BruControl: Brewery control & automation software

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BrunDog said:
This is a good idea also @GParkins. Since individual pumps can be inexpensive, the manifolds and valves can be eliminated. In fact this is probably a better approach, as you can implement 120VAC fountain style pumps or use 24VDC pumps. For any pump, you need to make sure it is compatible with the fluid and temperature being used. Note that the RV antifreeze mix typically has alcohol in it, which can be corrosive to certain plastics over time.
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I used This propylene glycol at about a 50/50 mix.
 
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I am starting a new build, I am on the fence of full PLC, craftbeerpi and this.
Here are my needs:

Automation from dough in until cast out.
Temp Sensors (8)
3 pumps (ac 120v)
16 electric valves (12v)
Ability to control 4 valves proportionally
Electric elements
Pressure Sensors (3)
DO sensors (3)
pH Sensors (3)
mass flow meter (1)
Preferably manual overrides for everything. But not a deal breaker.

Can this system handle this?


Thanks!
 
Fairly confident BruControl can handle that. A few clarifications:

What type of temp probes (1-wire, RTD, or Thermistor)?

What is the required control signal for the 4 proportional valves?

What is the output signal of the Pressure, DO , and pH sensors? What about the MFM?
 
BrunDog said:
Fairly confident BruControl can handle that. A few clarifications:

What type of temp probes (1-wire, RTD, or Thermistor)?

What is the required control signal for the 4 proportional valves?

What is the output signal of the Pressure, DO , and pH sensors? What about the MFM?
Click to expand...


Currently I have 1 wire so if I could re purpose that would be great.

For the others I can go traditional on those others ( pH, DO, and FLOW) 4-20ma, or this route...https://www.atlas-scientific.com/

For the valves not sure yet...
 
BruControl handles up to 10 1-wire sensors currently, so no problem there.

I use 0-5V proportional input valves and they work great. BC can generate that signal. 4-20mA can be done with some supporting circuitry.

For the pH and other meters... BruControl natively supports analog inputs, though I don’t think this is a great fit for pH given the need for sensitivity. We have integrated the very model for pH you reference, from Atlas Scientific. We haven’t done the DO unit but the communication is the same, so we should be able to support it easily.

BruControl also supports high frequency counters, so if your flow meter provides a square wave output, it will work natively.
 
Easy peasy!

Can you pm me a break down of your pricing structure and a rough estimate of the cost of goods/service?


thanks!
 
BrunDog if you don't mind me asking, what software do you use to make your schematics\drawings. I'm looking for some software that is not to expensive if you have any suggestions, they would be most appreciated. Thanks!
 
Not at all! Check out draw.io. They have both online and downloadable versions. All for the very tolerable cost of zero. It doesn't have the functionality or full libraries of a Visio etc. but I have found it easy enough to use.
 
BrunDog said:
For the pH and other meters... BruControl natively supports analog inputs, though I don’t think this is a great fit for pH given the need for sensitivity. We have integrated the very model for pH you reference, from Atlas Scientific.
Click to expand...

I am currently sourcing components for an upcomig BruControl build (I have ordered some hardware from you BrunDog a couple weeks ago) and I am curious about the options for intergating pH with precision. I understand the MEGA ADC is only 10 bit and we would prefer to use one that is 16 bit for better resolution and/or bring in this type of data via I2C that is already higher resolution. There are also a number of ADC break out boards that have 16 bit ADC and commuicate via I2C. Is there a way to use I2C to bring in high precision sensor info be it from an external board that converts the analog input with a 16 bit ADC or from the device "transmitter" itself like this one https://www.atlas-scientific.com/product_pages/circuits/ezo_ph.html. This would seem to open up a ton of ways to bring in data and more use cases for the software.

I understand the lcd display is using the I2C bus currently.

Greg
 
BrunDog said:
Hi Greg,

No worries. We have already integrated the Atlas Scientific pH and DO sensors to BC via the I2C. We are working on including it in v1.1.
Click to expand...

Oh, well that was easy :)

So procuring a sensor that sends info over to the Adruino via I2C is something the general BruControl pool of users should feel free to consider as an option that could be available in v1.1?
 
Hey BrunDog. Could you shed some light on how the BruControl firmware handles pH temp compensation with that Atlas pH sensor/stamp transmitter? I see the Atlas "stamp" does temp comp but I am not sure how it gets done without a temp sensor input on the board in this setup. I see the commands in the I2C section but is that something that the firmware handles somehow?
 
So if the pH, DO meters, and lcd are using the i2c bus, would that limit potential temperature sensors or is that not the same?

Can I average 2 sensors? Rigth now I have 2 loops in the mash, 1 for heat (HERMS) and one for cool/at temp. I use a sensor on the output of the tun and in the tun to average and chose which loop to use.

Thanks!
 
You will be able to use pH, DO, and the LCD all at the same time. That said, keep in mind that Serial devices are relatively slow. So lots of data communication *may* impact the processing accuracy. You probably would not use an LCD on the brewery anyway. 1-wire sensors are not on the same bus as the above, but note they are relatively slow too because all transmissions occur over, well, one wire!

