Buying equipment to get started

[TTBHG]

My friends and I want to start brewing our own beer. We really want to take some time to hone our skills but eventually the goal is to open a small scale brewery maybe three to five years from now.

With that goal in mind, what equipment would you recommend? I don’t want to buy ultra starter stuff that will have to be replaced in a year. Would you guys offer up some opinions on the best direction to go for this situation?

 

[DocScott]

Sure. Buy a starter kit with a fermenting bucket, bottling bucket, autosiphon, bottle capper, hydrometer, and other little odds and ends. Buy an extract or partial mash kit of a beer style you like. Buy (or use one you own if you have one) a 5-10gallon pot. Make a batch or two with this and see if you enjoy the process. Make some mistakes and learn on little financial investment.

I still use my first autosiphon and brew pot now, 10 years later. I’ve had to replace other things but you’ll get plenty of use out of the starter kit and can upgrade when you know you actually like to brew and you’ll know what you want to upgrade to.

 

[IslandLizard]

How to Brew.
It's a bit dated, but the basic processes are still the same. There's a modern, 4th edition available in book form, with updated processes, recipes, and techniques.

Also check out the various stickies on our forums, and read, read, read.

 

[Kirkwooder]

How to Brew.
It's a bit dated, but the basic processes are still the same. There's a modern, 4th edition available in book form, with updated processes, recipes, and techniques.

Also check out the various stickies on our forums, and read, read, read.

Totally agree, although Charlie's "The Complete Joy of Home Brewing" would be my choice for first books.

Then the 1 gallon extract kits from Northern Brewer or the like in the style you are fond of. You likely have all the necessary equipment to make a good small batch.

 

[Bilsch]

My attitude is if your intention is to be a commercial brewer eventually there is no sense learning and then trying to unlearn homebrew dogma.. Just skip straight to the technical, but always correct information.

https://www.vlb-berlin.org/en/publications/specialist-publications/kunze

 

[madscientist451]

1. Get a Mr. Beer kit, brew some 2 gallon extract batches, then add some grains and have fun with it.
2. Get a brew pot and a BIAB bag and a carboy and brew larger batches on your kitchen stove.
3. Get a chest freezer and a temperature controller for fermentation.
4. Get kegs and another chest freezer to use as a kegerator.
5. Get a bigger brew rig and more kegs and see if you can make a consistently good beer.
6. Brew as much as you can and get as much experience as you can.

 

[mongoose33]

Take a look at this kit:

https://www.morebeer.com/products/premium-home-brewing-kit.html

It has everything you need to get started except for bottles and a heat source. It even includes an extract kit. It has a kettle, chiller, thermometer, Star-San for sanitizing, bottling bucket, fermenter (the good Fermonster w/ a spigot), and all for under $240. They even ship free, and if you deduct the value of the extract kit (about $30 or so), you're talking about $210 to get going.

 

[IslandLizard]

My attitude is if your intention is to be a commercial brewer eventually there is no sense learning and then trying to unlearn homebrew dogma.. Just skip straight to the technical, but always correct information.

https://www.vlb-berlin.org/en/publications/specialist-publications/kunze

That's a good one!

 

[BongoYodeler]

I would recommend going in a slightly different direction. Yes, read How to Brew by John Palmer, but then read this thread. Pick up an inexpensive 4 gallon kettle (I got a nice stainless steel, no name brand at Ross, (a Big Lots type store) for $25. Without much of an additional investment you can be brewing one or two gallon all grain batches. Smaller batches means you can brew way more often. Learn as you go without the fear of ruining a 5 gallon batch. If you find brewing is not for you sell the gear and move on. If you find it is for you then you can always invest in a 5, 10, even 15 or 20 gallon setup, and still keep your 1 or 2 gallon setup for experimental batches, using some of the same gear. Personally I brew 5-6 gallon batches as well as 1.25 gallon batches. Each have their own advantages.

 

[Staticsouls]

I would put together a pilot brew system. One that could do 5 or 10 gallon batches. Electric brewery eherms imo.

Outside of that read and study like you mean it, and always keep learning more to better your brewing.

 

[Velnerj]

I'm certainly no expert but... If the plan is to go pro I'd drift in the direction of automated brewing. I'm not a pro brewer but I imagine all their set ups are automated. Look into a grainfather if budget isn't an issue you can look at automated systems from a place like high gravity brewing (dot com).

