Brewometer kickstarter thoughts - digital bluetooth hydrometer

[user 204491]

So I reported the results of the tests done by @spittybug to the developers back on Tuesday, and yesterday they got back to me with the response.

I really don't like posting private emails verbatim in public forums; however, bullet point take-aways would be:

- We don't really have time to read home brew forums as we're busy working.
- Thanks for letting us know.
- It's not intended to be used for one-off readings but rather over the course of a fermentation.
- We're doing this for the home brew community and hope it helps people brew better beer.

So basically not acknowledging there could be a problem or even saying they would look into it. This email definitely had a different tone than the other back and forth I'd had with them, so overall a pretty disappointing response.

I did mention to them that looking back at my fermentation tracking it doesn't look like this has always been a problem and may have started about the time they released an update to their app. No response on that either, but maybe this is something that will be silently corrected with an app update.

Based on all of that I wouldn't go as far as saying I want to return mine or anything; however, I probably won't be recommending them so enthusiastically any longer, and I won't be in the market for another one while this problem still exists.

 

[AF1HomeBrew]

I contacted the crew @ Tilt asking if they'd be interested in my BrewOmeter that took on some wort recently. They asked for a photo, which I supplied. They told me that they would ship me a replacement Tilt and I'll send the other one back. Gotta say customer support doesn't get better than that!

Apparently they changed to different gaskets in the newer Tilt models from the BrewOMeter (older model) to supply a better seal.

Thought I'd chime in and let everyone know that my replacement (original BrewOmeter) showed up earlier this week. I have no idea how the crew @ Tilt sent it so quickly, unless one of them was a retired SR-71 pilot (or knows one) that took a "Top Secret" joyride during the Thanksgiving holiday. Amazing customer service.

 

[pepindavid]

Mine has a problem to: battery life seems to be going down every time I change the battery. Yesterday, I put a new battery in while the wort was cooling. My phone was receiving the signal correctly. About one hour later, when I pitched the Tilt in, there was no signal at all. For my previous brew, the battery lasted about 3 weeks. I think I will write to them....

Just a quick update: they are sending me another unit (already in the mail) and I'll send them back my unit. Good customer service!

 

[TorMag]

Just a quick update: they are sending me another unit (already in the mail) and I'll send them back my unit. Good customer service!

Good to know, having the same issue.

 

[augiedoggy]

Im kinda surprised no one has tried to figure out how to write an app for an old android phone to be used this way in a glass jar... I have no shortage of old android smart phones with the tilt sensors in them myself... This along with a $5 external battery pack could theoretically do the job with the right app running on them.... just saying..

 

[BrunDog]

Im kinda surprised no one has tried to figure out how to write an app for an old android phone to be used this way in a glass jar... I have no shortage of old android smart phones with the tilt sensors in them myself... This along with a $5 external battery pack could theoretically do the job with the right app running on them.... just saying..

Here we go... Dude I love your contributions, but you must NOT be serious here!?! The thing is $120, and it works like a champ right out of the box. Even if by some miracle you could get your glass/phone/battery/app rube to work, it wouldn't be worth even 30 minutes of your time to try! Stop the insanity and focus your mind on productive matters. Like inventing the *next* cool brewing toy...

 

[augiedoggy]

Here we go... Dude I love your contributions, but you must NOT be serious here!?! The thing is $120, and it works like a champ right out of the box. Even if by some miracle you could get your glass/phone/battery/app rube to work, it wouldn't be worth even 30 minutes of your time to try! Stop the insanity and focus your mind on productive matters. Like inventing the *next* cool brewing toy...

well I dont make $240 an hour so yeah 30 minutes with some old stuff lying around would be worth my time here but honestly it would take me a lot longer...

I know its tough to put yourself in others shoes but $500 for one of these in each of my conicals is a lot of dough for me to shell out on my income... let alone justify when I see the original prototype was a $12 wii remote in a jar and you know they are likely a lot cheaper now that they are streamlined...

and from all the exchanges and mixed feelings reported here I dont see it working like a champ the same way you do...

