Brewometer kickstarter thoughts - digital bluetooth hydrometer

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@yeastylad: that's waaaay off. Something is s really not right. I don't think calibration should, or will, fix it.

@TaylorBrewed: what network would that be? Home WiFi network? Yeah, no... Needs A Bluetooth network, but they are uncommon.
 
I wish this thing would just connect to a network and upload on its own and by pass the whole need a extra phone or tablet to generate continuous logging.

If it did it would have to be quite a bit bigger to support the battery power needed to connect to a WiFi network over an extended period.
 
They could always make a small wifi connected station that recorded the data and was web enabled for displaying the data, or the app could connect to it for the data. Would open up a lot of doors for them for a more stable connection, and longevity for tracking.
 
Well my replacement, as well as my the additional new, Brewometer that I ordered should both be here today.

I've been logging my data to the web for 8 days with the current one, and so far it has had 6 "freak out" episodes where the temperature gets off by as much as 10 degrees and the gravity swings as much as 6 points. During 3 of these I took actual measurements using a Thermapen and hydrometer, so it's definitely the Brewometer.

Overall I'm still very happy with my purchases. The developers seem really responsive and open to adding new features to the app.

At this point I'd say it seems like we get version 1.0 of the hardware with the beta version of the software, so I'm hopeful of more good things to come.
 
During these "freak out" episodes, have you verified that the Brewometer is not stuck on the side or something like that? I'm not clear on that point yet.
 
Only once. Most of the time when it happens I'm at work or asleep. When I've been around I try to run out and take a gravity and temp symbol. One of those times when I opened the airlock to take a sample I could see it floating below.
 
They could always make a small wifi connected station that recorded the data and was web enabled for displaying the data, or the app could connect to it for the data. Would open up a lot of doors for them for a more stable connection, and longevity for tracking.


Sorry dude, but this makes little to no sense, especially from a business perspective. The device you describe is the tablet/phone/PC which runs full time, records the data and uploads it to the cloud just as they have already done. You could pick up an Amazon Fire for under a hundred dollars to do this. Do you think they could sell a wifi station for less?
 
Just spitballing this, but an esp8266 talking to an hc-05 or -06 could provide a smart BT/Wifi bridge with just enough code to enable end-user configuration and testing then throw packets at a url. It wouldn't cost more than $10 to the integrator including a 5V wall-wart, and could be sold for multiples of that (thinking about the guy that buys a fleet of Brewometers)...

Cheers!
 
Sorry dude, but this makes little to no sense, especially from a business perspective. The device you describe is the tablet/phone/PC which runs full time, records the data and uploads it to the cloud just as they have already done. You could pick up an Amazon Fire for under a hundred dollars to do this. Do you think they could sell a wifi station for less?

Yessir I am 100% sure they could. It does not need a screen, so you would just a need like a Raspberry Pi or similar with their software loaded on it and a BT module (I think one comes with it). Essentially it would just sit within range of the Brewometers connected with BT, and log the data. From that they could run a little webserver to display (setup etcetc) the data as well as allow their app to connect to it via the wifi to see the data. As it is fully connected at all times they could easily have it do the logging, graphs, charts, and additional stuff as well as allow an api to work with the system for custom addons or additional data from the raspberry pi. If they really wanted to be cool about it they could also come up with a heat/cool plug and allow you to set what temps you want in the fermentation and it could also do temp control for you. The sky is the limit once you have a piece like this in the fermenter with accurate temps and gravity.

Just off the top of my head this would allow you to:
Set alerts for temps/gravity (spikes, finished fermenting etc)
Full logging
Temp control
Web based so APIs could be made to show your current readings to a signature on forums/webpages
Open APIs to allow you to do addons

I am sure there are a ton of cool things the community could come up with and this could even be sold as a additional add on item, base station or something. I would spend another $75-100 for a great working base station like this that has the ability to handle maybe 4-5 probes at once.
 
Force quitting the app is something that is usually only done when an app crashes. You get no warning from the system that you are being closed down, and your memory space is instantly gone so you have no chance to recover anything which may have been lost. It's an exceptional action which you shouldn't be invoking unless an app crashes, the thing you are supposed to do is press the home button, as there is absolutely no reason to do anything else if you just want the app to go away

Running apps that you aren't using still consume battery.
I regularly close out apps on my iPhone.
Weather apps, Facebook, Maps and other location apps...these suck down the juice.
 
@BobOki: great idea and yes very buildable. However, there is no way they could develop, build, and sell one for $75-100 (and be profitable, anyway).

I do see the community making something like this as a DIY however.
 
Used the Brewometer for the first time yesterday for a Vienna Lager. Dropped it in the fermentor and within 5 minutes it had settled in to exactly match the hydrometer and refractometer readings I had taken.

Temp settled in and exactly matched my Fermostat reading (probe secured to the side and covered with a rag).