If you just want to dip your toe into brewing and budget is a concern I'd try to contact a local homebrew club. See if you can meet with them and perhaps someone can walk you through their brew day. You'll learn a lot and it'll give a good idea of what you're getting yourselves into, Plus it's free.

 

[Carolina_Matt]

You mentioned that you don't want to buy starter stuff that will be replaced in a year. With that in mind, I don't think it makes any sense to get a 4-5 gallon kettle.

May as well shoot for 10 gallons, if not more. That's enough to do a full 5 gallon BIAB. Buy a Wilser bag and a burner, with a bottling bucket to ferment in, and you're most of the way there.

If you prefer electric and have access to a 220/240V outlet, then get a 3500W induction plate instead of a burner, or get an all-in-one system like the Robobrew or Digiboil.

 

[mongoose33]

My friends and I want to start brewing our own beer. We really want to take some time to hone our skills but eventually the goal is to open a small scale brewery maybe three to five years from now.

With that goal in mind, what equipment would you recommend? I don’t want to buy ultra starter stuff that will have to be replaced in a year. Would you guys offer up some opinions on the best direction to go for this situation?

I've been thinking about this.....you all think you want to open your own brewery, but I'll guarantee you that you're looking at this through rose-colored glasses.

Most brewers would probably agree that the most important facet of brewing is not recipe, temperature control, packaging, fermenter geometry, or a host of other things that appear important, but not as important as....

....cleaning and sanitizing.

If you don't like cleaning--a lot, and by that I mean you're going to be doing a lot of it in a brewery--then this won't be as fun as you, in your mind's eye, believe it's going to be.

If your equipment isn't properly cleaned and sanitized, you risk infection and ruined beer. You learn these things in a homebrew context.

*********

If I were you--and I'm a lot closer to doing this commercially than you are--I'd just focus on the home brewing for now. Familiarize yourself with the process. Learn the various pieces. Discover that there are multiple ways to do a lot of things in brewing, such as mashing (BIAB? Mash Tun? Recirculating Mash Tun?), packaging (kegs? cans? bottles?), heat source (propane? Nat gas? Electric? Stove?), fermentation temp control (jacketed fermenter? immersion coil? refrigerator? swamp cooler?), and you need to be passing familiar with them to even have the vocabulary to discuss them in a homebrew setting to say nothing of a commercial setting.

I admire your goals; I'd suggest you focus for now on brewing good beer at the homebrew level, and when you have accomplished that, then decide if and how you want to proceed. Don't complicate this with issues of a commercial brewery. Home brewing is not rocket science; it's simple, but not simplistic, and just mastering those moving parts takes time. Heck, just mastering the vocabulary takes time: pitch, hydrometer, refractometer, sparge, RIMS, HERMS, hop spider, ball valve, butterfly valve.....

I've been thinking of doing the brewery thing; I have friends who want to buy my beer at commercial prices, and a local bar owner that wants me to be exclusive brewer for the establishment. But man--it is a long road, and even though I think of myself as a somewhat accomplished home brewer judging by others responses to my beer, the gulf between that and doing it commercially is very large. I may not be able to bridge it.

My 2 cents. Get going on that first brew!

 

[IslandLizard]

I'm with @mongoose33 ^

I sincerely believe a new aspiring brewer should get started with a few simple kitchen brews to get an idea what brewing beer entails and if it's for them. Many don't have a clue what's involved, especially the time and patience it takes.

We've all met many people who said they wanted to brew. Only few attend a brew session, and more than half of those never take it on. Even when they've tasted a bunch of stellar homebrews. These are wet finger weather predictions of course.

The most common excuses I've heard are 'too complex' and 'too time consuming.'

 

[kh54s10]

I also would go with a beginner brewing kit from an online retailer. All of the major ones have one. You probably have or can get a pot cheaper than the ones in some of the kits. A 5 gallon pot is fine for starting and great for cooking. ~$20 at a grocery store or Wally World. Very little of the equipment will not be used once you progress, at least until you go pro.

Start with them, see if you enjoy the process. Read, read, read. Progress and see if you still enjoy the process.

Then when you know what is involved you can ask the questions of yourself about going professional.

