"Dawn Treader" Tripel from Canal Park Brewery

[IJesusChrist]

Is anyone familiar with Duluth, MN Canal Park Brewery Tripel called "Dawn Treader"? I'd like to make a clone of it - it is the only 'light' beer that I've ever wanted a second glass of (I'm a huge stout/porter drinker).

They don't sell outside of their brewery, so you'd have to have gone in and had it. Would love to hear if anyone has any ideas.

 

[ja09]

A big nope. Love Duluth but I usually go to Fitgers when I'm there. You'll have better luck with a local homebrew club. I'm sure there a few people on here that live there though.

 

[IJesusChrist]

Here we go:

Glad you dig our Tripel. The fermentables for Dawn Treader are pretty simple. 82% pilsner 5% caramel 10L and 13% invert sugar added during the boil. Make sure to oxygenate well and pitch a larger enough starter because at around 1.082 this guys a monster. Good luck. Brew on!

Hops Varieties:Golding, Hallertau, Sterling

I highly recommend this one! Anyone have an idea for a very fruity yeast? I'm not much of a beer maker.

 

[MNSmitty]

Hmmmm..
I may have to grab some of those when I am up that way next. That sounds good. And then maybe try a clone. I like Tripels.

 

[lookwow]

I would think wyeast 1388 would be what you might want to try for a fruity profile.

 

[Zippox]

I too have interest in brewing this. Info I was able to find from their website:

ABV 9.2%
OG 19.8 (1.082)
FG 3.3 (1.013)
IBU 35

Grains: Pilsner, Caramel 10L, Carapils, Candi sugar
Hops: Golding, Hallertau, Sterling

http://canalparkbrewery.com/brew/dawn-treader-belgian-tripel/

Unfortunately no ratios are mentioned!

 

[IJesusChrist]

I too have interest in brewing this. Info I was able to find from their website:

ABV 9.2%
OG 19.8 (1.082)
FG 3.3 (1.013)
IBU 35

Grains: Pilsner, Caramel 10L, Carapils, Candi sugar
Hops: Golding, Hallertau, Sterling

http://canalparkbrewery.com/brew/dawn-treader-belgian-tripel/

Unfortunately no ratios are mentioned!

Replied this:
82% pilsner 5% caramel 10L and 13% invert sugar added during the boil.

 

[Zippox]

I would think wyeast 1388 would be what you might want to try for a fruity profile.

Looks like the yeast equivalent they use isn't very fruity:
WLP530

I'll try and come up with a recipe where I guess on the amount of hops, but I'll use beersmith to make sure the IBUs are dialed in at 35. I'll see if I can figure out how to post it when I'm done.

 

[IJesusChrist]

Looks like the yeast equivalent they use isn't very fruity:
WLP530

I'll try and come up with a recipe where I guess on the amount of hops, but I'll use beersmith to make sure the IBUs are dialed in at 35. I'll see if I can figure out how to post it when I'm done.

Its strange, no? I remember it being quite fruity. Perhaps they ferment at the higher end of the range?

 

[IJesusChrist]

Looks like the yeast equivalent they use isn't very fruity:
WLP530

I'll try and come up with a recipe where I guess on the amount of hops, but I'll use beersmith to make sure the IBUs are dialed in at 35. I'll see if I can figure out how to post it when I'm done.

Ever get around to this?

 

[Zippox]

Ever get around to this?

I think I may have finished making the recipe, yeah. I'll try and pull it up tonight on my computer and make sure. Then I'll post it here.