 

[Carlscan26]

when I see the original prototype was a $12 wii remote in a jar and you know they are likely a lot cheaper now that they are streamlined...

and from all the exchanges and mixed feelings reported here I dont see it working like a champ the same way you do...

Ok...then build it yourself.

 

[user 204491]

well I dont make $240 an hour so yeah 30 minutes with some old stuff lying around would be worth my time here but honestly it would take me a lot longer...

I know its tough to put yourself in others shoes but $500 for one of these in each of my conicals is a lot of dough for me to shell out on my income... let alone justify when I see the original prototype was a $12 wii remote in a jar and you know they are likely a lot cheaper now that they are streamlined...

and from all the exchanges and mixed feelings reported here I dont see it working like a champ the same way you do...

Where does the $500/each come from?

Yeah, I saw how the prototype was a wii remote in a tennis ball canister, but the LightBlue Bean that they're using now goes for $55. I'm sure they're getting a discount by buying in bulk, but they're a pretty small operation, so I doubt they're buying that many at once. Either way, more than $12 worth of materials in the units.

I do agree thought that saying they "work like a champ" would be a bit of a stretch.

 

[Thorrak]

Where does the $500/each come from?

Yeah, I saw how the prototype was a wii remote in a tennis ball canister, but the LightBlue Bean that they're using now goes for $55. I'm sure they're getting a discount by buying in bulk, but they're a pretty small operation, so I doubt they're buying that many at once. Either way, more than $12 worth of materials in the units.

I do agree thought that saying they "work like a champ" would be a bit of a stretch.

I think they're using the $30 one (unless Punch Through upped the price in the past 2 weeks). That, a $5 battery holder (Amazon price), a $2 battery (same), custom tube/gasket/end caps I'll guess is $10, and a custom clip to tie it all together which I'll peg at $3 to make the math easier. So all in, probably $50 in parts before volume discounts.

Of course, that doesn't account for warranty support, defective products, etc. or the cost to acquire the original patent.

It's a healthy profit margin - but that's just it, it's healthy. Enough to support a small operation producing a custom product targeted at a tiny market. If someone could build a cheaper DIY solution that has decent battery life and consistency then that would be fantastic -- but I don't see that happening soon.

 

[user 204491]

I think they're using the $30 one (unless Punch Through upped the price in the past 2 weeks). That, a $5 battery holder (Amazon price), a $2 battery (same), custom tube/gasket/end caps I'll guess is $10, and a custom clip to tie it all together which I'll peg at $3 to make the math easier. So all in, probably $50 in parts before volume discounts.

Of course, that doesn't account for warranty support, defective products, etc. or the cost to acquire the original patent.

It's a healthy profit margin - but that's just it, it's healthy. Enough to support a small operation producing a custom product targeted at a tiny market. If someone could build a cheaper DIY solution that has decent battery life and consistency then that would be fantastic -- but I don't see that happening soon.

Oh yeah, sorry, I was looking at the wrong one. $30 is the correct price for the one they're using.

 

[BrunDog]

I think they're using the $30 one (unless Punch Through upped the price in the past 2 weeks). That, a $5 battery holder (Amazon price), a $2 battery (same), custom tube/gasket/end caps I'll guess is $10, and a custom clip to tie it all together which I'll peg at $3 to make the math easier. So all in, probably $50 in parts before volume discounts.



Of course, that doesn't account for warranty support, defective products, etc. or the cost to acquire the original patent.



It's a healthy profit margin - but that's just it, it's healthy. Enough to support a small operation producing a custom product targeted at a tiny market. If someone could build a cheaper DIY solution that has decent battery life and consistency then that would be fantastic -- but I don't see that happening soon.

If they are buying $50 and selling for $120 that's not huge margin. I would bet they almost net neutral before drawing any compensation.

 

[augiedoggy]

Where does the $500/each come from?

