Double IPA Dogfish Head 90 Minute Clone

[wetchicken6]

i used your recipe thi sunday. the mistake i made was i only used 6 gallons of strike water. I ended up with about 4 gallons of wort at a gravity of 1.070. I added two gallons of water to my boil, will that throw everything off? after the boil I ended up with around 4 gallons, which seems low but I gue that is right for a 90 minute boil. I figure by time I siphon to secondary, I might only end up with around 3 to 3.5 gallons. I figured if I made a 2 gallon wort with five pounds of 2 row that will give me a 1.080 and i can add that to my beer at secondary, let me know what you think. thanks

 

[brew2enjoy]

Sort-of off topic question for you scottland. I read in your blog that you washed WLP007, any suggestions or tips for a new yeast washer using that yeast? I have read that some have trouble washing yeasts that drop out fast.

 

[scottland]

I figured if I made a 2 gallon wort with five pounds of 2 row that will give me a 1.080 and i can add that to my beer at secondary, let me know what you think. thanks

If you're going to do that, add it to the primary. Personally I would just ride it out. It will be a little lower in alcohol, but should taste good. Probably like a 75min or something. There's always next time...

@brew2enjoy: WLP007 is a totally PITA to wash. You can tell from that picture. You get a mixture of trub and yeast at the bottom, and more trub on top. I decant off the water/beer and the loose trub and just pitch the rest. Not a whole lot different than professional breweries, as they typically pitch slurry straight from the conical.

 

[brew2enjoy]

@brew2enjoy: WLP007 is a totally PITA to wash. You can tell from that picture. You get a mixture of trub and yeast at the bottom, and more trub on top. I decant off the water/beer and the loose trub and just pitch the rest. Not a whole lot different than professional breweries, as they typically pitch slurry straight from the conical.

I plan on saving 4-5 mason jars of this yeast. I guess my biggest concern in how long they will remain viable with the trub. Some of the jars might sit for months, maybe even a year. I guess I will find out

 

[brew2enjoy]

Transfered and did the first round of dry hops tonight. I think I'm going to transfer to the keg for the final dry hopping and do those in a mesh bag. But man, this taste amazing already. I took another sample to see if it dropped any, it didn't. But the sample sure was enjoyable! That amber malt really shines right now. Im sure that will change after the dry hopping is complete.

Also down to 4.25 gallons now. Damn hops!

 

[SenorPepe]

Scottland, I'm about to bottle this one up tonight or tomorrow. What do you shoot for in terms of carbonation?

 

[scottland]

Pretty standard, around 2.2 to 2.4 volumes. So 4oz corn sugar by weight would be about right. Use your experience on past batches for how much corn sugar.

Let me know how these batches turn out. I'm kind of jones-ing to make another batch of this.

 

[SenorPepe]

Sounds good. I'll post a pour in a couple weeks.

 

[BrewToppers]

Brewed this up yesterday and thought that I was doing a pretty dang good job. Everything seemed to go off without a hitch but ended up short on my OG. I was hitting for 1.085 (I believe this recipe assumes a 72% efficiency). My final OG ended up at around 1.065 — any thoughts on why??

Do I really suck at mashing that much? Only thing I can possibly think of is that when mashing, I used too much water, and when I sparged, there was a large amount of fermentable sugar still in my mashtun that hadn't been washed out.

Thoughts?

Really looking forward to trying this one. Airlock was bubbling away this morning after pitching a 2L yeast starter of Wyeast 1098.

 

[brew2enjoy]

Brewed this up yesterday and thought that I was doing a pretty dang good job. Everything seemed to go off without a hitch but ended up short on my OG. I was hitting for 1.085 (I believe this recipe assumes a 72% efficiency). My final OG ended up at around 1.065 — any thoughts on why??

Do I really suck at mashing that much? Only thing I can possibly think of is that when mashing, I used too much water, and when I sparged, there was a large amount of fermentable sugar still in my mashtun that hadn't been washed out.

Thoughts?

Really looking forward to trying this one. Airlock was bubbling away this morning after pitching a 2L yeast starter of Wyeast 1098.

What temp did you mash at and for how long? What type of sparging do you do? I am a new all-grain Brewer so I'm not sure what would cause that except low efficiency.

One more question, how much volume did you have after the boil?

 

[BrewToppers]

I mashed at 149F for 60minutes... the temperature held perfectly for the entire hour.

I sparged with 168F water by draining almost all of the wort from the mash, then pouring in a couple gallons of water and mixing. The mixing may have been my problem since in the past, I usually just pour my sparge water onto a plate sitting on the mash so it won't tunnel. Basically I just took the runnings of that until I reached the pre-boil volume of 7.0 gallons.