Will you still enjoy brewing when it becomes a job rather than a hobby?
Will you enjoy spending the majority of your time cleaning and sanitizing things?
Are you up to the red tape of getting started in a brewery?
Do you have the capital to start?
Are you willing to risk the capital?
Plan on it taking a lot longer and costing more than you think to get started.

I have read statements from homebrewers that went professional that they no longer homebrew because the hobby became a job and they no longer enjoy home brewing at least in addition to the job.

 

[IslandLizard]

Plan on it taking a lot longer and costing more than you think to get started.

Ain't that the truth!
Most (smaller) craft breweries, especially startups, rely on taproom sales and kegs distributed to craft bars. Only very few package for retail distribution/sales. So location and marketing are an important part of that venture too, not just brewing excellent beer. And that adds to the startup bill.

I have read statements from homebrewers that went professional that they no longer homebrew because the hobby became a job and they no longer enjoy home brewing at least in addition to the job.

So true.
But many do like brewing small exclusive batches on their pilot systems. Some of those make it to their main production line.

Now if you and your friends have a great idea, a craft beer niche to fill, a solid business plan and some money to put at risk, you don't need to brew yourself. You can recruit a pro craft brewer to do that for you. You're suddenly 5-10 years ahead.

 

[TTBHG]

I appreciate all of the replys. I’ve already downloaded a few of the books to read on some work flights I have coming up next week.

I have a fairly good idea on what’s involved on the commercial side. I’m a QA Director for a major food processor so I’m pretty well versed in cleaning and sanitation and all of the things that go into making a food-grade product.

After more discussions, I think we're going to start very small scale with one of the kits and just start doing it. If we're still doing it six months or a year from now; I’ll reevaluate our equipment. I appreciate the help!

 

[CodeSection]

I appreciate all of the replys. I’ve already downloaded a few of the books to read on some work flights I have coming up next week.

I have a fairly good idea on what’s involved on the commercial side. I’m a QA Director for a major food processor so I’m pretty well versed in cleaning and sanitation and all of the things that go into making a food-grade product.

After more discussions, I think we're going to start very small scale with one of the kits and just start doing it. If we're still doing it six months or a year from now; I’ll reevaluate our equipment. I appreciate the help!

You have been given very good advice and it sounds like you will be starting with some form of a kit. As mentioned above, you will learn so much over the next few months.

With that said, the only thing I would add is if/when you are ready to go commercial, I would suggest you identify a successful commercial brewer to contact before starting your brewery. Ideally, it would not be in your local area.

I would then contact that brewer and ask if you could work for them free for at least an entire week to learn all aspects of their business. If you have partners, I would encourage them to do the same. Not only would you work in all areas (cleaning, recipe design, brewing, serving, etc.) of the business, but you would like to learn about their brewery footprint, brewing equipment, computer systems, inventory control system, accounting and payroll systems, etc.

Probably the most beneficial information you would receive from the commercial brewer would be what mistakes they had made and how they corrected those mistakes. I believe their advice will be better than what you could read in a book!

I suspect any successful commercial brewer would gladly share what they have learned as long as it was not to someone local or fairly local or to someone in an area where they may expand some day.

Good luck!

 

[dwhite60]

... on the sanitation thing, cleaning is paramount.

Commercially it used to be, and may still be, you paid federal and state tax on what you BREWED
not what you SOLD. If you have to dump five barrels down the drain you still have to pay the
tax man.

Start small. Get a five gallon kit and start making some beer. Until you try it you don't really know if it's
for you. Also, there are space requirements, power, water, propane if you go that route, storage of product and equipment. Lot's of stuff to work out before going bigger. I think I'd avoid the gallon thing. Temp control seems to be an issue mashing small amounts of grain in small pots. But, first couple brews it might work well for you until you get a five gallon kit.

If you want to get into racing you don't just go and buy a Formula One car.

All the Best,
D. White

 

[Druman07]

I appreciate all of the replys. I’ve already downloaded a few of the books to read on some work flights I have coming up next week.

I have a fairly good idea on what’s involved on the commercial side. I’m a QA Director for a major food processor so I’m pretty well versed in cleaning and sanitation and all of the things that go into making a food-grade product.

After more discussions, I think we're going to start very small scale with one of the kits and just start doing it. If we're still doing it six months or a year from now; I’ll reevaluate our equipment. I appreciate the help!

