Central NJ - Learn how to All Grain

[Bobby_M]

My setup is still a work in progess, I technically have all the converted kegs to do a single tier system but I don't have the stand built just yet. We'll probably be rocking the old cooler MLT setup for this day. It's probably better that way anyway because it sounds like you guys will use coolers as well.

 

[Soulive]

My setup is still a work in progess, I technically have all the converted kegs to do a single tier system but I don't have the stand built just yet. We'll probably be rocking the old cooler MLT setup for this day. It's probably better that way anyway because it sounds like you guys will use coolers as well.

Yeah I use an Igloo 5gallon. Do I need to bring it that day?

 

[Bobby_M]

If we're doing 12 gallons, we'll use mine. If we want to do 18 gallons for a nice 3-way split, we can mash it all at the same time so sure, bring it if by Wednesday it sounds like it's the 3 of us. If we get 4, we'll have to use mine for two 10-gallon batches unless someone decides to be a spectator only.

 

[janzik]

I got the approval, I'm in. Sorry to ruin your 3 way

Since I'm still new to all of this, I'm not sure what I can bring that will help. I have a couple of carboys, besides my basic equipment. I'd like to help out in any way I can. Thanks...

Also, will need directions... 287 North?

 

[Bobby_M]

No man, glad to have you. We'll run two back to back 10 gallon batches. We also have the option of a completely different recipe for two shares.

In order to speed up the batch transition, we'll use one burner/kettle for hot water and the other for wort boiling. I've never done it before so it'll be new to me too.

Executive decision, 8:30am start. Someone bring me a bagel, I'll have the coffee.

 

[njnear76]

I can cover getting the bagels. Let me know what kind you want and how many. Once you get the ingredient list, try to figure out how much we owe you. I don't want to be a hump.

 

[Soulive]

I just got back from Bobby's place. It looks like we'll have all the equipment and possibly all ingredients covered. With 4 people we can brew 20 gallons and split it into our carboys nicely. I'll take an untoasted plain bagel with butter

 

[Orfy]

Sounds like fun.

 

[njnear76]

Sounds like fun.

Yeah. I am looking forward to it. It will be a good opportunity to meet some brewers and learn all grain.

 

[janzik]

Yeah, should be cool. My Father(JoeJaz) wants to come along as well, but no need to adjust the recipe amount, we'll split up mine or whatever.

 

[Bobby_M]

No problem. Is everyone cool with an ESB? If anyone wants something else, I can be flexible with which share I take.

 

[njnear76]

No problem. Is everyone cool with an ESB? If anyone wants something else, I can be flexible with which share I take.

ESB works for me.

 

[janzik]

No problem. Is everyone cool with an ESB? If anyone wants something else, I can be flexible with which share I take.

I'm cool with whatever. I don't have any experience with any ESBs, but I've been meaning to brew one, so this will be good.

 

[Soulive]

No problem. Is everyone cool with an ESB? If anyone wants something else, I can be flexible with which share I take.

I'm fine with 20 gallons of ESB or 10 ESB and 10 something else. It doesn't matter to me, but I do think the light hopping/less amount of grain for ESB's will be good for this occasion

 

[Bobby_M]

Yeah I agree. I'm taking ingredient inventory right now.

 

[Soulive]

Yeah I agree. I'm taking ingredient inventory right now.

I have available for Sunday:

2oz Northern Brewer
2oz Wilamette
1oz First Gold
30+lbs of Maris Otter

IMO, any of the hops will work for an ESB. I'd love to see some Vienna in the recipe as well...

 

[Soulive]

We should probably agree on the recipe(s) for Sunday. Anyone wanna post their suggestion?

 

[Bobby_M]

Still trying to figure if all those different grains are appropriate or not. If we like the recipe, I have all the ingredients besides the Willamette and NB hops you mentioned. We can use your MO or mine.

[size=+2]CNJ AG Seminar ESB[/size]
[size=+1]8-C Extra Special/Strong Bitter (English Pale Ale)[/size]

Size: 11.00 gal
Efficiency: 91.83%
Attenuation: 74.6%
Calories: 179.19 per 12.0 fl oz

Original Gravity: 1.054 (1.048 - 1.060)
|===============#================|
Terminal Gravity: 1.014 (1.010 - 1.016)
|=================#==============|
Color: 13.9 (6.0 - 18.0)
|==================#=============|
Alcohol: 5.26% (4.6% - 6.2%)
|==============#=================|
Bitterness: 36.14 (30.0 - 50.0)
|============#===================|

[size=+1]Ingredients:[/size]
15 lbs Maris Otter Pale
2 lbs Vienna Malt
0.5 lbs Victory® Malt
0.25 lbs 2-Row Caramel Malt 80L
.25 lbs Chocolate Malt
0.25 lbs 2-Row Caramel Malt 40L
1 oz Northern Brewer (8.0%) - added during boil, boiled 60 min
1 oz Tettnanger (4.5%) - added during boil, boiled 60 min
1 oz Tettnanger (4.5%) - added during boil, boiled 40 min
1 oz Willamette (5.0%) - added during boil, boiled 10 min

S-04 or Nottingham, I have both.

