Contaminated Yeast ?!

[Chefencore]

Hector- can you walk us through a typical brew day- be specific!!

 

[hector]

Not talking about glass carboys, but glass jugs, about 4-5 liters in size. Usually they come filled with juice.

I've never seen such a thing in any Store here .

Juices are sold here in plastic Jugs , plastic Bottles or Tetra Pak .

Hector

 

[badhabit]

So , how should I find the Cause of this Problem ?!

I use always Primary for 14 Days and then I would bottle the Beer .

I think this Batch is contaminated , because it has behaved the same as the previous batches ( after 2-3 Days of vigorous fermentation , the Beer remains cloudy until the end of the Primary Phase and there are always tiny bobbles coming to the surface from the bottom of the Carboy ) .

Hector

I would say given your description of the contamination that you are not describing an infected batch. Have you ever let the brew finish and given it the old taste test? Before I tried chasing down this issue any further I would give that a try. If you are worried about what you describe as the indication of the infection, give it another week in the primary or next time go to a 1 week primary and two week secondary. Without knowing exactly what you are brewing I would suggest at very minimum a three week condition.

 

[Yooper]

I started another Thread titled " How to use Dry yeast ? " because there were not enough replies to this Thread .

Your thread was not deleted. It was combined with this one. One of the forum rules is you don't start multiple threads with the same topic. It's confusing, repetitive, and impossible to follow the thread.

All of the posts are here. Not one was deleted.

 

[hector]

So , I brewed my current Batch as follows :

In fact , it's a Test Batch because I wanted to find out where the Bacteria comes from .

I dissolved 142.9 grams of light DME in 600 ml of Deionized water and diluted it to 1.250 Liters . The Extract which I use have 42 points and the Vaporization Rate is 250 ml per 20 Minutes . So , after 20 Min. boil , I would have one liter of Wort which has O.G. 1.050 .

After boiling , I cooled the covered Pot in an Ice-Water Bath and it took 10-15 Minutes . Then I racked the cool Wort into a clean and sanitized plastic Water Jug using a clean and sanitized Vinyl Tube , because I thought that the Bacteria may come from the Edge of the Pot .

The Jug provided enough room for aeration , as I made the 1-liter-Wort splash in the 5-liter-Jug .

By the way , I use Iodophor for Sanitizing . I buy " Povidone Iodine 10% " from Drug Store and dilute it

in Deionized water ( 1.25 ml per Liter of Water ) .

I poured the aerated Wort into a clean and sanitized 1.5-liter-plastic-spring-Water-Jug using a clean and sanitized glass Funnel . I read the Wort Temperature using a clean and sanitized Thermometer and capped the Jug .

The Wort Temp. was 22C and my Room temp. was 24C . I left the Jug in the Room and went to the Kitchen .

I boiled 150 ml of bottled spring Water for 15 Minutes and then cooled it covered in Ice-Water bath . As its Temp. reached 26C , I took 10 ml of the Water by using a clean and sanitized Syringe and poured it into a clean and sanitized 50ml-Glass-Beaker and put it on a Scale and poured slowly the dry Yeast onto the Water surface till the Scale read 1.0 gram . Then I covered the Beaker with a clean and sanitized sheet of Aluminium Foil , waited for 20 Minutes . Then after a gentle stirring , I poured it into the Jug which contained the Wort .

I left the capped Jug in the Room for an Hour , because I wanted to eat something . Then I reduced its Temp. gradually to 20C and put on the clean and sanitized Airlock .

After 7 Hours there were a tiny Layer of white Foam on the surface .

So , can I say the Lag time was 7 hours ?!

During this time , the ambient Temp. was 20C and as the vigorous fermentation began after 12 Hours , I reduced it to 19C .

The vigorous fermentation took 3 Days and then slowed down gradually .

Today is the 8th Day and the ambient Temp. is still at 19C .

Although I used a fast fermenting Yeast , there are tiny bobbles coming non-stop from the bottom of the

Jug to the surface and the Beer looks cloudy .

Hector

 

[jds]

Hector:

It sounds like you're doing everything right. I think the best thing you can do for yourself and your beer right now is to leave it alone for another week or so, and then bottle and age it for at least another three weeks. The tiny bubbles you see coming up from the yeast cake are a sign that the beer is not done fermenting yet. The yeast is still consuming residual sugars in the wort, and it's also converting some other waste products that don;t taste good into other products that taste better. What your beer needs is time and patience.

Beer can taste funny early in the fermenting and aging process. You may have read about "green" beer before. Green beer is beer that hasn't had time to properly age.

