Spice, Herb, or Vegetable Beer Chocolate Oatmeal Porter

[inkman15]

Anyone have rings around the neck of the bottles at the fill line for this recipe? Praying it's not infected. If it is, I'm never brewing with cocoa again.

Same thing happened to me with a chocolate stout - looked kinda weird in the fermenter but everyone said it was just the cocoa fat/oils trapping CO2 bubbles. Had rings in the bottles and they all turned sour/gushers.

I'm afraid that is where this one is heading too. I never get infections when not using cocoa.

 

[Hanso]

Did this recently as well but I kegged mine so i dont know if it gives rings like that. Could depend on a lot of other factors, but I wouldn't suspect the rings are an infection. Almost certainly the cocoa powder is at play here.
For some reason, not blaming the cocoa powder per se, but I did get terrible head retention. Pours like Dr. Pepper and fizzles away the head in a matter of seconds. Could be a process thing or something too.

 

[MrSpaz]

Brewed this this morning without the cocoa and with dry yeast. Smelled great, slight dark chocolate aroma before I pitched yeast. Looking forward to it!

 

[cmschlatt]

I just brewed this today. The smell is fantastic... Don't know if I'll be able to wait for it to age

 

[cmschlatt]

Would cold crashing this before bottling have any negative effects?

 

[kalmah21]

I've been looking something more "sessionable" to replace my breakfast stout as my always on tap dark beer. This recipe sounds like just the ticket. I will be brewing it as written in the OP next weekend.

 

[COEBRA]

Did this recently as well but I kegged mine so i dont know if it gives rings like that. Could depend on a lot of other factors, but I wouldn't suspect the rings are an infection. Almost certainly the cocoa powder is at play here.
For some reason, not blaming the cocoa powder per se, but I did get terrible head retention. Pours like Dr. Pepper and fizzles away the head in a matter of seconds. Could be a process thing or something too.

Mine does this exact thing. Super carbed and the heed disappears in a minute or two. Decent flavor though. I might try this one again sometime with a few changes.

 

[bolus14]

If both of you bottles and its super carbed, how much priming sugar did you use? As long as things were well cleaned and sanitized the rings at the top shouldn't turn sour, I have had a couple other beers leave rings and had no issues with being over carved or going bad. How long did you let it ferment before bottling, may have just needed more time for the cocoa to settle, or you racked some of it into your bottling bucket.

As for head retention I would think adding some roasted barley would be a good way to fix that.

 

[COEBRA]

I used 4.6 oz for 5 gallons in the bottling bucket. 4 week ferment at 65 for 2 weeks and 67 for the last two. Conditioned for another 3 weeks. All the bottles are super carbed but it doesn't stay in the solution (beer) long. I don't have any rings and its not sour or infected. It tastes fine. I've been mixing it 50/50 with a blueberry wheat I brewed and its good. I've just never had a brew carb weird like this one. I'll be moving to kegs really soon do I'm not to concerned about it.

 

[bolus14]

If you used table sugar that would be about 2.6 vol which is higher than most porters. I would try to stick closer to 2, although some go up to 2.5 so its not as if you're extremely high.

Unless you got some wild yeast that's just taking its time to show itself in taste or smell I can't think of anything else.

 

[COEBRA]

I used dextrose. I cracked another one tonight and the head retention is actually pretty good. Laces well too but it foams like crazy while pouring. It's a good beer, I'll just probably wait to brew it again until I'm kegging.

 

[Atomook]

Did this recently as well but I kegged mine so i dont know if it gives rings like that. Could depend on a lot of other factors, but I wouldn't suspect the rings are an infection. Almost certainly the cocoa powder is at play here.
For some reason, not blaming the cocoa powder per se, but I did get terrible head retention. Pours like Dr. Pepper and fizzles away the head in a matter of seconds. Could be a process thing or something too.

Yeah, I had the same exact experience. Rings in the bottles, gushers, and zero head retention. Never seen anything like it. No taste of infection, but something was definitely amiss. I'm going to blame the cocoa I used and have since changed. Still, I'm sadly hesitant to use cocoa again. Looked like a killer recipe too

 

[COEBRA]

Yeah, I had the same exact experience. Rings in the bottles, gushers, and zero head retention. Never seen anything like it. No taste of infection, but something was definitely amiss. I'm going to blame the cocoa I used and have since changed. Still, I'm sadly hesitant to use cocoa again. Looked like a killer recipe too

I don't think it's the cocoa. I use ALL ORGANIC cocoa from a health food store when I make chocolate beers and usually have no issues. This recipe might just need some mash temp adjustments and a little less priming sugar at bottling to make it just right. The taste is really good and makes a great "mixer" porter. The head retention is better than my stouts. I didn't have any gushers or rings but they were way over carbed. I've just learned to pour them slow lol.