00:30:25 Mash In - Target: 153 °F[/i]

It might be cool to swap out the Willamette for EKG for the second batch just to later compare (if everyone agrees to get back together for tasting).

 

[Soulive]

Still trying to figure if all those different grains are appropriate or not. If we like the recipe, I have all the ingredients besides the Willamette and NB hops you mentioned. We can use your MO or mine.

[size=+2]CNJ AG Seminar ESB[/size]
[size=+1]8-C Extra Special/Strong Bitter (English Pale Ale)[/size]

Size: 11.00 gal
Efficiency: 91.83%
Attenuation: 74.6%
Calories: 179.19 per 12.0 fl oz

Original Gravity: 1.054 (1.048 - 1.060)
|===============#================|
Terminal Gravity: 1.014 (1.010 - 1.016)
|=================#==============|
Color: 13.9 (6.0 - 18.0)
|==================#=============|
Alcohol: 5.26% (4.6% - 6.2%)
|==============#=================|
Bitterness: 36.14 (30.0 - 50.0)
|============#===================|

[size=+1]Ingredients:[/size]
15 lbs Maris Otter Pale
2 lbs Vienna Malt
0.5 lbs Victory® Malt
0.25 lbs 2-Row Caramel Malt 80L
.25 lbs Chocolate Malt
0.25 lbs 2-Row Caramel Malt 40L
1 oz Northern Brewer (8.0%) - added during boil, boiled 60 min
1 oz Tettnanger (4.5%) - added during boil, boiled 60 min
1 oz Tettnanger (4.5%) - added during boil, boiled 40 min
1 oz Willamette (5.0%) - added during boil, boiled 10 min

S-04 or Nottingham, I have both.

00:30:25 Mash In - Target: 153 °F[/i]

Looks good. Do you think we should mash that low though?

 

[Bobby_M]

Maybe 154-155 but I wouldn't go too much further than that.

A guy in my homebrewclub just took a 1st place at Splitrock with an ESB and it was such a simple recipe:

14lbs MO
1lb crystal40l
.5 carapils

EKG throughout (way low IBU to style though at only 16 IBU) Weird.

 

[Soulive]

We can probably lose the Victory malt. Personally I don't mind not using EKGs. I need a break from them...

 

[njnear76]

Looks good. Do you think we should mash that low though?

From my understanding the mash temperature is a proponent for how dry or sweet the wort will be. I think on the lower side of 150F-170F range, it's a bit sweeter and on the higher side dryer. I think I read that in the Palmer book. That being said, I think I messed up my last extract + steeping grains winter porter recipe by doing it straight down 160F. Doh!

In some senses it's probably better to air on the lower side. Otherwise you risk extracting tannins.

 

[Soulive]

From my understanding the mash temperature is a proponent for how dry or sweet the wort will be. I think on the lower side of 150F-170F range, it's a bit sweeter and on the higher side dryer. I think I read that in the Palmer book. That being said, I think I messed up my last extract + steeping grains winter porter recipe by doing it straight down 160F. Doh!

You're right on the first part but it goes - lower mash temps mean drier beers and higher mash temp mean maltier beers. Mashing low means more fermentables for the yeast to devour. Mashing high means more unfermentables that the yeast don't consume...

 

[njnear76]

You're right on the first part but it goes - lower mash temps mean drier beers and higher mash temp mean maltier beers. Mashing low means more fermentables for the yeast to devour. Mashing high means more unfermentables that the yeast don't consume...

Hmmm... that makes more sense.

 

[Bobby_M]

It gets a little tricky because mash temps aren't the only variable in the equation. You have specialty grains that are dextrinous which don't care about mash temps and then you also have yeast strains that attenuate more or less. Just as a for instance you might make two beers that finish out at about the same FG; one mashed at 150F and fermented with Windsor and the other mashed at 155F and fermented with S-04/Nottingham. This is just an example and not exact.