Look at it this way. Either the beer has an infection, or it does not. If it does, you can still bottle it, carbonate it, and let it age for a few weeks -- you have nothing to lose except a little bit of effort.

If the beer is not infected, and the green flavor of the beer is fooling you, you might end up with a gallon of tasty beer in another few weeks. The worst thing that can happen is that you put in the effort and your beer still doesn't taste good. I just think you need to give it the chance to age and mature before you decide it's ruined. Lots of great beer doesn't taste great for five or six weeks after you brew it.

Good luck, and I hope you'll keep us update on how it turns out.

 

[Chefencore]

Sounds all good to me. Only things I would change is to make the yeast starter first and pour your cooled wort directly into your 1.5L jug. You should be able to aerate in it just fine.
And put the airlock on before your snack- and I am more concerned with the cleanliness of my hands than my equipment while brewing. RDWHAHB

 

[hector]

Hector:

Beer can taste funny early in the fermenting and aging process. You may have read about "green" beer before. Green beer is beer that hasn't had time to properly age.

You are right , BUT my previous Batches didn't smell and taste like a green Beer .

They were sour like Vinegar .

Hector

 

[Gameface]

You are right , BUT my previous Batches didn't smell and taste like a green Beer .

They were sour like Vinegar .

Hector

Yeah, like green beer.

Beer at room temp, just out of the fermenter, that hasn't been carb'd doesn't taste like beer, green or otherwise, to me either.

Let it ride, you are doing fine.

 

[hector]

and I am more concerned with the cleanliness of my hands than my equipment while brewing. RDWHAHB

I wash my Hands regularly with Soap and warm water by brewing and from the point of transferring the Wort from the pot to the Jug , I wear latex Gloves , wash them with Soap and Water as if I'm washing my Hands again and sanitize with Iodophor .

Hector

 

[Gameface]

I wash my Hands regularly with Soap and warm water by brewing and from the point of transferring the Wort from the pot to the Jug , I wear latex Gloves , wash them with Soap and Water as if I'm washing my Hands again and sanitize with Iodophor .

Hector

YOUR BEER IS NOT INFECTED!

Go take a look at the thread of infected brews. It isn't just an off flavor, you will have visible signs of infection. You just either don't like the way your beer tastes before it's ready or you are producing off flavors in some other way. If you were to actually let the beer finish you might actually like it, so give that a try.

 

[o4_srt]

Just curious, do you live in the middle east, or are you just there temporarily?

 

[hector]

Just curious, do you live in the middle east, or are you just there temporarily?

I was born in the Middle East and I live there .

Hector

 

[Theogard]

your brewing description did not mention any hops addidion.

are you using pre-hopped extract?

If not, the lack of hops could be the reason forf the beer going sour.

 

[hector]

your brewing description did not mention any hops addidion.

are you using pre-hopped extract?

If not, the lack of hops could be the reason forf the beer going sour.

The Extract which I use is not pre-hopped .

I added Hops to my previous batches , but that was wasting the expensive Hops as these batches were contaminated and sour like Vinegar .

The light DME which I use costs 2.20$ per kilogram , BUT the Hop Pellets which I used costs 30$ per Kilogram .

As I said , my current Batch is a Test Batch and I wanted to find out where the Bacteria comes from .

So , I decided not to waste the expensive Hop Pellets .

Hector

 

[hector]

Does age of the Extract have any effect on the Taste of the finished Beer ?!

I mean , does using an old DME lead to an undesirable and sour Beer ?

Hector

 

[Shaneoco1981]

Hector, you do cover the bottles as they are fermenting right? I am thinking that if you aren't covering the bottles with a towel or shirt to block the light, it can skunk the hops. The acids from hops break down in light. That's why they come in brown bottles. Just a thought. I didn't see that in your list of your things you do.

 

[hector]

Hector, you do cover the bottles as they are fermenting right? I am thinking that if you aren't covering the bottles with a towel or shirt to block the light, it can skunk the hops. The acids from hops break down in light. That's why they come in brown bottles. Just a thought. I didn't see that in your list of your things you do.

Sorry , but you have misunderstood the whole Story !

Hector

 

[brewit2it]

You've actually never made a batch yet. You have just tossed all your batches before they were even done with fermentation, let alone conditioning and aging. Now you made a batch with no hops which I assume you are just going to pour out as well.

Maybe you want to try your hand at hard cider. If they have pasturized apple juice without preservatives in your area you can buy a bottle and ferment it right in the bottle it comes in.