 

[Zippox]

Recipe Type: All Grain
Yeast: WLP530
Yeast Starter: Yes - 1.5 L with stir plate to get at least 308 Billion cells
Efficiency: 75% ("Total Efficiency" in beersmith)
Batch Size (Gallons): 5.5
Original Gravity: 1.082
Final Gravity: 1.013
% Alcohol: 9.2%
IBU: 34.8
Boiling Time (Minutes): 90
Color: 4.9
Primary Fermentation (# of Days & Temp): Ramp fermentation temp (evenly over time) from 63 - 75F over 7 days
Secondary Fermentation (# of Days & Temp): 75 for 21 days

Grist/Fermentables
----------------------------------
12 lbs 8.0 oz Pilsner (2 Row) Bel (2.0 SRM) 81.7 %
12.8 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 10L (10.0 SRM) 5.2 %
2 lbs Invert Sugar (0.0 SRM) 13.1 %

Mash Steps
---------------
Mash at 156.0 F 75 min
Fly or batch sparge 168.0 F

Boil Steps
---------------
Begin 90 minute boil
0.8 oz Sterling [7.50 %] - Boil 60 min
1.00 oz Hallertauer Mittelfrueh [4.00 %] - Boil 20 min
2 lbs Invert Sugar - Boil 15 min
1.00 tsp Irish Moss (Boil 10.0 mins) Fining - Boil 10 min
1.00 oz Styrian Goldings [5.40 %] - Boil 10 min

Yeast Ingredients
----------------------------------
308 Billion cells or 1.5 L stir-plate starter seeded with 1 vial Abbey Ale (White Labs #WLP530)

Fermentation Pitch Notes:
---------------------
Chill wort to 63-64F
Oxygenate
Pitch decanted yeast starter
Ramp fermentation temp (evenly over time) from 63 - 75F over 7 days.
Keep at 75F for another 21 days

 

[Zippox]

Once one of us tries out this recipe and provides tasting notes, if it's positive then I'll go ahead and put this recipe as the first post in a new thread. For now we can discuss the recipe and see if we want to make tweaks to it. That said, the specifications of this recipe matches all of the information we have been able to gather (ABV, grain/invert sugar percentages, Original Gravity and Final Gravity). The one main thing that we could really play with is the amount and timing of the hops (and possibly the order), and the fermentation temperature schedule. I did do some research and found that the hop schedule I provided is pretty normal and gets us the 35 IBUs that we are shooting for. The fermentation temperature schedule could use a closer eye.

One other thing to mention, the grain/invert sugar percentages you said they told you about for some reason doesn't include "carapils" like their website says the recipe should contain. I chose to not add the carapils into the recipe since they told you directly that it was just pilsner, caramel 10 L, and invert sugar.

 

[beergolf]

Zippox. That recipe looks pretty good for a tripel. I have not had the one the Op mentions, but do brew a lot of Belgians.

One thing I would change is to mash much lower. Mashing at 156 is way to high for a tripel. Mash at 149 would make it more fermentable and dry it out like a good tripel should be.

 

[Zippox]

One thing I would change is to mash much lower. Mashing at 156 is way to high for a tripel. Mash at 149 would make it more fermentable and dry it out like a good tripel should be.

So that's something I wanted to discuss. The brewers at Canal Park told us the grain ratios. And the site tells us the OG and FG. Given that info, I found the only way to not go below 1.013 was to mash at 156. Is there a different approach?

 

[IJesusChrist]

I don't have all grain equipment currently but this is what I've started this weekend:

9.5 DME Pilsen (3.5 start, 6 at 20 mins +0.7 lb for starter)
.6 Belgian carapils
.6 american caramel
1.5lb candi sugar
Estimated OG: 1.097
Estimated FG: 1.027
Estimated ABV: 9.21
Hop additions:
1 oz German Perle (~8% AA) @ 60 mins
1 oz Saaz (~4% AA) @ 15 minutes
Starter:
WLP530
2 Literstarter on stir plate
1.06 OG (.75 lb DME)
= 5.79 B cells = 1.32 cells/mL/P
(1.25 is target)

The fg is not the same as posted here... So it won't be identical.
I think something to strongly consider is to make a much larger starter, I have 3 days at 1.060

Edit: is there some way to drop my fg lower with extract? 1.027 seems very high, even with the starting of 1.096

 

