F the BS! HD 5500 BK element Myth Busting

[CodeRage]

So, another thread had brought up the high density high wattage elements may cause scorching. Well, I was at home depot and found a 5500W HD element for $13. I figured screw it, let's try it.

So, I replaced my 4500 ULWD element with it. Testing the system for leaks now. What I can tell you is this thing is much louder than my old element and heats pretty damn fast. 6.75 gallons from 100 to boiling just at a half hour.

Back to the experiment. I think I am going to brew a batch of Ed's Pale Ale and see how it turns out.

attached is the 4.5kW element next to the 5.5kW element and a pic of the 5.5kW installed. I kind of like the smaller one, the ULWD just touched my pick up at the bottom of the BK.

 

[jppostKW]

Get it done CR and you avatar is amazing. every time i look at it all i think is.....

Don't Tell Me Devil Woman!!!!!!!

 

[Sawdustguy]

Good job Code Rage! I know you and I both have participated in threads where the scortching issue with a High Density Element came up. It is cool to see a real world experiment finally test the myth. You are a home brewing myth buster.

 

[stevehaun]

Maybe you should start with a porter...
I have only had scorching once. I did two 35 gallon batches of IPA back to back and did not clean the elements in between batches. I sprayed them down with a garden hose and that was it. I got a small amount of scorching during the second batch. You can't taste it in the beer - there was just some scorch on the elements. I have used both LWD and ULWD incoloy heating elements. No problems with either. I even make a single malt pilsener that is paler than pale.
I am anxious to see if you have any scorching. Personally, I am betting that you will not.
What is the HWD element made of? I like the incoloy because there is nothing to flake off into the wort. Chrome plated would worry me a bit.

 

[CodeRage]

Why do you suggest a porter? I thought something fairly light and not bitter would expose any problems with scorching or extra caramelization.

I usually CIP with some oxyclean at 170 and give it a good rinse. The chrome element in my RIMS seemed to fair okay. I replaced that element with a 1500W element last night. The original element wasn't pretty but I had never noticed any off flavors in the final product.

So my personal prediction will be that everything will be okay.

 

[ScubaSteve]

+1 to doing something light, like a blonde. Did you replace your RIMS element with a HD one as well? The 5500w one in the BK looks like it's chrome plated, so cleanup should be pretty easy...and scorching of "residuals" should be minimal, right?

 

[CodeRage]

Yeah, the RIMS got a 1500W HWD 240v element too.

Before I was running a 4500 LWD 240v element at 120V which made it 4xLWD. Not sure about cleaning the element. I am going to do what I was doing before except trade oxyclean for PBW.

 

[mmb]

If it DOES scorch the wort, would this find a place in a dedicated Scottish Shilling boil kettle...

 

[stevehaun]

I was joking. If you scorched a porter, it would still be drinkable. Get it? ;-)
Seriously, if you scorch, you will find it on the elements when you are cleaning them but you will likely not see or taste it in the beer. I clearly had scorched protein on my elements but never tasted it in the beer.

 

[CodeRage]

gotcha! A little tired this morning and slow on the uptake.

I noticed the same thing on my RIMS element.

 

[bakins]

attached is the 4.5kW element next to the 5.5kW element and a pic of the 5.5kW installed. I kind of like the smaller one, the ULWD just touched my pick up at the bottom of the BK.

Isn't that a LWD element? Looks pretty similar to mine. Maybe I picked up the wrong thing (don't have the packaging any more), but I've never had issues - as I drink a very, very light cream ale...

 

[CodeRage]

The wavey one is the Ultra Low, the short straight one is the High Density. It's only about 10 inches long. Some 4500 LD are of the straight variety but they are a bit longer.

 

[HarkinBanks]

Good on ya CR, I will be interested in seeing your results.

 

[variverrat]

Very interested in how this turns out, but a quick question. Is this just to save some space or have less element to clean? I wouldn't think it would affect the heating rate. Watts is watts, right?

Edit: Ah, sorry, didn't read this was in response to another thread.

 

[passedpawn]

You've piqued my interest for sure. The best test would be to mash a 10 gallon, but split the resulting wort in half and do a 5g batch on one element and a 5g batch on the other element. That would make for a very objective test (only one variable).

I think the ripple elements are gnarley looking, though. Kinda like them.

 

[CodeRage]

You've piqued my interest for sure. The best test would be to mash a 10 gallon, but split the resulting wort in half and do a 5g batch on one element and a 5g batch on the other element. That would make for a very objective test (only one variable).

I think the ripple elements are gnarley looking, though. Kinda like them.

