mentioned instead of the barb. Probably personal preference on soft lines. On semi-rigid lines, don't even think about going with barbs.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
So I already have a RPi and most of the stuff needed for this, will just need the part for hooking up the sensors and the flow sensors. I just ordered the flow sensors (got 4 for $21/per) looking to buy the JG reducer stems and just want to confirm how they are going to work. The stem side will connect to the flow meter as it looks like they have a similar connector on them so the barb would connect to the connector and the hose would go in the JG connector side. Is this correct?
 
I think we are wearing down the flow meter guy. Offered 17 and got 18 =). Of course I ordered 5 so it might help a little.

So as I understand:
PI251208S to connect the flow meters to my soft vinyl lines, 3/16id
PM4508F4S for the MFL on the keg couplers
PI451015FS for the tail pieces?

I wonder how much resistance the flow meter imparts (for keg balancing purposes) Since it says it uses IR, I guess the only resistance comes from the coupling so it will be negligible.
 
Arglesnaf said:
I think we are wearing down the flow meter guy. Offered 17 and got 18 =). Of course I ordered 5 so it might help a little.

So as I understand:
PI251208S to connect the flow meters to my soft vinyl lines, 3/16id
PM4508F4S for the MFL on the keg couplers
PI451015FS for the tail pieces?

I wonder how much resistance the flow meter imparts (for keg balancing purposes) Since it says it uses IR, I guess the only resistance comes from the coupling so it will be negligible.
Click to expand...

I got mine for 18 each, as well. I think that's his bottom price.:mug:

If you actually look at the inside of the flow meter, it looks like there may be some resistance. I have long lines, and was planning on splicing the flow meters as close to the keg as possible. I'm sure there will be some trial and error to get things perfect.
 
I can't wait for a parts list and in depth how-to on this. Although very cool, not looking for the flow meter route. Just looking to have a digital tap display and this seems like it will be the cheapest/best route. Looking forward to a release and amazed at the speed that you guys are working at!
 
Yeah, I'm keeping my fingers crossed for a simple and customizable tap list display (minus the flow-meter stuff) for us minimalists once this project goes live. :)
 
Cant wait, and if you guys need an early beta tester I am well verse in coding and general application design. I have made a few myself. I started playing with the RPi but havent done much with linux, javascript, or html stuff so quickly got a little overwhelmed and put it on the back burner. But I would be more than willing to test this out if you need an inbetween an advance user and a normal user to test the interface.
 
thadius856 said:
Tablet? Well, I guess you could go that way. You give up a whole lot of screen space to save a little cash tho.
Click to expand...

I'm thinking a cheap tablet so i can do all of my keezer management right there on the touch screen and not have to keep a mouse and keyboard hooked up. I am currently building my 3 tap keezer, so i don't need too much screen space. And even if there was to be more taps that fix on the landscape screen, the touch screen would make it nice and easy to scroll down to see the rest of the taps. Ill probably test it out with my original kindle fire, and if its too annoying change it out to a larger non-touch screen.
 
Adeering said:
So I already have a RPi and most of the stuff needed for this, will just need the part for hooking up the sensors and the flow sensors. I just ordered the flow sensors (got 4 for $21/per) looking to buy the JG reducer stems and just want to confirm how they are going to work. The stem side will connect to the flow meter as it looks like they have a similar connector on them so the barb would connect to the connector and the hose would go in the JG connector side. Is this correct?
Click to expand...

That is correct, if you have soft lines you can use the barb-to-stem adapter. I prefer the reducer stem, as it's easily disassembled for cleaning. And re-usable without cutting the tip of the line off. Yes, the reducer stem will work on soft lines. Not sure what I was thinking when I said you'd need to use the barb. I already use the stems on both ends of all 11 of my soft gas lines.

Here's the deal. The flow meter presents 3/8" BSP male threads on each end. The JG fitting that comes with it presents a seal that can accommodate a 3/8" OD" tube. If you're using 3/8" tubing (I doubt it), you can just push the tubing into the JG fitting that comes with the flow meter. If not 3/8" OD line (probably the case), you need some adapting.

They don't make those 3/8" BSP adapters any smaller than 3/8" tubing OD, so we need either a barb-to-stem adapter (for soft lines) or a reducer (for semi-rigid lines).