 

[Chefencore]

Hector, you do cover the bottles as they are fermenting right? I am thinking that if you aren't covering the bottles with a towel or shirt to block the light, it can skunk the hops. The acids from hops break down in light. That's why they come in brown bottles. Just a thought. I didn't see that in your list of your things you do.

What he means is are you protecting your fermenting beer from light? Light will give your beer off-flavors. Keep them in a closet or covered with a towel or t-shirt.

 

[hector]

You've actually never made a batch yet. You have just tossed all your batches before they were even done with fermentation, let alone conditioning and aging. Now you made a batch with no hops which I assume you are just going to pour out as well.

Maybe you want to try your hand at hard cider. If they have pasturized apple juice without preservatives in your area you can buy a bottle and ferment it right in the bottle it comes in.

Although I think the Bacterial fermentation has taken place in my current

Batch since a few Days ago , I will keep it in the Primary for 2 more Weeks .

Why do you propose to make a hard cider ?

Do you mean that I would test the Yeast in a different condition ?!

There is pasteurized Fruit Juice available to buy . But , they are not concentrated enough and

They taste very watery with very little fruity Aroma .

Hector

 

[Chefencore]

A beer hypochondriac?

 

[hector]

What he means is are you protecting your fermenting beer from light? Light will give your beer off-flavors. Keep them in a closet or covered with a towel or t-shirt.

The Jug is in a big Box made of Styrofoam and filled with cold Water , so that I can

control the ambient Temperature . The Box is capped and the inside of it is always dark .

So , I think there is no issue with the Light .

Hector

 

[hector]

I asked a Question in the post #76 of this thread , but no one seems to have an answer for that !

Hector

 

[Rockape66]

In regards to extract age; yes it can go stale and affect taste. but, if it was unopened extract has a very long shelf life. I don't believe this is your problem. Sour flavors most likely come from lactobacillus or acetobacter. So more likely an infection. Hope you have better luck with future brews.

 

[hector]

In regards to extract age; yes it can go stale and affect taste. but, if it was unopened extract has a very long shelf life. I don't believe this is your problem. Sour flavors most likely come from lactobacillus or acetobacter. So more likely an infection. Hope you have better luck with future brews.

Thanks !

You are the first one ( except me ) in this Thread who talks about "Infection" .

The others who took part in this Discussion don't believe so .

I've found someone in this Forum who has similar Problem ( Sour Beers ) after using old Extract .

The Extract which I used has the expiry date " 20th of April 2010 " .

I will brew another Batch , however , using not expired DME to see the Result .

Hector

 

[jollytim]

No he is not the first to talk about an infection. ArcaneXor mentioned a systemic problem in post #26. That means an infection due to poor sanitation. There was a weak link in your process. Please don't 'cherry pick' your responses based on what you want to hear.

Have you kept any batches? Have you let them condition? That can cure most problems. Also water with high alkalinity (like I have here) can make beer very bitter (and not like hop bitter), could be described as sour, but almost undrinkable. I've had a couple batches taste somewhat of solvent. Regardless of what the literature may claim, it was the water supply. I've switched to bottled water and problem solved.

 

[hector]

Have you kept any batches? Have you let them condition? That can cure most problems. Also water with high alkalinity (like I have here) can make beer very bitter (and not like hop bitter), could be described as sour, but almost undrinkable. I've had a couple batches taste somewhat of solvent. Regardless of what the literature may claim, it was the water supply. I've switched to bottled water and problem solved.

The longest Period I kept a Batch in the Primary was 17 Days and the Beer was very sour and with very low Alcohol .

I mentioned a number of times in this Thread that I use " Deionized Water " which has pH 6.5-7.5 for brewing , as I'm an

Extract brewer ( At least I try to be ) .

You said , you have had a couple Batches ( NOT all ! ) that tasted not so good . I brewed 4 batches using the same

DME and Water and they all tasted sour .

By the way , I've found an interesting Thread written by someone who has a similar Problem ( Having sour Beers after using old Extract ) :

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f37/in...tract-infection-poor-brewing-practice-239105/

Hector

 

[Rockape66]

Hector, if your 'deionized' water has a pH of anything other than 7.0 it's not deionized. You may also want to add some gypsum or burtonizing salts to your water to have enough minerals for healthy yeast.

 

[hector]

Hector, if your 'deionized' water has a pH of anything other than 7.0 it's not deionized. You may also want to add some gypsum or burtonizing salts to your water to have enough minerals for healthy yeast.

I've never seen any Deionized Water which has a fix pH 7.0 , because it depends on

Temperature and the Water absorbs CO2 from the Air .

I think the Extract brings enough Minerals for the Yeast and because of that

Malt Extracts can be brewed by using RO-Water .

Hector