You'll probably be doing it a year from now. The good thing is that with a group, each can contribute some $ and make a decent setup.

 

[Jtk78]

I know it probably wasn't your intention, and you did mention a 3-5 year timeline. But I always read these post and feel like it's disrespectful to those that have opened a brewery. You've brewed as many beers as bridges I've built. Zero. But your just going to go open a brewery without knowing about beer or the business end of things. It comes across like you're minimizing the amount of time, work and knowledge they put in every week now, let alone all of it it took for them to get to a point to open their door. I know how to run a compound mitre saw, a carpenter I am not. Again, I'm sure I'm taking it different than you were trying to put out there, but I've seen that sentiment posted by others and I've also worked in a brewery.

That said, here's my suggestion. Read and study. Buy a 10 to 15 gallon kettle, a propane burner and brew, often. Read more. Upgrade your processes. Brew more. Repeat. Get friendly with 1-3 breweries in your area and volunteer to help clean kegs. Ask them for feedback on the beer you're brewing. Read more. Up grade your processes. Brew more. Enter your beer in many competitions. Take feedback and read more. Upgrade your processes. Brew more. Join a local homebrew club. Ask them for feedback. Read more. Upgrade your processes. Brew more.

The above could be done in a year if you're really committed to it. At that point you should have a decent understanding of the BJCP guidelines, your system, recipe design, malt selection, water chemistry, mash conversion, hop selection, hop timing effects, proper hop storage, yeast health, yeast handeling, propagation, fermentation, preventing oxygen ingress, detecting and identifying off flavors, reasons for off flavors, ways to prevent off flavors, etc, etc, etc.

This forum is a very welcoming source to help hone in your knowledge. This shouldn't be your only source, but certainly on your list of sources.

 

[IslandLizard]

Buy a 10 to 15 gallon kettle, a propane burner and brew, often.

I agree with what you said before.
But before buying the 10-15 gallon setup right away, if the OP wants to check out what homebrewing is, he would be better off doing a few 'kitchen stove' extract recipes first. Preferably recipes with steeped grains.

 

[Jtk78]

I agree with what you said before.
But before buying the 10-15 gallon setup right away, if the OP wants to check out what homebrewing is, he would be better off doing a few 'kitchen stove' extract recipes first. Preferably recipes with steeped grains.

I wouldn't disagree with this. The reason for my suggestion was in the grand scheme of things a budget 10-15g pot and burner could be had relatively cheap, especially if purchased used and would allow for full volume BIAB batches (Not that I even BIAB). Also, if OP decided they didn't want to pursue the hobby, it at least contains some resale value. To your point though, a 4-5 gallon stock pot could be had for next to nothing, and the pot could be used for soup, stew, or lobster boils. Now I'm hungry.

 

[mongoose33]

I know it probably wasn't your intention, and you did mention a 3-5 year timeline. But I always read these post and feel like it's disrespectful to those that have opened a brewery. You've brewed as many beers as bridges I've built. Zero. But your just going to go open a brewery without knowing about beer or the business end of things. It comes across like you're minimizing the amount of time, work and knowledge they put in every week now, let alone all of it it took for them to get to a point to open their door. I know how to run a compound mitre saw, a carpenter I am not. Again, I'm sure I'm taking it different than you were trying to put out there, but I've seen that sentiment posted by others and I've also worked in a brewery.

That said, here's my suggestion. Read and study. Buy a 10 to 15 gallon kettle, a propane burner and brew, often. Read more. Upgrade your processes. Brew more. Repeat. Get friendly with 1-3 breweries in your area and volunteer to help clean kegs. Ask them for feedback on the beer you're brewing. Read more. Up grade your processes. Brew more. Enter your beer in many competitions. Take feedback and read more. Upgrade your processes. Brew more. Join a local homebrew club. Ask them for feedback. Read more. Upgrade your processes. Brew more.

The above could be done in a year if your really committed to it. At that point you should have a decent understanding of the BJCP guidelines, your system, recipe design, malt selection, water chemistry, mash conversion, hop selection, hop timing effects, proper hop storage, yeast health, yeast handeling, propagation, fermentation, preventing oxygen ingress, detecting and identifying off flavors, reasons for off flavors, ways to prevent off flavors, etc, etc, etc.