After 90 minutes of boil, it looked like I had the estimated post-boil volume I was shooting for, but guessing that the ridiculous amount of hops soaked up quite a bit of that.

All-in-all, I thinking I sparged incorrectly and should have started with maybe 7.5 gallons pre-boil.

Thoughts?

 

[brew2enjoy]

It may have been your sparge temp. You want the temp to be around 170 after it settles. I sparged with 190* water and stirred for 5 minutes. By the time I drained the sparge water it was 165*. I could be missing something but that seems like the only part of your process that was off.

 

[scoundrel]

Ok, so my buddy and I (and several others) did a blind taste test of this the other night after about a month and a half and I have to say its a DAMN good beer. That being said it wasn't completely cloned. So we asked for input and the overwhelming response was its missing the deep "raisin" flavor of the original and was a bit lighter. It was a 10 gallon batch and everything went perfect. I suspect there that a small amount of crystal 120 may need to be added. I had a couple of beers that used crystal 120 and it had a similar aroma and taste. I was also inspired by their website tasting notes stating "raisiney". I may throw a little in next time just to experiment.

 

[brew2enjoy]

Ok, so my buddy and I (and several others) did a blind taste test of this the other night after about a month and a half and I have to say its a DAMN good beer. That being said it wasn't completely cloned. So we asked for input and the overwhelming response was its missing the deep "raisin" flavor of the original and was a bit lighter. It was a 10 gallon batch and everything went perfect. I suspect there that a small amount of crystal 120 may need to be added. I had a couple of beers that used crystal 120 and it had a similar aroma and taste. I was also inspired by their website tasting notes stating "raisiney". I may throw a little in next time just to experiment.

What was the date on the bottle of 90 minute? As Scottland says in the OP, 90 Minute starts to develop that raisin/apricot flavor as it ages. I have had it fresh on tap before and the hops overpowered the other flavors. So as your beer ages and the hops start to fade, that will be the real test. When mine is finished and kegged, I will probably bottle a 6er and stash it away for a few months and see how it changes.

 

[scottland]

I'm thinking the clone might possibly need a pinch more amber malt, like 1/4lb more. I get pretty high efficency, so the amber was a higher % of my grist. I think 1.25lbs would be about right.

 

[scoundrel]

What was the date on the bottle of 90 minute? As Scottland says in the OP, 90 Minute starts to develop that raisin/apricot flavor as it ages. I have had it fresh on tap before and the hops overpowered the other flavors. So as your beer ages and the hops start to fade, that will be the real test. When mine is finished and kegged, I will probably bottle a 6er and stash it away for a few months and see how it changes.

Not sure off hand on the date, but the place I bought it was my normal shop here in good old central Maryland. The owner once told me that they have a hard time keeping it in stock. I believe its mostly due to their good price. I suspect it wasn't very old at all. Amarillo will give you apricot and it was definitely there. However, the raisiney flavor in the commercial version was very pronounced and I don't see how aging would cause this. Perhaps it isn't crystal 120. Maybe its a small amount of special B. I don't know. I can't pin it down yet.

 

[DustBow]

Might also be their "doggy" yeast coming into play?

 

[scottland]

Perhaps it isn't crystal 120. Maybe its a small amount of special B. I don't know. I can't pin it down yet.

It's just Thomas facwett Amber malt. I do agree the recipe needs a pinch more. I updated it to 1.25 on the first page. What was your OG and FG?

 

[scoundrel]

It's just Thomas facwett Amber malt. I do agree the recipe needs a pinch more. I updated it to 1.25 on the first page. What was your OG and FG?

The OG was 1.084 and FG was 1.014. So it was a little dry but that "raisiney" flavor was pretty much non-existent. Maybe more is the answer. I may run a smaller batch to see. In the mean time, hopefully others who have recently made this will provide additional feedback.

 

[brew2enjoy]

I'll be transferring mine to the keg tonight. I still have a week of dry hopping though. I plan on sneaking a sample to see how it is coming along. Last time I sampled it the malt seemed very close but mine also finished on the sweeter side at 1.022.

 

[SenorPepe]

I think mine ending at 1.012 is going to be perfect. I haven't had the real 90 minute in years so it's not really important if it's a few points of from the real thing. Early testers have the malt right where I want it.

 

[Silentnoiz]

I'm a big fan of DFH's 60/90/120 and this recipe looks great. Especially exciting are the reviews of how good it smells and tastes . I think I'm going to brew this tomorrow.