This morning the SG had dropped 3 points and the temp was still reading exactly what my Fermostat said.

Looking forward to knowing exactly when to do my D Rest without having to take a sample.

So far, I'm impressed.
 
@BobOki: great idea and yes very buildable. However, there is no way they could develop, build, and sell one for $75-100 (and be profitable, anyway).

I do see the community making something like this as a DIY however.

Oh no doubt on the price, I would pay premium to help them dev, but would want a little something extra for doing so, like some premium option.

Otherwise I would dev something on this myself, but I got zero exp in this type of dev work, and honestly got out of programming a decade ago. Freaking love this product so far though.
 
Ok just got mine today and have to admit I was sceptical about needing to using a phone or tablet to upload and log continually but I have to say I'm loving it so far. Good thing I held on to my old phone. My son is not to happy loosing out on a toy but in a few days he will forget about it.

Question on the cloud will this log all data from every beer I do as long as I change the name or am I going to have to create a new file every time?
 
Hey everyone, I got mine today and I'm floating it in water now. I created a google site to publish my data. Here is the link. Check it out: https://sites.google.com/site/alsorangebrewometer/

first thoughts... I have multiple android devices around so I can see the value of using an old phone to publish the data. If I didn't, I'd simply enter the data into the spreadhseet each time I used the app to measure.. But an extra device makes all the difference with this thing.

Also, configuring the cloud was simple (Thanks Google!). Although it will take some tinkering to set it up and then discipline to 'leave the damn thing alone and let it do it's thing!' However, I need to monkey around in the spreadsheet and change variables like date and time - and even added a couple new charts.

I like the guages chart because I can configure them to tell me when I've hit my gravity and monitor temps - just like on the line-chart, but just more neat-o.

I think I need to calibrate. I am getting 1.001 on my tap water gravity - which is okay since I didnt' try distilled water yet. And I think it's about 1.5 degrees off from what both my thermomoters say (analog and digital). But, I think calibrating is simple in the app...

Other than that, it does what it says that it will.

check out the link: https://sites.google.com/site/alsorangebrewometer/

Any feedback???!! chart ideas?? By the way, the content text I added to the googel site is for my layman family and friends... Help me clarify anything that isn't correct or doesn't read well. :)
 
Use a spare raspberry pi like me. It's not good for much else I wanted to do with it anymore anyhow.

I just got in my HM10 Bluetooth module as well. Going to be hooking it up to a esp8266 module to run the fermentation chamber and report all the statistics from the brewometer with it. Funny I see that idea was thrown out just above.
 
[...]I just got in my HM10 Bluetooth module as well. Going to be hooking it up to a esp8266 module to run the fermentation chamber and report all the statistics from the brewometer with it. Funny I see that idea was thrown out just above.

It's a bit of a challenge to keep up with all the widgets out there, but I do my best ;)

Seriously, though, an esp8266 has enough on-board code space to support rudimentary web pages for configuration purposes and perform modest mission stuff (like, push packets to a url). Wired to a serial/BT bridge and you have a really cheap solution - even at one-off prices.

The HM-10 is a lower power solution vs HC-05/06 but as it's going to be powered by a line cord one way or the other paying a premium for the LE capability would be questionable for an integrator...

Cheers!
 
Just got mine today and threw it in my almost-done saison. In the last 6 hours it has fluctuated about 2F and .003 SG (1.009-1.012). I attempted to calibrate it in tap water with my hydrometer and thermapen but it was only a half degree off in temp and about .001 off in SG so i didnt mess with it. We will see how it does as fermentation wraps up (est FG is 1.005), and how its final reading compares to the hydrometer. Cheers!

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Good thing I held on to my old phone. My son is not to happy loosing out on a toy but in a few days he will forget about it.

Question on the cloud will this log all data from every beer I do as long as I change the name or am I going to have to create a new file every time?

Yeah, I have to say, using old iPhone and Android devices as the receiving units for these things was a pretty brilliant idea. Pretty much everyone I know has one or more of those laying around, and if you don't, you can pick up a used/broken screen one for cheaper than you could likely buy whatever receiving unit they would try to sell themselves for it.

Still though, can't believe you were able to pry an old phone away from your kid! ;)

To answer your question, yes, you can just use the one sheet to track all of your beers. If you've got multiple different color Brewometers, they will all log under their respective color, and as long as you enter a beer name each time you ferment a new beer, they will log under their color + beer name. You can then filter on the first sheet by color or beer, and the data below as well as the chart will auto-update to that.

Hey everyone, I got mine today and I'm floating it in water now. I created a google site to publish my data. Here is the link. Check it out: https://sites.google.com/site/alsorangebrewometer/

I like the guages chart because I can configure them to tell me when I've hit my gravity and monitor temps - just like on the line-chart, but just more neat-o.