This forum is a very welcoming source to help hone in your knowledge. This shouldn't be your only source, but certainly on your list of sources.

As an extension....how fast can one learn to be a good/great homebrewer--to say nothing of the jump to commercial?

Of course, the answer is it depends, on a lot of stuff. @Jtk78 points out a lot of what is needed, and had he been able to write more, I'm sure he would have.

*******

So what can accelerate the learning process? I think he's right, it could theoretically be done in a year, but everything would have to align for that to happen. And it would cost money, and require a lot of repetition.

Here's one question: how many brews would one have to do in order to move from newbie to journeyman/woman, from that to accomplished, from that to expert?

Would 20 brews be enough to become "expert"? I can't imaging anyone here who is experienced would agree with that.

*******

Can you compress the timeline to learn about brewing, e.g., learning vicariously from others (on HBT, youtube, other web sources, books, magazines, etc.)? In other words, accelerate the process?

Sure. I did. I've done it in other areas. I reload ammunition, in my 12th year doing that. But I like to think of myself as having more than 20 years of experience because of what I read and view and see and experiment with. I've compressed 20+ years of learning about reloading into less than 10 years (actually, haven't learned a lot over the last two years, I just keep doing it). I cast my own bullets, I powdercoat them, I experimented a lot. I'm on the bleeding edge there.

So can you compress learning about brewing? Why not? The question is how, and that probably differs for different people. I'm a voracious learner, and if I see information about brewing that's contradictory, I have to resolve it and find out why. It's my nature, might not be others' natures.

So, as JTK says above, homebrew groups, competitions, talk to breweries, etc. etc. They are all ways. I gave up personally on competitions being a source of brewing knowledge after seeing the inconsistency in them, so I rely on other sources of feedback. But it might be a decent initial place to get feedback.

Also read, read, read. Maybe Youtube videos, though the veracity of the information there is sometimes in question.

*******

I just checked my brewing notebook. I have 71 brews behind me, the first three extract, ever since then all-grain. Is that enough?

Enough for what? Is it equivalent to those who have hundreds of brews? No.....and yes. I focus on certain kinds of beer. I don't do sours. Don't do Stouts. I don't particularly care for Belgians, so I've never brewed one. I'm not a big Saison fan, so they're out. I do malty beers, some lagers, some IPAs.

Is it equivalent to, say, @Yooper 's experience? No. Not even close. But the difference is a subtle one. I haven't used every kind of yeast there is, or even more than (thinking).....maybe 10 different yeasts? How many different ones has Yooper used? I'm sure much, much more than I. And I'm sure she's brewed far more recipes than me, maybe by a factor of 10 or 20 or or more.

So she could say what the effect of this yeast would be, or that particular adjunct or weird grain, whereas I don't have that. But that's exactly the kind of thing you can learn online, and thus you don't have to brew every recipe ever to have facility in brewing.

IMO, here's the thing: could I brew a Stout or a Belgian and have it turn out great? I believe I could, honestly. I believe most of brewing is about process, not recipe (yeah, recipe is important, but IMO not as important as process). It's just not that hard to get the mash temp right, get the water right, add ingredients in the boil as per recipe, get the right yeast, ferment that yeast at the right temps, etc. That's all process.

Give me a good recipe and I'll brew good beer, maybe even great beer. Because my process is excellent, and I've spent the past 71 brews learning to nail that down as best I can. I've had my fits and starts--there were hiccups when I went from extract to all-grain. Hiccups when I started using BIAB. Hiccups when I started to do LODO brewing. And hiccups when I went to electric brewing using a RIMS system.

But give me a recipe, and I believe my process will do it justice. So, to me, the learning about brewing is primarily about process. Process, process, process. Recipes are easy; process is harder.

********

I've got about 25 brewing books (worst I've read: "Brew like a pro."). I'm a pretty avid reader and contributor to HBT. I resolve contradictions. I'm going to the BYO brewing boot camp in Asheville in 2 weeks. I'm participating in an off-flavor workshop here the week after boot camp.

If you're as motivated as I am, you can learn fast. But I'm going to amend my statement above: I don't think you can do it in a year unless you devote full-time attention to it, and that must include the resources to buy equipment to up the game. And as to the cost of that equipment: $5k minimum. And you'd better brew a lot, as IMO there's no substitute for doing it.