[Zippox]

I don't have all grain equipment currently but this is what I've started this weekend:

9.5 DME Pilsen (3.5 start, 6 at 20 mins +0.7 lb for starter)
.6 Belgian carapils
.6 american caramel
1.5lb candi sugar
Estimated OG: 1.097
Estimated FG: 1.027
Estimated ABV: 9.21
Hop additions:
1 oz German Perle (~8% AA) @ 60 mins
1 oz Saaz (~4% AA) @ 15 minutes
Starter:
WLP530
2 Literstarter on stir plate
1.06 OG (.75 lb DME)
= 5.79 B cells = 1.32 cells/mL/P
(1.25 is target)

The fg is not the same as posted here... So it won't be identical.
I think something to strongly consider is to make a much larger starter, I have 3 days at 1.060

Edit: is there some way to drop my fg lower with extract? 1.027 seems very high, even with the starting of 1.096

How come you're deciding to not match the OG? Dawn Treader is 1.082 and yours is 1.096. I'd have to type it into beersmith but maybe your FG would be lower if your OG is lower.

 

[IJesusChrist]

How come you're deciding to not match the OG? Dawn Treader is 1.082 and yours is 1.096. I'd have to type it into beersmith but maybe your FG would be lower if your OG is lower.

Changing it to 1.083, my FG is still 1.023...

I've heard the FG calculation on beersmith can be quite wrong, though.

 

[Zippox]

Changing it to 1.083, my FG is still 1.023...

I've heard the FG calculation on beersmith can be quite wrong, though.

What temp are you providing for your grain mash temperature? I'm betting that since you're using DME you don't have much control over the fermentability but you should have control over those grains you put in. If you haven't already, try using 148 for that mash temp.

I do all grain and I find that if I match the mash temp that beersmith wants me to hit then it ends up on the same FG. Haven't really experienced any variation on that personally.

 

[IJesusChrist]

What temp are you providing for your grain mash temperature? I'm betting that since you're using DME you don't have much control over the fermentability but you should have control over those grains you put in. If you haven't already, try using 148 for that mash temp.

I do all grain and I find that if I match the mash temp that beersmith wants me to hit then it ends up on the same FG. Haven't really experienced any variation on that personally.

Well, my grain bill doesn't have a partial mash option, really.

I pitched today. The OG was ~1.087 but this was ~50°F, so I think it should be a bit lower.

I would probably benefit from even more of a starter. My 2 liter, 1.060 starter I think is still cutting it low. Beersmith says I should have an excess of cells, but I don't really believe that, either. If I were to redo it I would have done a 2-step
1.040 2 liter, decant, and repitch another 1.040 2 liter and pitch this.

Also, I used Pilsen LME. Its a lot darker than pilsen DME. I'm not sure if this is just a cause of getting it wet (i.e. there really is no color difference) but this is DEFINITELY darker than the dawn treader.

Good luck, let me know how your all grain goes.

 

[hottpeper13]

Here we go:

I highly recommend this one! Anyone have an idea for a very fruity yeast? I'm not much of a beer maker.

But I would think you make good wine.

 

[IJesusChrist]

But I would think you make good wine.

Someone called it good?
Dude I just make it.

 

[IJesusChrist]

So I went ahead and took a taste and gravity reading at day 11 (yesterday):

SG: 1.010 (already ~.013 below my last attempt's FG!)
Taste: HOLY YES. Its dawn treader.

I'd definitely go with that yeast - WLP530, and a 48 hour starter at 1.060 has worked wonders.

I also did 3 nutrient additions
1 @ pitch, Fermaid-K + DAP
1 @ 1.027, Fermaid-K + DAP
1 @ 1.010, Fermaid-O

Bueno! I'll give an update this weekend when I think it'll dry down a bit more (still bubbles every ~3 seconds in the air lock)

 

[Zippox]

Will be brewing my recipe from post #12 this weekend. I'll post results a couple/few months from now with the results.