You can average temp values in a script. But a Hysteresis or PID device can only work off one temp. It has to work this way in order for these devices to work autonomously (i.e. separate from BC).

A potential workaround would be to use the script to modify the target temp of that device so it actually lands in the center of the averages you want.

I suppose we could add the option for these devices to average two temps internally. Let us discuss it, but please understand it wouldn’t be a priority at this time as we are trying to get v1.1 wrapped up.
 
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Just a little heads up to all those planning on using pH and D.O. probes. They can not be stored dry usually. pH probes should be stored in a acidic solutions of about 3.5, which you can buy very cheaply and it's just called pH storage solution. And dissolved oxygen probes just need to remain moist.
 
Yes indeed. You will also often times find pH storage solution called KCl (as in Potassium Chloride) as well, typically 4 M. In a pinch it is OK to storge it pH calibration solution (4 is best) but never store it in RO/DI water or ethanol solutions. If you leave it dry, it will dry out the reference junction and may not be recoverable.
 
BrunDog is it possible for a BruControl script to reference multiple arduinos. Example: In the same script tell a pump connected to arduino:1 to come on and to close valve connected to arduino:2
 
Yes, definitely. The script references device names. Those device names are unique and are associated with their interfaces when set up. So the script is technically agnostic to the devices’ interfaces.

The same applies to devices on a Workspace. You can have devices that are all on different interfaces if you want. As the user, you just work with the relevant device and maybe don’t even care about how the downstream hardware works.
 
So if I'm understanding this correctly you can essentially link multiple interfaces and control BruControl as if it is one interface if one has run out of digital inputs/outputs.PWM's etc..
 
BrunDog said:
Yes, definitely. The script references device names. Those device names are unique and are associated with their interfaces when set up. So the script is technically agnostic to the devices’ interfaces.

The same applies to devices on a Workspace. You can have devices that are all on different interfaces if you want. As the user, you just work with the relevant device and maybe don’t even care about how the downstream hardware works.
Click to expand...
That's great to know. I am still planning a Raspberrypints alternative, and my kreezer is located in an unfinished room, and feeds through the wall into the serving location. And if I can use multiple arduinos it makes the job much simpler, and with arduinos being so cheap and small it makes it ideal. Thanks!
 
Kmo4040 said:
That's great to know. I am still planning a Raspberrypints alternative, and my kreezer is located in an unfinished room, and feeds through the wall into the serving location. And if I can use multiple arduinos it makes the job much simpler, and with arduinos being so cheap and small it makes it ideal. Thanks!
Click to expand...

Cool idea. If you use a Wi-Fi based interface, connectivity becomes very easy. You would just need to power the interface, and it can then power the flowmeter(s), sensors, etc. of the keeper (assuming you stay within its limits etc.).
 
Is it possible to use a button/Variable to open another Workspace?
 
That sounds great! Sorry for all the questions, I'm in the process of building my brew control panel and planning my next projects. That you for your patience.
 
smort said:
The Wemos in the fermenter control box will continue to control pressure and heating if it looses wifi signal and/or connection with the BruControl server.
Click to expand...

Would you mind explaining how, I am very intrigued here, but don’t really understand.
 
Ok I think I’m still missing something, the way I’m picturing it is: wemos communicates temp info or whatever it may be to brucontrol, brucontrol send commands or what have you to wireless relay? But it seems there is direct comm. between the wemos and the wireless relay?
 
The Wemos, or any other supported interface micro-controller for that matter, receives an instruction from BC for each GPIO/port how to behave, and it does that in perpetuity so long as its powered. So in this case, it receives an instruction to read a temperature sensor from BC and then compare that temperature to a target, and if the temp is above/below the target plus/minus the offset, an output turns on or off accordingly. That output can drive a relay or whatever you have it connected to to cycle power (for cooling or heating or whatever). BruControl can continue to communicate with the interface and get temps, status etc., but if it loses communication, it will just keep performing that output control and stop reporting the temps, status, etc.

Make sense?
 
Brundog - great info and a perfect coralation to the other thread regarding documentation wants/needs. I had no idea this is how Bruncontrol and the micro-controller interacted. Thanks
 
BrunDog said:
The Wemos, or any other supported interface micro-controller for that matter, receives an instruction from BC for each GPIO/port how to behave, and it does that in perpetuity so long as its powered. So in this case, it receives an instruction to read a temperature sensor from BC and then compare that temperature to a target, and if the temp is above/below the target plus/minus the offset, an output turns on or off accordingly. That output can drive a relay or whatever you have it connected to to cycle power (for cooling or heating or whatever). BruControl can continue to communicate with the interface and get temps, status etc., but if it loses communication, it will just keep performing that output control and stop reporting the temps, status, etc.

Make sense?
Click to expand...