Why? Because you don't get immediate feedback. Three weeks at minimum, for lagers maybe an extended lagering period. You just can't compress all of it into a short time frame.

Can you do it in a year? It's not the way to bet, and I'd bet against it.

 

[IslandLizard]

I wouldn't disagree with this. The reason for my suggestion was in the grand scheme of things a budget 10-15g pot and burner could be had relatively cheap, especially if purchased used and would allow for full volume BIAB batches (Not that I even BIAB). Also, if OP decided they didn't want to pursue the hobby, it at least contains some resale value. To your point though, a 4-5 gallon stock pot could be had for next to nothing, and the pot could be used for soup, stew, or lobster boils. Now I'm hungry.

@mongoose33 beat me to it. An excellent analysis of what it takes...

It all hinges on experience, knowledge, and mastering of all processes involved.

Bravo!

 

[Jtk78]

As an extension....how fast can one learn to be a good/great homebrewer--to say nothing of the jump to commercial?

Of course, the answer is it depends, on a lot of stuff. @Jtk78 points out a lot of what is needed, and had he been able to write more, I'm sure he would have.

*******

So what can accelerate the learning process? I think he's right, it could theoretically be done in a year, but everything would have to align for that to happen. And it would cost money, and require a lot of repetition.

Here's one question: how many brews would one have to do in order to move from newbie to journeyman/woman, from that to accomplished, from that to expert?

Would 20 brews be enough to become "expert"? I can't imaging anyone here who is experienced would agree with that.

*******

Can you compress the timeline to learn about brewing, e.g., learning vicariously from others (on HBT, youtube, other web sources, books, magazines, etc.)? In other words, accelerate the process?

Sure. I did. I've done it in other areas. I reload ammunition, in my 12th year doing that. But I like to think of myself as having more than 20 years of experience because of what I read and view and see and experiment with. I've compressed 20+ years of learning about reloading into less than 10 years (actually, haven't learned a lot over the last two years, I just keep doing it). I cast my own bullets, I powdercoat them, I experimented a lot. I'm on the bleeding edge there.

So can you compress learning about brewing? Why not? The question is how, and that probably differs for different people. I'm a voracious learner, and if I see information about brewing that's contradictory, I have to resolve it and find out why. It's my nature, might not be others' natures.

So, as JTK says above, homebrew groups, competitions, talk to breweries, etc. etc. They are all ways. I gave up personally on competitions being a source of brewing knowledge after seeing the inconsistency in them, so I rely on other sources of feedback. But it might be a decent initial place to get feedback.

Also read, read, read. Maybe Youtube videos, though the veracity of the information there is sometimes in question.

*******

I just checked my brewing notebook. I have 71 brews behind me, the first three extract, ever since then all-grain. Is that enough?

Enough for what? Is it equivalent to those who have hundreds of brews? No.....and yes. I focus on certain kinds of beer. I don't do sours. Don't do Stouts. I don't particularly care for Belgians, so I've never brewed one. I'm not a big Saison fan, so they're out. I do malty beers, some lagers, some IPAs.

Is it equivalent to, say, @Yooper 's experience? No. Not even close. But the difference is a subtle one. I haven't used every kind of yeast there is, or even more than (thinking).....maybe 10 different yeasts? How many different ones has Yooper used? I'm sure much, much more than I. And I'm sure she's brewed far more recipes than me, maybe by a factor of 10 or 20 or or more.

So she could say what the effect of this yeast would be, or that particular adjunct or weird grain, whereas I don't have that. But that's exactly the kind of thing you can learn online, and thus you don't have to brew every recipe ever to have facility in brewing.

IMO, here's the thing: could I brew a Stout or a Belgian and have it turn out great? I believe I could, honestly. I believe most of brewing is about process, not recipe (yeah, recipe is important, but IMO not as important as process). It's just not that hard to get the mash temp right, get the water right, add ingredients in the boil as per recipe, get the right yeast, ferment that yeast at the right temps, etc. That's all process.

Give me a good recipe and I'll brew good beer, maybe even great beer. Because my process is excellent, and I've spent the past 71 brews learning to nail that down as best I can. I've had my fits and starts--there were hiccups when I went from extract to all-grain. Hiccups when I started using BIAB. Hiccups when I started to do LODO brewing. And hiccups when I went to electric brewing using a RIMS system.