 

[Hanso]

I agree, it very well could not be the cocoa... in my experience it was the first time I'd seen the problem, and it coincided with the same time I used cocoa. So definitely not a causal relationship here.

It could very well have been a problem of having too hard of water combined with high acidity from the dark malts and cocoa. I definitely did not properly treat my water... My cocoa powder was not super fresh either. Lots of things I could point the finger at besides simply the overall idea of using cocoa powder itself.

 

[shortyz]

man that was some sticky mash, had to sparge the living hell out of that! dam oats.

i used 1 oz of nibs in the boil and imma drop another oz in the secondary after soaking in some bourbon.

i will report back.

 

[Herman558]

The original recipe list 9 pounds of pale malt, maris otter as grain 2. Am I missing what grain 1 is? Also when I add the grain together I don't get 13.5lbs. This will be my first all grain and I want to make sure I am seeing this correctly.

 

[MrSpaz]

There are 6 different grains to add up to the 13.5

 

[Herman558]

I have looked this over numerous times and I keep getting 12lbs 13oz.

9lbs pale
1lbs 8oz oats
12oz caramel 80
11oz chocolate
8oz pale chocolate
6oz black

Not sure what I am missing/calculating incorrectly.

 

[Herman558]

I have looked this over numerous times and I keep getting 12lbs 13oz.

9lbs pale
1lbs 8oz oats
12oz caramel 80
11oz chocolate
8oz pale chocolate
6oz black

Not sure what I am missing/calculating incorrectly.

I found my answer buried in the post at some point, the missing oz are of rice hulls. Do people that have made this recipe use rice hulls in their mash or are they not necessary?

Also I was wondering about the strike water and sparge water amounts.

If you use the 1.5qt/lb of grain for mash you come to 19.97qt (just under 5 gal), not the 18.64qt (4.66 gal) that the OR calls for. Is that because you want it to be a thicker mash? Also the sparge amount is throwing me off, what amounts are others using?

 

[Herman558]

I brewed this on Sunday, it's bubbling away right now, but seems a little odd. Very little krausen on top, maybe half inch, with rather small bubbles. Vigorous fermentation going on below though. Almost seems like the cocoa is sitting on top in the krausen. This is my first all grain, everything seemed to go fine. I was nervous about the cocoa though. Has an odd layer on the bottom of the ferment or too. Does this all look normal?View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1426601934.624528.jpgView attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1426601949.998514.jpg

 

[BroStefan]

I brewed this on Sunday, it's bubbling away right now, but seems a little odd. Very little krausen on top, maybe half inch, with rather small bubbles. Vigorous fermentation going on below though. Almost seems like the cocoa is sitting on top in the krausen. This is my first all grain, everything seemed to go fine. I was nervous about the cocoa though. Has an odd layer on the bottom of the ferment or too. Does this all look normal?View attachment 264357View attachment 264358

It looks perfectly normal for a fermentation with cocoa. The is enough fat to disrupt the surface tension. It will take a while to clear. Your patience will be rewarded.

 

[shortyz]

did 2 weeks in primary (1oz cocoa nibs at end of boil), 2 in primary (1oz nibs soaked in spiced rhum). didnt have vanilla bean so i added it when i kegged it (vodka soak method). Carbing it up now and i had to try it before its fully carbed, and holy **** billy thats a nice brew.

Brewed using extract and its dam fine, only thing i might change is the partial mash and opting out with a cereal mash. The oats made the partial mash a pain the ass, SPARGE.

hopefull this helps any partial-extract guys in the future.

 

[ethanhostetler]

The cocoa should sit on top of the krausen it's very powdery and light. Once fermentation settles down it should settle out. It looks good!!!! I bet it smells fantastic!!

 

[Herman558]

After a week and three days in the fermenter I am still getting a bubble out of the airlock about once a minute. Still deciding whether I should drop the vanilla bean (soaked in vodka) in the primary, or rack it into a secondary on top of the vanilla beans at two weeks. I've heard the secondary is unnecessary and just another opportunity for oxygen to get in the beer and infection to set in. Any thoughts?

 

[BumpyAZ]

Anyone have trouble bottle conditioning this recipe? I upped the cocoa a touch and added PB2 in the secondary. After a month in the bottle, it's essentially still flat. There's a few rising bubbles after pouring into the glass but it only lasts for a few seconds. Not sure if this is an effect from the cocoa or possibly PB2? Could the fats in either prevent proper carbonation? Or maybe the PB2 in secondary caused the yeast to drop out?

