Building a well optioned Keezer...questions

[Nitrousbird]

I am planning to build a Keezer that allows me to do a variety of things with it and have some questions.

I will be buying a black freezer that will hold at least four 1/6 Barrel or Corny kegs.

I haven't made beer yet (planning to start doing that soon), but we make a lot of wine. I want to keg wine as well.

My plan is to do a 4 beer tap, 2 wine tap collared Keezer. I will run CO2 for the beer and Argon for the wine. I want the setup to where I can do one wine in the Keezer if I want, and another wine keg outside the Keezer for room-temp stuff.

I also want the flexibility to make sparkling wine using the CO2 side when needed.

Questions:
- Should I go with 1/4" or 5/16" line for the CO2 and Argon systems? What are the pro's and con's of each

- For the wine faucets am I better off going with the plastic faucets specifically made for wine/cider or is the all stainless steel faucets a good option? Oddly enough the all SS are cheaper too.

- For the beer faucets, is the cheapie chrome deals good enough or should I stick with the higher end models?

- Since I intend to do both Cornys and 1/6 Barrel kegs for beer (depending on whether I am making something or buying something), I need to be able to do both ball lock and Sanke connections. What is the best way to have a setup that allows me to easily do both? At the beginning it will mostly be Sanke kegs until I get into the Home Brewing side of things. If it goes anything like our wine making, we rarely drink commercial wine so I'll likely transition to Cornys for the most part.

- All of the popular sites seem to have everything for home kegging except the temperature control adapter for the Keezer. Any suggestions on that?

- For cleaning, am I best served by just buying an extra Corny keg that I can put some cleaning solution it, hook it up and run to get everything clean. Rinse that keg, fill with water and repeat. Seems like the easiest solution to getting everything nice and clean. Or is there a better way I'm unaware of?

I'm sure I will have more questions once I start putting together a parts list and building it. I will likely do the faucets through the collar, though a top-mount tower has me intrigued a bit, to the point I may consider a hybrid system and do both. Any suggestions you have on any of this would be highly appreciated. My keg experience is my party days with a big ice bucket and a hand pump.

 

[bnairuni87]

Not sure I can answer all of your questions, however I will take a shot at a couple.

1. For cleaning I use a spare keg, however there is a thread where a garden pump sprayer is converted to a cleaner.

2. I used the cheaper SS tap handles, however I am considering switching to a better grade because these are starting to stick.

3. I use a johnson control for temperature control. It's about $80 on Amazon. You plug your freezer into the controller and then into the electrical socket. Very simple.

Good luck

 

[Pratzie]

I am planning to build a Keezer that allows me to do a variety of things with it and have some questions.

I will be buying a black freezer that will hold at least four 1/6 Barrel or Corny kegs.

I haven't made beer yet (planning to start doing that soon), but we make a lot of wine. I want to keg wine as well.

My plan is to do a 4 beer tap, 2 wine tap collared Keezer. I will run CO2 for the beer and Argon for the wine. I want the setup to where I can do one wine in the Keezer if I want, and another wine keg outside the Keezer for room-temp stuff.

I also want the flexibility to make sparkling wine using the CO2 side when needed.

Questions:
- Should I go with 1/4" or 5/16" line for the CO2 and Argon systems? What are the pro's and con's of each

- For the wine faucets am I better off going with the plastic faucets specifically made for wine/cider or is the all stainless steel faucets a good option? Oddly enough the all SS are cheaper too.

- For the beer faucets, is the cheapie chrome deals good enough or should I stick with the higher end models?

- Since I intend to do both Cornys and 1/6 Barrel kegs for beer (depending on whether I am making something or buying something), I need to be able to do both ball lock and Sanke connections. What is the best way to have a setup that allows me to easily do both? At the beginning it will mostly be Sanke kegs until I get into the Home Brewing side of things. If it goes anything like our wine making, we rarely drink commercial wine so I'll likely transition to Cornys for the most part.

- All of the popular sites seem to have everything for home kegging except the temperature control adapter for the Keezer. Any suggestions on that?

- For cleaning, am I best served by just buying an extra Corny keg that I can put some cleaning solution it, hook it up and run to get everything clean. Rinse that keg, fill with water and repeat. Seems like the easiest solution to getting everything nice and clean. Or is there a better way I'm unaware of?

I'm sure I will have more questions once I start putting together a parts list and building it. I will likely do the faucets through the collar, though a top-mount tower has me intrigued a bit, to the point I may consider a hybrid system and do both. Any suggestions you have on any of this would be highly appreciated. My keg experience is my party days with a big ice bucket and a hand pump.