I posted model numbers above, but if you're still confused or want to confirm, just tell me your beer line OD and what type of material it is.

Arglesnaf said:
I think we are wearing down the flow meter guy. Offered 17 and got 18 =). Of course I ordered 5 so it might help a little.

So as I understand:
PI251208S to connect the flow meters to my soft vinyl lines, 3/16id
PM4508F4S for the MFL on the keg couplers
PI451015FS for the tail pieces?

I wonder how much resistance the flow meter imparts (for keg balancing purposes) Since it says it uses IR, I guess the only resistance comes from the coupling so it will be negligible.
Click to expand...

Correct on the first one (barb connection).
Correct on the second one, if it's 5/16" OD tubing (MFL connection)
Correct on the third one, if it's 5/16" OD tubing (tail pieces).

Personally, I'd swap the barb (PI251208S) for a reducer (PI061008S). Not only are they slightly cheaper, but if you ever decided to swap out to 3/16" ID BevSeal Ultra (5/16" OD) line, you could re-use all the JG fittings. Plus, I haaate barbs.

AgentHubcap said:
I got mine for 18 each, as well. I think that's his bottom price.:mug:

If you actually look at the inside of the flow meter, it looks like there may be some resistance. I have long lines, and was planning on splicing the flow meters as close to the keg as possible. I'm sure there will be some trial and error to get things perfect.
Click to expand...

*shake fist* I should have told you guys I paid $22, so when you all got him down to $20, I wouldn't feel like I wasted $2 (10 x $2). :p

JayUnt said:
I'm thinking a cheap tablet so i can do all of my keezer management right there on the touch screen and not have to keep a mouse and keyboard hooked up. I am currently building my 3 tap keezer, so i don't need too much screen space. And even if there was to be more taps that fix on the landscape screen, the touch screen would make it nice and easy to scroll down to see the rest of the taps. Ill probably test it out with my original kindle fire, and if its too annoying change it out to a larger non-touch screen.
Click to expand...

Fair enough. I'm hoping we can add "Fermenting", "Aging", "On Deck", "Coming Soon", etc. so I can fill a 2nd monitor. No idea what I'll put on the 3rd monitor yet. *shrug* Since we went to SQL, they can all share the same db now. :)

I use this for small amounts of data entry (refresh page, reboot, etc):

41KOMkxt3AL.jpg


I use PuTTy and WinSCP for any real amount of work.
 
Bought the I/O expander board to support the flow meters. It also conditions the inputs and outputs, so it provides a layer of hardware protection between your Pi and your meters. If you goof up and fry the MCP23017 chip somehow, it's $3 to replace. If you weren't using such a device and goof up, you fry the Pi and it likely won't boot.

It does require some assembly (soldering and wire snipping), so I'll have to resharpen my soldering skills and buy an iron.

I went with the Slice of PI/O. Get it? Slice of Pie. I/O. Very punny.

I ordered the kit from ModMyPi, a British shop. It's currently £6 GBP, plus £2 GBP shipping. After conversion rate, it was $13.50 USD. Shipping will be 4 to 10 business days via Royal Post.

You can save probably $1 if you were to buy the barebones Slice of Pi, an MCP23017, and a few other parts separately. But who has time for that?

The MCP23017 will present us with 16 GPIO pins, so we can power (theoretically) up to 16 flow meters on one. Best of all, it stacks on top of the main Pi board and will fit within most of the acrylic cases available.

raspberry_pi_and_expansion_board.jpg


The expander board is the one on the left, stacked on top.
 
Thadius, do you have an eta for an 'alpha' version for those adventurous ones among us to try?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Home Brew mobile app
 
thadius856 said:
Bought the I/O expander board to support the flow meters.
Click to expand...

I just want to verify something....since you just bought this board it means the flow meters have not been tested yet with this system....is this correct?

I would like to buy some at the cheap eBay price, but would like to know they're gonna work before I spend the money.
 
I have no gotten them installed yet, no. However, there was somebody who posted in one of the first few pages that confirmed he had gotten them working with a Pi. There's plenty of sample code on WiringPi.

Additionally, the whole KegBot project is based on these flow meters on an Arduino, so we know they work. AFAIK, the Pi has better pulse sensing on the GPIO pins than the Arduino.