First question - I have 18 pounds of Briess 2-row pale malt from a DIPA I did last week, and I can get the Thomas Fawcett. Will that still work out close (I may use all 18 as I don't think my efficiency is that high).

In that DIPA I did last week, I used WP007 (that stuff rocks!). I have it in my primary (5gal), and was going to rack to a secondary (and dry-hop).

Second question - if I simply rack off the bottom of that primary, could I just put my chilled wort straight into that cake (yeast and trub and all), give it a good swirl and be off to the races?

Any advice is appreciated!

 

[Silentnoiz]

Sorry, for some reason I had it in my head that the recipe called for a Pilsner malt.

Another question tho ; any thoughts on cold-crashing my primary before racking?

 

[brew2enjoy]

There is quite a bit of information on here about pitching directly on yeast cakes. I would do a search and read up on those threads. Technically you would be over-pitching, but that probably won't hurt your beer. I would use the Mr Malty pitching calculator found online and pitch the correct amount of slurry.

Nothing wrong with cold crashing, crash away!

 

[scottland]

First question - I have 18 pounds of Briess 2-row pale malt from a DIPA I did last week, and I can get the Thomas Fawcett. Will that still work out close (I may use all 18 as I don't think my efficiency is that high).

Yes, you're perfectly fine. If you use 18lbs of two row, use some more amber malt to keep the %s of malt the same. Just calc out the %s and keep the ratio the same.

In that DIPA I did last week, I used WP007 (that stuff rocks!). I have it in my primary (5gal), and was going to rack to a secondary (and dry-hop).

It's not ideal to go from a huge beer to another huge beer, but it'll still work. It just might be a pinch more estery and FG might be a pinch high, but in this beer, that'll be fine.

Don't pitch on the whole cake though. Sanitize two buckets/carboys. Rack your DIPA into one(secondary). Sanitize a stainless spoon, or some other scooping tool, and scoop out about 1/3 of the yeast cake into the second clean fermenter. That's all you need (and then some). Then rack your cooled 90min wort into that. If you don't have two spare fermenters. sanitize a jar or something, and scoop the yeast into that, then clean and sanitize the fermenter before racking your wort into it.

 

[Silentnoiz]

Thanks for the replies guys. This site has a lot of valuable information, experiences, and opinions. I'm realizing that many opinions differ, which just means I'll have to try them all myself to find out.

I ran across a really informative post (albeit long) on yeast pitching that really makes a lot of sense (it's measured): https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f163/why-not-pitch-your-yeast-cake-166221/. I think it probably will probably fall right in line with your recommendation to use 1/3 of the yeast cake.

Here's my situation:
Brewed a 10gal DIPA 6 days ago (put into two 5gal glass carboys), using WLP007. Target OG was 1.09 but we were WAY off and only got to 1.068 (I think I know why, but won't get into that here, I'll try my fixes first). I did a starter and fermentation seemed to go really well (started within the first couple hours). I have 2oz Citra and 1oz (both leaf) to dry hop into each 5gal. I want to capture and reuse the yeast (I have links to good processes for doing that).

Here's my question:
Do I:
A - On day 7 (either that or I wait until day 14 since I'll be out of town) rack to and dry-hop in secondary and capture the yeast from the primary.
OR
B - On day 7 simply dry-hop (in muslin bags) into the primary and harvest the yeast when I go to bottle.

I've read A LOT of posts on using secondary vs just staying in the primary, but since I want to harvest the yeast AND dry-hop, I'm not sure what the best route is. Any recommendations and why?

Thanks!

 

[brew2enjoy]

Getting close with this one. Transfered to the keg on Saturday and added the last dose of dry hops in a mesh bag. I'll give it a week at room temp and start force carbing. I cannot wait to try this beer chilled and carbonated. I have a feeling this is going to be one of my best brews so far!

 

[SenorPepe]

I've been drinking about a bottle a day, starting at Day 4 in the bottle. Even chilled and not-so-carbonated it's pretty damn good.

 

[mtchabot]

Just finished this recipe. Only issue was I realized during the mash that I didn't have the 1oz of warrior. Shouldve run an inventory check before I started. Anyways, wondering if its a good idea or not to add the warrior to the dry hop. What do you think?

 

[scottland]

Just finished this recipe. Only issue was I realized during the mash that I didn't have the 1oz of warrior. Shouldve run an inventory check before I started. Anyways, wondering if its a good idea or not to add the warrior to the dry hop. What do you think?

You can, but I don't see warrior adding much to the dry hop. Expect the beer to be a little less bitter than 90 minute, but otherwise close. Warrior doesn't contribute much in terms of flavor and aroma, it's sole purpose in this recipe is bitterness.