Beer Faucets, yes make the investment to the better stuff now. Ive heard more then a few horror stories about the chrome ones degrading and causing leak issues. if ur using a keezer and it leaks back into the freezer, u'll have a helluva time with cleanup.

Temp control, u can get an STC-1000 and wire it for about 40 bucks total after supplies (trust me they are very easy) or u can look for temp controllers. Johnson is a popular brand.

For the connection, i still like oetiker clamps. They hold very well and it isn't that hard to remove them if u check out a few of the videos on youtube.

As far as cleaning, if u can afford a corny for just cleaning, do it. Otherwise ive seen a few people in the DIY section post some things theyve concocted that aren't very expensive at all.

 

[beaksnbeer]

Line size is not an issue in the short lengths we use .
Go SS on shanks and faucets the asdic levels in wine can leach lead out of the brass.
STC-1000 cheap and easy.
Have you considered an Irish Coffin?

 

[Nitrousbird]

I don't want to do a tower for a couple of reasons, but mainly because I'd like to keep a couple other drinking-type items stored on the lid.

Here is the list of parts I put together (already purchased the STC-1000 temp controller). Let me know if there is anything I am missing or need to change:

Freezer
(2) CO2/Nitrogen Tank Holder
CO2 Tank (5lb), Regulator, Corny Keg, Hose/Fittings
Nitrogen/Argon Tank (5lb), Regulator, Corny Keg, Hose/Fittings
3 way gas manifold - 1/4"
4 way gas manifold - 1/4"
(20) Ear Clamps - 1/4"
(13) Ear Clamps - 3/16"
Ear Clamp Crimper
Beer/Wine Tubing - 3/16" - 30ft
Gas Line Tubing - 1/4" - 20ft
(2) Sanke Coupler
(15) Beer Shank Washer for Sanke Coupler
(10)Beer Shank Nut
(2) 1/4" Tailpiece for Sanke Coupler
(8) 3/16" Tailpiece for Sanke Coupler and Shanks
(6) 4" x 3/16" bore shank - Chrome Brass
Shank Wrench
(6) Stainless Faucets
(6) Handles (Cheapie)
(3) Drip Trays - 2 tap size
Temperature Controller

 

[beaksnbeer]

You may want to add to your beer line most have found that 10+ ft per beer line. Line for the wine can be shorter.

 

[KeystoneHomebrew]

For the wine, your shanks and faucets need to be Stainless Steel. Wine will eat chrome and brass as beaksnbeer said.

Your beer lines should be at least 10ft. I simply coil mine and zip tie them to keep them from getting 20 types of tangled.

Since you plan on doing commercial kegs and homebrew kegs, invest in some of these for the sanke couplers. That way you don't have to cut your lines every time you switch types of kegs.
http://www.keystonehomebrew.com/shop/1-4in-mfl-tailpiece.html

 

[JuanMoore]

- Should I go with 1/4" or 5/16" line for the CO2 and Argon systems? What are the pro's and con's of each

No discernible difference IMO. Just make sure the hose fits snugly on the barbs. I use 1/4" line stretched over 5/16" barbs.

- For the wine faucets am I better off going with the plastic faucets specifically made for wine/cider or is the all stainless steel faucets a good option? Oddly enough the all SS are cheaper too.

I don't know much about serving wine, but I've read that the all stainless work just as well as the plastic, and IMO they look nicer.

- For the beer faucets, is the cheapie chrome deals good enough or should I stick with the higher end models?

Buy forward sealing faucets for the beer. That would narrow things down to Perlick or Ventmatic. Other designs leave a little beer in the end of the faucet, which dries and gets sticky, and before long your faucets are frozen shut. Bars and restaurants pour beer frequently enough that they don't get the dried on gunk problems, but for home use where they're not pouring all day every day, it becomes a hassle real fast. The Perlicks do come in chrome, which are cheaper and will work fine for beer, but won't be as durable, and you probably shouldn't use them for wine.

- Since I intend to do both Cornys and 1/6 Barrel kegs for beer (depending on whether I am making something or buying something), I need to be able to do both ball lock and Sanke connections. What is the best way to have a setup that allows me to easily do both? At the beginning it will mostly be Sanke kegs until I get into the Home Brewing side of things. If it goes anything like our wine making, we rarely drink commercial wine so I'll likely transition to Cornys for the most part.

There are a few options, but my suggestion would be to use all MFL barbs, and get some MFL sankey tailpieces like KeystoneHomebrew mentioned.