Now the big question. Are the eBay flow meters knockoffs or duds? Can't tell just yet.
 
mcangeli said:
Thadius, do you have an eta for an 'alpha' version for those adventurous ones among us to try?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Home Brew mobile app
Click to expand...

Doubt there will be an alpha version. Or even a beta. I'm not one for releasing faulty or incomplete projects.

However, these guys are speeding the code along at an alarming pace, so, who knows. Perhaps soon.

The list of "must do"s before release are shortening. I may have to spend the weekend writing the install/config tut. :S
 
Well, we're all merged back up. Perhaps the ugliest Git merge ever, but hey, it freaking works, mmmmmkay?!

Posted something like 7 new issues last night, mostly dealing with layout, div padding and CSS. Get to it, minions! *whip*

Jk. Really. Keep up the good work, guys. I'll try to keep up this time.
 
Got my favi keyboard today and the raspberryPI will be here tomorrow. I'm not going to go with flow meters yet and monitor is already mounted. Can't wait until the software is done.
Thanks to everyone for their hard work!!!
 
Hi folks, I've been following this thread since a link was posted a few pages back to KegNet, which I am the owner, and wanted to say hi and offer help or collaboration.

KegNet client code is available on GitHub also at https://github.com/kegnet/kegnet-client, and there's also a good deal of information on the GitHub wiki site at https://github.com/kegnet/kegnet-client/wiki. Save yourself some time working with the RasPi and temp sensor and flow meter and fork kegnet-client and see if it helps. All I ask is that if you make improvements then make them available for me to merge back into KegNet.

I love the UI of this project, is it public on GitHub? I couldn't find a link but see references to GitHub in the threads.

And please don't think poorly of me for poking my head in here -- I don't want there to a sense of "competition" but rather cooperation. These devices you are building could easily connect and show up on www.kegnetwork.com in addition to whatever UI/server you are doing just via simple REST calls.

KegNet is really more targeted at non-DIY type people with 1-2 tap commercial kegerators right now. But I'll admit you guys are clearly the most enthusiastic bunch! Many of the beta-tester applications I've received are from homebrewers with like 4-8 taps and nitro and all kinds of cool setups. Makes me think I need to design a board with more than 2 connections sooner.

Feel free to email me personally if you have specific questions.

Paul
 
I'd like to start putting together the parts for this is anticipation for the user interface and installation guide becoming live. Are there any parts that can be ordered now that will 100% be a part of the final parts list? Links would be very helpful :)
 
KegNetPaul said:
Hi folks, I've been following this thread since a link was posted a few pages back to KegNet, which I am the owner, and wanted to say hi and offer help or collaboration.

KegNet client code is available on GitHub also at https://github.com/kegnet/kegnet-client, and there's also a good deal of information on the GitHub wiki site at https://github.com/kegnet/kegnet-client/wiki. Save yourself some time working with the RasPi and temp sensor and flow meter and fork kegnet-client and see if it helps. All I ask is that if you make improvements then make them available for me to merge back into KegNet.

I love the UI of this project, is it public on GitHub? I couldn't find a link but see references to GitHub in the threads.

And please don't think poorly of me for poking my head in here -- I don't want there to a sense of "competition" but rather cooperation. These devices you are building could easily connect and show up on www.kegnetwork.com in addition to whatever UI/server you are doing just via simple REST calls.

KegNet is really more targeted at non-DIY type people with 1-2 tap commercial kegerators right now. But I'll admit you guys are clearly the most enthusiastic bunch! Many of the beta-tester applications I've received are from homebrewers with like 4-8 taps and nitro and all kinds of cool setups. Makes me think I need to design a board with more than 2 connections sooner.

Feel free to email me personally if you have specific questions.

Paul
Click to expand...

Thanks for stopping in, Paul.

There is a public repo on GitHub, however we're not providing the link here as of now. This is because we want to present a polished, complete project to the public. We don't want to turn anybody off by directing them to an alpha, then make a minor change that's easy to fix for a pro (e.g., rename a SQL table), but causes major headache for a normal person. If you have the skills to build KegNet, I'm sure you'll be able to find it.

We're currently using a CC non-commercial by-attribution license that we inherited from the Kegerface project. You're more than welcome to draw inspiration. From what I understand, your code is publicly available and you're merely charging for the setup instructions and daughter boards?

KegNet integration is a cool idea, but we've got a long way to go before we're ready for luxury features. :)
 

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