But give me a recipe, and I believe my process will do it justice. So, to me, the learning about brewing is primarily about process. Process, process, process. Recipes are easy; process is harder.

********

I've got about 25 brewing books (worst I've read: "Brew like a pro."). I'm a pretty avid reader and contributor to HBT. I resolve contradictions. I'm going to the BYO brewing boot camp in Asheville in 2 weeks. I'm participating in an off-flavor workshop here the week after boot camp.

If you're as motivated as I am, you can learn fast. But I'm going to amend my statement above: I don't think you can do it in a year unless you devote full-time attention to it, and that must include the resources to buy equipment to up the game. And as to the cost of that equipment: $5k minimum. And you'd better brew a lot, as IMO there's no substitute for doing it.

Why? Because you don't get immediate feedback. Three weeks at minimum, for lagers maybe an extended lagering period. You just can't compress all of it into a short time frame.

Can you do it in a year? It's not the way to bet, and I'd bet against it.

A great expansion to the points I was making (and I post from my phone, so yes, at some point I stop adding).

What I meant in my 1 year comment was that one could be aware of those examples and have some understanding of them. Jack of all trades, master of none if you will.

A different way of wording what you wrote is I don't believe the quantity of batches is a good measure of experience at all. If person A brews 100 batches, but have not improved their knowledge or process since their 10th batch, and person B brews 50 batches, but is constantly expanding knowledge base, challenging themselve, perfecting batches, and improving their process, they will have more "experience" in my mind. Most likely, person B has half the time over the kettle, but twice the total time investing in the craft. That's the acceleration you were referring to.

At the end of the day, making beer is not hard. Making great beer is not hard. Consistently making great beer takes a fair amount of knowledge. Making many different styles of repeatable, predictable beer using a variety of ingredients and processes takes a lot more time and effort when you're not brewing.


I've done some reloading too, though haven't done any casting. Fun stuff.

 

[mongoose33]

A great expansion to the points I was making (and I post from my phone, so yes, at some point I stop adding).

What I meant in my 1 year comment was that one could be aware of those examples and have some understanding of them. Jack of all trades, master of none if you will.

A different way of wording what you wrote is I don't believe the quantity of batches is a good measure of experience at all. If person A brews 100 batches, but have not improved their knowledge or process since their 10th batch, and person B brews 50 batches, but is constantly expanding knowledge base, challenging themselve, perfecting batches, and improving their process, they will have more "experience" in my mind. Most likely, person B has half the time over the kettle, but twice the total time investing in the craft. That's the acceleration you were referring to.

Couldn't agree more. I see people in my LHBC who are content to just keep making extract kits from the LHBS. Sometimes they turn out fine, sometimes not so much.

I originally joined my LHBC as a source from which I could learn. Two meetings in--and this was within the first about 5 months of brewing--I realized I knew more than most of the attendees did. In fact, I learned very little.

A shocking number of those brewers do not, as near as I can tell, do anything with the internet as a learning source. One guy had been doing fly sparging for years; he heard about me doing batch sparging, wondered what it was all about. Now, I believe he does that. But there didn't seem to be much expansion of the knowledge base.

 

[brewcat]

If the main goal is a brewery you are better off focusing on the business. Who is going to do what? Find an assistant brewer that is ready to be a head brewer.

Homebrew to learn the process. If someone really wants to brew they need to get in the industry. Take a Siebel course. Work for a brewery in the production.

You have zero experience brewing!

Do you want to be a brewer or own a brewery?

 

[VirginiaHops1]

Just buy a cheap starter kit and get going. I wouldn't so much worry about upgrading later and regretting spending the money since the kit is only going to cost you like $100. I started with the cheap 5 gallon extract kit with buckets. I moved to 2.5-3 gallon all-grain BIAB batches and could've still done it on all that gear, but bought a few small Better Bottle carboys just for the smaller footprint in my ferm chamber. I've since begun fermenting in 5 gallon corny kegs which is awesome. And I still use most of my original gear for various tasks so it's not really going to waste.

Realistically none of you probably will be advanced enough to be the head brewer of your future brewery in 3-5 years just from dabbling in homebrewing, so you're hiring a head brewer. Just have fun with it. If your goal is to progress as quickly as possible small batches are great too.