Most of the guys in my club mentioned using 154 for their ESBs. It's probably a good rule of thumb given the relatively low percentage of caramel malts in this bill. We def want enough malt backbone for the 30+ IBU.

Anyone use Victory in English beers? I thought it was a common use.

 

[Soulive]

It gets a little tricky because mash temps aren't the only variable in the equation. You have specialty grains that are dextrinous which don't care about mash temps and then you also have yeast strains that attenuate more or less. Just as a for instance you might make two beers that finish out at about the same FG; one mashed at 150F and fermented with Windsor and the other mashed at 155F and fermented with S-04/Nottingham. This is just an example and not exact.

Most of the guys in my club mentioned using 154 for their ESBs. It's probably a good rule of thumb given the relatively low percentage of caramel malts in this bill. We def want enough malt backbone for the 30+ IBU.

Anyone use Victory in English beers? I thought it was a common use.

I've always used 154F as my middle ground for mashing. I'd go down for Saisons and up for English ales for example. I've used Victory in an IPA before. I think the Vienna will cover it up and dominate...

 

[Bobby_M]

Final recipe and schedule:

[size=+2]CNJ AG Seminar ESB[/size]
[size=+1]8-C Extra Special/Strong Bitter (English Pale Ale)[/size]

Size: 11.0 gal
Efficiency: 88%
Attenuation: 74.6%
Calories: 176.92 per 12.0 fl oz

Original Gravity: 1.053 (1.048 - 1.060)
|==============#=================|
Terminal Gravity: 1.014 (1.010 - 1.016)
|=================#==============|
Color: 13.6 (6.0 - 18.0)
|==================#=============|
Alcohol: 5.2% (4.6% - 6.2%)
|=============#==================|
Bitterness: 36.14 (30.0 - 50.0)
|============#===================|

[size=+1]Ingredients:[/size]
16 lbs Maris Otter Pale
2 lbs Vienna Malt
0.25 lbs 2-Row Caramel Malt 80L
.25 lbs Chocolate Malt
0.25 lbs 2-Row Caramel Malt 40L
1 oz Northern Brewer (8.0%) - added during boil, boiled 60 min
1 oz Tettnanger (4.5%) - added during boil, boiled 60 min
1 oz Tettnanger (4.5%) - added during boil, boiled 40 min
1 oz Willamette (5.0%) - added during boil, boiled 10 min
2 ea Fermentis S-04 Safale S-04
2 ea Lallemand Nottingham

[size=+1]Schedule:[/size]
Ambient Air: 70.0 °F
Source Water: 60.0 °F
Elevation: 0.0 m

00:30:27 Mash In - Liquor: 5.5 gal; Strike: 167.7 °F; Target: 154 °F
01:30:27 Sac Rest - Rest: 60 min; Final: 154.0 °F
01:40:27 Batch Sparge - First Runnings: 0.0 gal sparge @ 152 °F, 3.11 gal collected, 0.0 min; Batch 1: 4.5 gal sparge @ 180 °F, 4.5 gal collected, 5 min; Batch 2: 4.5 gal sparge @ 180 °F, 4.5 gal collected, 5 min; Total Runoff: 12.42 gal

[size=+1]Notes:[/size]
Either of the 10 gallon batches will use two packs of Nottingham or S-04.


Soulive, (what the hell is your real name dude? I don't think you ever told me),
Don't forget to bring clean carboys/buckets to take your share home.

 

[Soulive]

Haha, my name's Ben. I thought I might have put it in a PM at some point

I'd prefer to use my MO for half the batch. I won't be getting more in until next week earliest, so I dont wanna exhaust my supply. I'll also throw in my Northern Brewers & Willamettes...

 

[Bobby_M]

Ok Ben (thanks) so it will break down like this:

We'll use 16lbs of your MO and 4oz hops (NB and Will). I figure that's about $25 worth of stuff. I'll be kicking in 16lbs MO, 6lbs specialty, 4oz hops, and 4 packs dry yeast for a total of about $35 (I was estimating a bit low on my last post). So, $60 divided by 4 is $15 each.

njnear76 and janzik can just each throw in their $15, you take $10 and I'll $20. I hope that's fair, my math skills suck.

 

[janzik]

Wow, I'm really the noob in this bunch. I'm Joe, btw...

I'm most likely going to bring up a few home brews I've done, so you guys can critique (or hopefully celebrate my extract brewing prowess ) (this is based on what is left after Thanksgiving and a Saturday night dinner party)

Is there any equipment I should bring up? (carboy or whatever)