Can we dispel the myth of the 'CO2 Blanket' ?

[day_trippr]

This thread is full of irony

 

[fluketamer]

No you don't smell the CO2, but in contact with the moisture in your sinuses and airways, CO2 forms carbonic acid which will cause a burning sensation if you breath in air with high concentrations of CO2.

Brew on

i effing love that burn.

 

[MaxStout]

This thread is full of irony

Yup. Sort of like the Streisand effect. The more someone posts to change something, the more attention it draws.

 

[Whisky River]

Idk which will do more to dispel the myth, Doug’s link to an actual demonstration of science showing the relevant principles at work, or OP’s reminder that this is basically fluid dynamics, which makes it pretty easy to imagine standing in a swimming pool 4 feet away from a 10 year old kid who faces you and makes the I’m peeing right now face. Would any of us really believe that the increased density of the cool water surrounding you would create a “protective blanket” in that situation?

 

[worlddivides]

Whatever people are smelling in chest freezers or fermenters isn't CO2, which is odourless. I'm not suggesting there isn't CO2 in there as well.

Being odorless does not mean it will not burn your nostrils.

https://www.brewersassociation.org/brewing-industry-updates/co2-hazards/

CO2 is a colorless, odorless gas produced during beer fermentation and also used in dispensing systems. CO2 displaces oxygen in enclosed areas and when it accumulates it can lead to dizziness, loss of consciousness, and death. Although CO2 causes a burning, acrid sensation in the nasal passages, this symptom should not be used as a means of detecting the gas. You should only rely on a calibrated gas monitor.

 

[mashdar]

I'm working on a fermenter with about 0.000003 solar masses. The CO2 blanket will work great. I'm still working of thermal regulation, and buying enough grain will be difficult.

 

[James_AZ]

UGG me always thought convection mixing due to heat transfer. Like pouring cold cream into hot coffee, ugggg, stirs itself.

me thinks mixing of air in cold freezer or cold fermenter by opening more mechanical, not so much by temp? seems more mechanical from lifting of lid and changing pressure.

but i’d guess the stirring comes more from creating low and high pressure than temperature when movin the lid on the fermenter


beer logic

 

[Hoochin'Fool]

I'm working on a fermenter with about 0.000003 solar masses. The CO2 blanket will work great. I'm still working of thermal regulation, and buying enough grain will be difficult.

 

[Broothru]

Nooo, duvets are warmer, and diffusion happens quicker at higher temperatures, a CO2 Duvet would vanish much faster than a CO2 blanket would!

Can we at least discuss the differences between a CO2 Duvet and a CO2 Bedspread?

Please, set foreign cultural issues aside. This is an international forum, after all.

 

[Zadkiel]

Can we at least discuss the differences between a CO2 Duvet and a CO2 Bedspread?

Please, set foreign cultural issues aside. This is an international forum, after all.

Just listing your ingredients isn't enough for me to judge the possible issues, I need to know more about your process for a full assessment. thread count? tucked corners? bedpan to deal with any leaks? Significant Other to handle any blowoff tube needs?

 

[Broothru]

Just listing your ingredients isn't enough for me to judge the possible issues, I need to know more about your process for a full assessment. thread count? tucked corners? bedpan to deal with any leaks? Significant Other to handle any blowoff tube needs?

. That’s what I’m talkin’ about! Accuracy.

 

[ScrewyBrewer]

And what you've done is enough. You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink beer.

Whatever people are smelling in chest freezers or fermenters isn't CO2, which is odourless. I'm not suggesting there isn't CO2 in there as well.

Correct odorless, but the burning sensation of CO2 when breathing it in is unmistakable.

 

[MaxStout]

Correct odorless, but the burning sensation of CO2 when breathing it in is unmistakable.

Once I leaned into my chest freezer ferm chamber to draw a sample from the Brew Bucket inside. I forgot to hold my breath. Burn, baby, burn.

 

[quantumguy]

Whenever this conversation comes up, I always wish that someone would just do an experiment with an oxygen sensor stuck in the headspace above the wort and monitor its change in real time as a lid is removed and such. I think convection can be relatively minor, but Doug's point is key - it doesn't take much O2 ingress to make an effect.

 

[PCABrewing]

No you don't smell the CO2, but in contact with the moisture in your sinuses and airways, CO2 forms carbonic acid which will cause a burning sensation if you breath in air with high concentrations of CO2.

Brew on

Yeah but if you continue to breathe it eventually it stops burning

 

[doug293cz]

Yeah but if you continue to breathe it eventually it stops burning

Somehow, I don't think you have confirmed this hypothesis experimentally.

Brew on

 

[Pennine]

So based on this thread I think I have learned if I can open the fermenter and toss the dry hops in and get the lid back on in less than 1 second I am ok, right?

 

[doug293cz]

So based on this thread I think I have learned if I can open the fermenter and toss the dry hops in and get the lid back on in less than 1 second I am ok, right?

Maybe, maybe not. But, getting it done in 1 sec would be damn near impossible.

Brew on

 

[Beekeeper]

So based on this thread I think I have learned if I can open the fermenter and toss the dry hops in and get the lid back on in less than 1 second I am ok, right?

Yeah, that was my take on it as well. Glad we all learned a lot.

 

[mac_1103]

I think I have learned if I can open the fermenter and toss the dry hops in and get the lid back on in less than 1 second I am ok, right?

getting it done in 1 sec would be damn near impossible

Hire The Flash to do your dry hopping. Hell, he'd probably do it for beer.

 

[doug293cz]

UGG me always thought convection mixing due to heat transfer. Like pouring cold cream into hot coffee, ugggg, stirs itself.

me thinks mixing of air in cold freezer or cold fermenter by opening more mechanical, not so much by temp? seems more mechanical from lifting of lid and changing pressure.

but i’d guess the stirring comes more from creating low and high pressure than temperature when movin the lid on the fermenter


beer logic

Yes, to be rigorous, convection is transport driven by density differentials, often due to thermal gradients. The more correct term for mass movement due to mechanical disturbance, wind, etc. is "advection." ref But, in casual use, convection is often used for both.

Brew on

 

[Zadkiel]

So based on this thread I think I have learned if I can open the fermenter and toss the dry hops in and get the lid back on in less than 1 second I am ok, right?

If only the act of pushing the lid back on wasn't also acting to push more O2 inside. If you can mod your $20 plastic bucket to replace the lid with Star Trek style sliding doors, and get it down to about a quarter of a second, then maybe, maybe.

 

[MaxStout]

If only the act of pushing the lid back on wasn't also acting to push more O2 inside. If you can mod your $20 plastic bucket to replace the lid with Star Trek style sliding doors, and get it down to about a quarter of a second, then maybe, maybe.

Make a really tiny airlock. Place hops inside, close outer door, pump the air out. Open inside door, let hops drop in.

 

[Zadkiel]

Make a really tiny airlock. Place hops inside, close outer door, pump the air out. Open inside door, let hops drop in.

you had to go and ruin a perfectly good absurdism joke with reality

 

[MaxStout]

you had to go and ruin a perfectly good absurdism joke with reality

Who said I was being realistic?