Yeah, I saw how the prototype was a wii remote in a tennis ball canister, but the LightBlue Bean that they're using now goes for $55. I'm sure they're getting a discount by buying in bulk, but they're a pretty small operation, so I doubt they're buying that many at once. Either way, more than $12 worth of materials in the units.

I do agree thought that saying they "work like a champ" would be a bit of a stretch.

I never said each.. $500 for one for each of my conicals.. 4 total.

 

[jimmayhugh]

If they are buying $50 and selling for $120 that's not huge margin. I would bet they almost net neutral before drawing any compensation.

Not to mention the amortization costs of hardware and software R&D...

 

[sbartelski]

Hello,

My phone that I've been using to post data from TILT to Google Sheets just died (I guess because being old or because being hooked up to charger all the time). Before I start hunting for new old phone from my friends and family, I'd like to know if I'm able to post data to Google Sheets or Brewstat.us with Raspberry Pi 3? I know that I can use Rasp Pi with TILT, but where it can it post the data? Also have to mention that I'm totally noob what comes to Raspberry and coding, so if I choose to go the Rasp Pi way, I need someone to hold my hand and take me through the steps needed to set up Rasp Pi. Help really appreciated! Cheers from Finland!

Antti

There is now a (hack) version of BrewPi that is integrated with the Tilt. Just need to add a BT dongle (or does your Pi3 already have BT?)

 

[thekraken]

Here we go... Dude I love your contributions, but you must NOT be serious here!?! The thing is $120, and it works like a champ right out of the box. Even if by some miracle you could get your glass/phone/battery/app rube to work, it wouldn't be worth even 30 minutes of your time to try! Stop the insanity and focus your mind on productive matters. Like inventing the *next* cool brewing toy...

Sheesh... That's kinda harsh. That's a bit like saying brewing your own beer isn't worth your time.

 

[thekraken]

I performed an experiment today. Using a jar of water and adding sugar to it, I compared my glass hydrometer, the TILT and my cheap Chinese refractometer at progressively higher sugar concentrations. I held the temp constant (OK, maybe +/- 1*) until the last couple of readings when I warmed it up to see the effect. I made sure the sugar was well dissolved and used the same sample for each of the devices. I let TILT equalize and 'tapped' it a couple of times to ensure it had no bubbles on it or that it wasn't touching the sides. Using the hydrometer, I was careful to read it correctly. The refractometer was a cleaner line in the eyepiece than I expected and I really only ever had ~ .1* ambiguity......

Bottom line, the TILT has some kind of divergence over the 1.030 to 1.085 range. We're talking about 15% off at its maximum. Ouch.

This explains the low SG reading I had (a few posts back) with the TILT, but doesn't explain the odd peak unless it temporary corrected itself......
Glitch? I wonder if the TILT guys have any calibration graphs like this? Anyone else ever done this comparison?

I've been out of the loop for a long time but I know when I last was looking into this there was temperature issues as well. As the temperature decreased the reported gravity would decrease as well. Has this issue been evaluated further?

I know I got my meter in a while ago but only recently had a chance to play with it, I dropped it in room temp water and the gravity reported was 1.000. I threw the bucket in the fridge and the gravity reported at 37F was 0.995 (I think), no bueno.

Id like to see a correction chart for both temp and actual gravity, id like to say id get to work on that myself but free time is pretty rare these days with a new toddler.

 

[TorMag]

Anyone else having problems with app resetting itself? Mine keeps resetting to the first brew I ever put in the thing.....

 

[Samarra]

The tilt hydrometer continues to save measurement readings when the smartphones or tablets are not in range? Or is necessary to have a smartphone or a tablet in rage all the time to be able to chart the data?

 

[jimmayhugh]

The tilt hydrometer continues to save measurement readings when the smartphones or tablets are not in range? Or is necessary to have a smartphone or a tablet in rage all the time to be able to chart the data?

The Tilt simply broadcasts data via BLE advertisements. You need another device that receives and stores the data.