- All of the popular sites seem to have everything for home kegging except the temperature control adapter for the Keezer. Any suggestions on that?

Sounds like you've already got that one figured out.

- For cleaning, am I best served by just buying an extra Corny keg that I can put some cleaning solution it, hook it up and run to get everything clean. Rinse that keg, fill with water and repeat. Seems like the easiest solution to getting everything nice and clean. Or is there a better way I'm unaware of?

There are lots of ways to go, but since I only clean my lines/faucets when a keg kicks, I simply clean the empty keg and then use it to run the cleaning solution.

 

[Nitrousbird]

I'm starting my shopping process for the freezer. I'm probably going to go with the Frigidaire 8.8cf LFFC09M5HW (or something very similar), due to it being the size I'm looking for.

My concern is that when I starting playing with the measuring tape, even with an 8" collar height, the taps aren't very tall. I'm 6'3" so I probably notice this stuff more than some.

Is the low tap height an issue? My other concern is my 2 and a half year old playing with the taps. 50/50 chance of whether she will just leave them alone or have a desire to mess with them.

Does everyone find the low taps to be annoying or just something you get used to? I'd still have to build a collar either way since I need to run multiple lines into the freezer and also need a nice place to mount my temp controller.

 

[Nitrousbird]

Another concern; one C02 tank/pressure feeding 4 kegs. Will this be an issue? Or should I run a secondary regulator setup so I can have different pressures for each tank.

 

[Nitrousbird]

I think I will be going with this freezer:
http://www.sears.com/kenmore-8.8-cu...p-04616949000P?prdNo=6&blockNo=6&blockType=G6

Same as the Frigidaire 8.8 listed in the chest freezer size sticky from what I can tell (and from the measurements I took in-store today), but is black instead of white.

Another question - for those of you that keep your CO2 tank outside of the keezer, how are you feeding the line in? Are you just drilling a hole and putting sealant around the hose feeding in, or are you using some kind of feed-through fitting?

 

[JuanMoore]

I'm starting my shopping process for the freezer. I'm probably going to go with the Frigidaire 8.8cf LFFC09M5HW (or something very similar), due to it being the size I'm looking for.

My concern is that when I starting playing with the measuring tape, even with an 8" collar height, the taps aren't very tall. I'm 6'3" so I probably notice this stuff more than some.

Is the low tap height an issue? My other concern is my 2 and a half year old playing with the taps. 50/50 chance of whether she will just leave them alone or have a desire to mess with them.

Does everyone find the low taps to be annoying or just something you get used to? I'd still have to build a collar either way since I need to run multiple lines into the freezer and also need a nice place to mount my temp controller.

I'm your height, my wife is also over 6', and we have two little ones. Those combined with not liking the aesthetics of faucets through the collar led me to build a pass through tower. It does have it's own set of drawbacks though. I have to wheel it away from the wall to open the lid and change kegs, and had to rig up some fans to circulate air through the tower to keep it cold enough.

Another concern; one C02 tank/pressure feeding 4 kegs. Will this be an issue? Or should I run a secondary regulator setup so I can have different pressures for each tank.

Depends on whether you want to have differing carb levels for different beers. I carb everything to ~2.4 vol and make do with one regulator. Choice is yours.

I think I will be going with this freezer:
http://www.sears.com/kenmore-8.8-cu-ft-chest-freezer-1694/p-04616949000P?prdNo=6&blockNo=6&blockType=G6

Same as the Frigidaire 8.8 listed in the chest freezer size sticky from what I can tell (and from the measurements I took in-store today), but is black instead of white.

Another question - for those of you that keep your CO2 tank outside of the keezer, how are you feeding the line in? Are you just drilling a hole and putting sealant around the hose feeding in, or are you using some kind of feed-through fitting?

I drilled a hole through the collar, and then installed rubber grommets on either side to seal it, but still allow me to remove it easily. I switch back and forth between having a 5# tank inside, and a 20# tank on the outside, so being able to remove the gas line and reroute it was important to me. If you'll be leaving it in place, a bead of silicone is probably and easier option.

 

[beaksnbeer]

JM, did you ever polish and seal the copper?

 

[JuanMoore]

JM, did you ever polish and seal the copper?

Not yet. Full time job, going back to school full time, and two kids under three doesn't leave me much time for brewing projects. I did polish it a while back, but then had something come up and didn't get a chance to seal it before it started oxidizing again. I also reshaped the mesquite pieces that secure the tower to the top.