 

[shortyz]

Anyone have trouble bottle conditioning this recipe? I upped the cocoa a touch and added PB2 in the secondary. After a month in the bottle, it's essentially still flat. There's a few rising bubbles after pouring into the glass but it only lasts for a few seconds. Not sure if this is an effect from the cocoa or possibly PB2? Could the fats in either prevent proper carbonation? Or maybe the PB2 in secondary caused the yeast to drop out?

oils shouldnt effect carbonation, just head retention. are the bottles 70f+?

on another note, if anyone is extract brewing this, make sure u mash your oatmeal with like 2 pounds of 2 row to get it to convert. do not put it in your steeping grains!

 

[phoney]

..

 

[paguy]

Just read the whole thread and it sounds delicious! Going to brew ASAP.

 

[shortyz]

brewed it again and the head disapears quite quickly... hmmm.

 

[Herman558]

Some of mine hold head well, and others fizz like a soda, seems odd, from the same batch too.

 

[COEBRA]

Some of mine hold head well, and others fizz like a soda, seems odd, from the same batch too.

The soda issue has been observed in this thread before. All of mine came out way over carbed when I bottled them. It's the weirdest thing...

 

[OkanaganMike]

brewed it again and the head disapears quite quickly... hmmm.

Me too. Did half as per recipe, halfway through bottling, I added some strong cold brewed coffee. (I really like it with the coffee!) I have great carbonation, but the head foams like a soda then quickly disappears. I used Cocoa powder, could this have anything to do with it? Both coffee and regular version act the same and none of my other beer does this. Cocoa powder seems to be the main factor and I'm suspecting it as the culprit.

Any ideas?

 

[shortyz]

I used nibs...

 

[OkanaganMike]

I'll try harder to find them and try them next time. One of them fruity organic free range hippy health places probably have them

 

[Herman558]

I believe the cocoa powder is to blame, I observed a lot of things as my beer was progressing. This was my first all grain effort as well. I wish I had made just a normal porter rather than dealing with the cocoa powder and vanilla, but it is all part of the learning curve I suppose. I wonder how this recipe would be as is, just without the vanilla and cocoa powder.

 

[OkanaganMike]

I never used vanilla, I'm sure it would still be good without the cocoa Especially if you add some strong cold brewed coffee at bottling time.

 

[daggers_nz]

I believe the cocoa powder is to blame, I observed a lot of things as my beer was progressing. This was my first all grain effort as well. I wish I had made just a normal porter rather than dealing with the cocoa powder and vanilla, but it is all part of the learning curve I suppose. I wonder how this recipe would be as is, just without the vanilla and cocoa powder.

a good lesson in keeping this simple when you're first starting out

 

[BlackIce]

Brewing this right now. Changed the ingredients some. LHBS didn't have the right yeast
10 lbs Pale Malt, Maris Otter (3.0 SRM)
2 lbs Munich Malt (9.0 SRM)
1 lbs 12.8 oz Oats, Flaked (1.0 SRM)
1 lbs Black (Patent) Malt (500.0 SRM)
1 lbs Caramel/Crystal Malt - 80L (80.0 SRM)
1 lbs Chocolate Malt (350.0 SRM)
0.75 oz Northern Brewer [8.50 %] - Boil 60.0 min
1.00 oz Willamette [5.50 %] - Boil 20.0 min
1.00 Items Yeast Nutrient (Boil 15.0 mins)
1.0 pkg Danstar Windsor Ale Dry Yeast (Danstar #
2.00 Items Vanilla Bean (Secondary 10.0 days)

Just finished up

 

[BumpyAZ]

oils shouldnt effect carbonation, just head retention. are the bottles 70f+?

on another note, if anyone is extract brewing this, make sure u mash your oatmeal with like 2 pounds of 2 row to get it to convert. do not put it in your steeping grains!

After a few more weeks, it carbed up nicely. Guess it just needed more time,I thought 4 weeks would have been plenty but it wasn't. Retention was still pretty poor though.

Gonna be brewing this again in a few days but without the PB2 this time. However I stopped by my LHBS today to pick up grain and when I got home I noticed the receipt had double the amount of chocolate malt that I asked for (which I had already increased to nearly 16 ounces for 5.5 gallons based on the OP's updated recipe on another forum). Anyone think this will have a real negative effect on the final product if the amount was actually doubled?

 

[BumpyAZ]

I'm a little confused on what the krausen looks like on this, I've seen reference to the shiny dark brown/black surface with good size bubbles in the thread but I kind of get the feeling that that is referring to when the vanilla is added. Is that right? Both of my attempts at this have ended up with a similar appearance during primary fermentation without the vanilla bean, never showing any signs of a traditional krausen (the second batch has been fermenting for 4 days now). I was thinking it might be due to the cocoa which I increased to 3 oz/5gal. Wondering if anyone else has had similar experience? The first batch was actually a split batch with half getting PB2; that half formed a thick, fluffy, beige krausen. The other half actually became infected with a slight sour tang (think it was due to an issue during transfer) so I'm worrying that the appearance is due to infection again.