 

[TorMag]

I contacted customer service about my 3 week battery life and they have already shipped me out a new tilt and apparently a return envelope so I can send the broken one back. Pretty damn good customer service.

 

[sbartelski]

The tilt hydrometer continues to save measurement readings when the smartphones or tablets are not in range? Or is necessary to have a smartphone or a tablet in rage all the time to be able to chart the data?

To chart the data yes, but it is still useful to be able to go to the fermenter and check the SG without having to open the vessel, sanitize anything, etc.

However, next step (almost there) is top connect to my BrewPi and its website, so I can view the fermentation progress from afar

 

[enkamania]

To chart the data yes, but it is still useful to be able to go to the fermenter and check the SG without having to open the vessel, sanitize anything, etc.

However, next step (almost there) is top connect to my BrewPi and its website, so I can view the fermentation progress from afar

A user has set up a website that I use https://www.brewstat.us so I can check the status anywhere in the world.

 

[tiputus]

There is now a (hack) version of BrewPi that is integrated with the Tilt. Just need to add a BT dongle (or does your Pi3 already have BT?)

Hi,

Haven't visited this thread for a while so just noticed your message! Oh there is? Where I can find "how to's"? At BrewPi forum or somewhere else? Yes, RPi3 has BT built in!
And I can access BrewPi's data remotely?

Cheers

 

[sbartelski]

Hi,

Haven't visited this thread for a while so just noticed your message! Oh there is? Where I can find "how to's"? At BrewPi forum or somewhere else? Yes, RPi3 has BT built in!
And I can access BrewPi's data remotely?

Cheers

First the easy one, access the community (forum) at BrewPi.com. you will see a (long) thread for Tilt/Brewometer integration. It includes most of what you need. Also, when you install SBowler's chnages, there is a readme file that explains more.

Regarding "remote" reading of your Tilt. as Tilt uses BLE, you will need to have your RPi fairy close to your fermenter. I have use SS kegs for fermenting, inside a freezer (i.e lots of metal) and a RPi2. So I have a dongle on the end of an extension cable, inside the freezer. Works for me.

Stefan

 

[SlanginDueces]

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[allanmorgan]

The tilt hydrometer continues to save measurement readings when the smartphones or tablets are not in range?

The smartphone or tablet must always be in range of the hydrometer. I learned that the hard way. To constantly get data, it must also be plugged into a power source. Otherwise the data is sporadic.

 

[BroStefan]

New tilt owner on my first brew. I am very impressed so far, with one weird behavior. All of a sudden last night - about 72 hours into the fermentation - the temperature reported on the Google Sheet jumped from ~68F (which is correct) ~153F (which is not!) The temperature readout on the display of the Tilt app is correct.

I have been watching both the SG and temperature. The SG has been close enough to not needed calibration. I had calibrated the temp by -1.5 F shortly before this behavior.

Is it possible that somehow I changed a formula in the spreadsheet? A few times when i looked at it I'd get into edit mode. When I noticed this I'd back out, but maybe I changed something.

Any thoughts?

 

[Arbe0]

I would love to get a tilt but all I have is a tablet to view the info. The one I have is a Samsun Galaxy Tab 4 8.0, and has blue tooth but not sure if it has the 4.0 Bluetooth. It would be nice if the tilt was wifi ready... or is it?
Also would the Tilt be usable from a ball lock keg in a chest freezer?

next thought...is there a wifi or Bluetooth device for the Mash to keep track of the mash temperature?

 

[doug293cz]

I would love to get a tilt but all I have is a tablet to view the info. The one I have is a Samsun Galaxy Tab 4 8.0, and has blue tooth but not sure if it has the 4.0 Bluetooth. It would be nice if the tilt was wifi ready... or is it?
Also would the Tilt be usable from a ball lock keg in a chest freezer?

next thought...is there a wifi or Bluetooth device for the Mash to keep track of the mash temperature?

According to this review http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2458405,00.asp
the Galaxy Tab 4 8.0 has Bluetooth 4.0 LE.

Brew on