Yeah, it would be, problem is I have to replace the element in the middle of a batch. I usually do a few dry test runs between batches to make sure there are no leaks when I change any of the plumbing. Right now I am looking to debunk or prove that a HWD element will have a big impact or possibly ruin a brew session. Maybe do the subtle difference comparison down the road.

Let me tell you something about those wave elements. You get a good rolling boil going it will cause the wort to slosh side to side. You can tell the brew rig is shifting weight back and forth but not really rocking. The straight element hasn't done this on my test runs.

 

[The Pol]

Yes, my old ULWD RIPP element would get my entire rig rocking back and forth during the boil!

 

[passedpawn]

Yes, my old ULWD RIPP element would get my entire rig rocking back and forth during the boil!

Yoop, you catch that? Might want to chock the wheels and extend the outriggers before you get started!

My BK sits flat on the ground, so I've never noticed any movement.

 

[The Pol]

Yoop, you catch that? Might want to chock the wheels and extend the outriggers before you get started!

My BK sits flat on the ground, so I've never noticed any movement.

When the brew rig is rockin' dont bother knockin'!

 

[The Pol]

Any word on this?

 

[CodeRage]

Have got some Ed's Pale Ale a week into fermenting The mash didn't go well (low temps) but You should still be able to detect any scorching if there is any. I may pull a sample tonight or tomorrow when I transfer to a secondary.

 

[The Pol]

Have got some Ed's Pale Ale a week into fermenting The mash didn't go well (low temps) but You should still be able to detect any scorching if there is any. I may pull a sample tonight or tomorrow when I transfer to a secondary.

So, there was nothing noticeable in the BK huh? Nice work sir.

 

[TimWeber]

Question:
I am stuck with 110 VAC. Last night I ran tests on my prototype RIMS. I used a 1500 ULWD element in my RIMS and an aditional 1500 watt element (on another circuit) to bring the temp of 4 gallons of water up. After I removed the second heat stick the temperature steadily fell.

The ULWD element couldnt provide enough heat to offset the heat loss in the system. I am using a Blichmann MT with no lid on, no insulation on my RIMS, 8'' or so of thick walled silicon tubing, ambient temp was 68.

Well I realized I made a $20 mistake, so I am going to switch out the element. Should I go with a 1500 LWD element or HD element?

I am looking forward to seeing your results on the caramelization.

 

[passedpawn]

Question:
Well I realized I made a $20 mistake, so I am going to switch out the element. Should I go with a 1500 LWD element or HD element?

An HD won't heat your kettle any faster than the ULWD. And, the jury is still out on carmelization with HD elements. It's looking like the mythbusters are about to conclude there is no carmelization. Go with the HD if you like the plating and/or the form factor better than the much longer ULWD.

I sorta wish there WAS carmelization from the HD elements. I'd figure out a way to make the elements removeable and use the HD element for scottish ales. Cool.

 

[TimWeber]

Sorry off topic!

I am using it in my RIMS to control my MT temp. Propane for my kettle.

Could someone recommend an element to use on 110VAC? I am using an ULWD element, if I use a different density element will it add more heat? My thoughts are yes, since it will heat the moving liquid faster. Or could I use an element rated for 220VAC, but then only supply 110VAC?

 

[Sawdustguy]

Sorry off topic!

I am using it in my RIMS to control my MT temp. Propane for my kettle.

Could someone recommend an element to use on 110VAC if I a different density element will not add more heat? Could I use an element rated for 220VAC but then only supply 110VAC?

http://www.plumbingsupply.com/elements.html#tiny

Have a look at 120-1500-ELD or 120-1500-LD. They are 1500 watt 120 volt elements. I use the low density version in my RIMS.

 

[TimWeber]

Sawdustguy
I purchased the 120-1500-ELD Element, which is not working.

If I use a 120-1500-LD do you think that will provide enough heat?

 

[CodeRage]

Sawdustguy
I purchased the 120-1500-ELD Element, which is not working.

If I use a 120-1500-LD do you think that will provide enough heat?

No, the change in Watt Density doesnt affect how much power you are putting into the wort. It's the same amount of power over a different surface area.

You have 2 choices, insulate better or add more power. From what I've read it takes about 2 to 3kW to get 5 gal to maintain a boil.

 

[nostalgia]

Hey CR, slightly off topic: how is the element attached to the kettle? I was thinking about having a 1" NPT nut welded on, but yours doesn't quite look like that.

Thanks,

-Joe

 

[CodeRage]

Hey CR, slightly off topic: how is the element attached to the kettle? I was thinking about having a 1" NPT nut welded on, but yours doesn't quite look like that.

Thanks,

-Joe

No problem.
I have a 1" NPT stainless nut and silicone o-ring from bargainfittings.com. It works well and doesn't leak. I believe that in the near future I am going to replace all of my weldless fittings with silver soldered couplers.