I feel dumb as a board, but I think I’m see a dim light at the end in this scenario above, the wemos part I get (I think), but the relay is wireless as well and opens and closes the relief valve based on the pressure...scratch that, I didn’t read carefully enough, I think I know where I was getting confused, the heating circuit is wired to the wemos with the pressure sensor, the cooling circuit is on the wireless relay, so heating and pressure relief would continue but cooling circuit would go down?
 
Hi all - I am having trouble sourcing the 30A DP contactors and 25A SSRs for the 30A panel. My preference would be for DIN mount. Does anyone have a source or links to help out since I’ve lost my Google mojo?
 
bdogg171 said:
I feel dumb as a board, but I think I’m see a dim light at the end in this scenario above, the wemos part I get (I think), but the relay is wireless as well and opens and closes the relief valve based on the pressure...scratch that, I didn’t read carefully enough, I think I know where I was getting confused, the heating circuit is wired to the wemos with the pressure sensor, the cooling circuit is on the wireless relay, so heating and pressure relief would continue but cooling circuit would go down?
Click to expand...

Hi. The relay is not wireless - what schematic/device are you looking at? Perhaps you are confusing Wemos D1 with the Belkin Wemo (which we do not control)?

There are boards which have an ESP8266 (processor/wifi) and an integrated relay. We don't support those directly, though the ESP8266 based firmware (Wemos D1 or NodeMCU boards) would likely work on those - but let's not go down that rabbit hole.

The expectation is you select one of the boards we have tested/recommend/have firmware for. You wire that to a relay or relay boards assuming you want to switch high current AC or DC devices. In this case, the Wemos (board) monitors the pressure, then opens the valve when it gets out of a certain range. Make sense?
 
BrunDog said:
Hi. The relay is not wireless - what schematic/device are you looking at? Perhaps you are confusing Wemos D1 with the Belkin Wemo (which we do not control)?

There are boards which have an ESP8266 (processor/wifi) and an integrated relay. We don't support those directly, though the ESP8266 based firmware (Wemos D1 or NodeMCU boards) would likely work on those - but let's not go down that rabbit hole.

The expectation is you select one of the boards we have tested/recommend/have firmware for. You wire that to a relay or relay boards assuming you want to switch high current AC or DC devices. In this case, the Wemos (board) monitors the pressure, then opens the valve when it gets out of a certain range. Make sense?
Click to expand...

Im reading smorts post so I am referring to the electrodragon relay boards (esp8266) that he is using.

smort said:
Hello existing and future BruControl users.


I also use BruControl to control my fermenters. I have made a box on each fermenter with a Wemos D1 mini, pressure sensor, and a relay board inside. The relays control the heating cable under the armacell insulation and the solenoid to bleed off pressure. The temperature probe sits in the thermowell and is wired to the Wemos. In the glycol chiller there are solenoids which are controlled with wireless $5 NodeMCU Electrodragon relay board flashed with BruControl firmware. If the Wemos in the fermenter control box demands cooling the NodeMCU will open the solenoid in the glycol chiller to let cooling water to the cooling coil in the fermenter. A neat and portable solution where the only wiring needed is 240V power to the fermenter.

I have written a script in BruControl which ramps the temperature and fermenting pressure if desired. Normally I ferment at 1 psi and ramp it up to 15 psi at the end of fermentation to carbonate. Its also set up to send email notification if temperature or pressure is out of defined limits. And off course, the vessels also has a pressure safety valve in case of BruControl failure but so far it has not failed. The Wemos in the fermenter control box will continue to control pressure and heating if it looses wifi signal and/or connection with the BruControl server.

m7JI6P.jpg


gEx9yl.jpg


Next step for me would be to add motorised valves. I consider using the Electrodragon DC relay boards for valve control as they would fit well under each kettle and not require additional wiring to the control cabinet. Automation is not that important for me as I enjoy being around when brewing. BruControl has given me the possibility to add safety features like the RIMS tube not firing if low flow or the kettle and HLT elements not firing if low liquid level and when I am leaving the brewing room I can monitor it remote from the laptop or the remote desktop app on my Iphone.
Click to expand...
 
just_looking said:
Hi all - I am having trouble sourcing the 30A DP contactors and 25A SSRs for the 30A panel. My preference would be for DIN mount. Does anyone have a source or links to help out since I’ve lost my Google mojo?
Click to expand...
How exactly have you looked?
Better to search "30a 2 pole contactor" The most common cheap heatink for ssrs found anywhere that sells ssrs are DIN mount they work great with a fan.. The best bang for the buck ssrs Ive found are the "Berme" branded MGR ssrs. These are the same ssrs auberins or ebrew sells too and you can get them there with a different label and better support if you need it but you will pay about 3 times as much with shipping. If you search amazon or ebay for 30amp contactors you will find many, I got mine from a seller called arlene and alice... A 25A din mounted 2 pole contactor was about $5 with shipping and I used 63amp ones for multiple elements (or anthing up to 63amps).. those are $10.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/CT1-2P-63A...470149?hash=item3ac503e5c5:g:-hwAAOSwT6pVn4E9

As far as smaller din mounted pcb board ssrs those are available from many seller on both ebay and amazon as well.
 
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