Good thinking on the site as well as the gauge chart! I just setup some gauges in my sheet to play around with as well. I might also go the sites route as well. I love that we make everything so easy to setup and play around with at Google. I get a big kick out of seeing people use our technology for stuff like this! :rockin:

One question for you though - how were you planning to track multiple beers going at the same time on your site, as the charts are updated based off your filtering options in the first sheet? I suppose you could just make a copy of the first sheet for each beer you've got going, leave it filtered, and then base the charts off of your copied/filtered sheet?
--------------------

Update on my side... I received my replacement unit and 2nd unit yesterday. The one that is being replaced is still in my fermenting beer, and in addition to the 7 or 8 "freak out" episodes it'd had previously (temp and gravity getting way off from actual measurements - then correcting itself), it's pretty much lost its mind during the cold crash phase. If you take a look at the graph in my sheet you'll notice two valleys and four peaks since I started my cold crash, where the temp has dropped as low as 24F and gone as high as 51F, and none of those events actually happened. Several times when I witnessed this I'd gone out and taken samples, and they were all at 32-34F, when I have my setpoint at 33F, so basically off as much as 19F at some points. Also, when this is going on the gravity gets all out of wack, sometimes as much as 10 points or so.

Still hopeful that I just got a bad unit, as the developers said they'd only had a couple of other reports similar to this, and nothing exactly like what I was experiencing.

I emailed them today to ask about recommended calibration instructions, as the fluctuations I'm seeing would seem to indicate there is some correlation between temp and gravity on the unit. So I'm not sure if we should be using liquid at a certain temp to calibrate the gravity, or if we should calibrate temp first, then gravity, etc. I'll report back if they give me any tips!
 
Its a no go on the group buy. They can't afford to bring down the price for it. We're just waiting to see if they can bulk package them to save on shipping now.

Alright well let me know. If they are able to reduce shipping cost i may still be interested!

Thanks
 
Got mine last night! Never got an e-mail saying it was shipped, etc (just in case anyone is worried). I got an order confirmation about a week after ordering and then the item just showed up! :)

At any rate - it's happily working like a charm. I actually find myself checking gravity obsessively just because I can! LOL

I can see more coming in the future.
 
I emailed them today to ask about recommended calibration instructions, as the fluctuations I'm seeing would seem to indicate there is some correlation between temp and gravity on the unit. So I'm not sure if we should be using liquid at a certain temp to calibrate the gravity, or if we should calibrate temp first, then gravity, etc. I'll report back if they give me any tips!

I suspect something similar: mine had been hovering between 1.011 and 1.014 for about 48 hours. When I hiked up the temp (about 2 F), the gravity also went up, with most readings between 1.015 and 1.018. It now seems to have stabilized between 1.014 and 1.016. It does seem like temperature shifts affects the calculation, somehow. Looking forward to see what it will do when I cold crash..!

That being said, I found it very useful for this first brew: I was able to see (in the graph) two things that were pretty theoretical to me:

- Most of the fermentation happened during the first 72 hours, at 65-66 F. When it seemed to stall or at least slow down (at around 1.020) for about 12 hours, I hiked up the temperature to 67-68, and I the gravity started dropping again within a few hours.

- I regulate the temperature with the probe sticked to the side of the fermenter (insulated). During the active phase of the fermentation, the beer temperature was higher than the probe temp by a good 3 degrees. When the krausen started to fall, the internal tem,p dropped a good 2 degrees, and i had to adjust my ITC-308 accordingly.

For the record, this batch is an IPA with WLP001.
 
Has anyone asked them explicitly if the gravity reading is affected by the temperature? And if so, is that calculation done in the app or in the device itself? If not I will reach out but I don't want to pester them with repeat questions.

I hope to get one soon and plan to hack into the stream as a previous post detailed and then post and display the data on a custom site and to automatically drive fermentation steps. So knowing if the temp affects the calculation for the gravity and where that calculation is happening will be very useful and save me the time of running experiments to reverse engineer it. If it turns out that the freak outs are a regular occurrence I'll have to add logic to look at the values over time and ignore swings that don't make sense but I'm really hoping that those of you with issues are dealing with faulty units.
 
Hey everyone, I got mine today and I'm floating it in water now. I created a google site to publish my data. Here is the link. Check it out: https://sites.google.com/site/alsorangebrewometer/



first thoughts... I have multiple android devices around so I can see the value of using an old phone to publish the data. If I didn't, I'd simply enter the data into the spreadhseet each time I used the app to measure.. But an extra device makes all the difference with this thing.



Also, configuring the cloud was simple (Thanks Google!). Although it will take some tinkering to set it up and then discipline to 'leave the damn thing alone and let it do it's thing!' However, I need to monkey around in the spreadsheet and change variables like date and time - and even added a couple new charts.



I like the guages chart because I can configure them to tell me when I've hit my gravity and monitor temps - just like on the line-chart, but just more neat-o.



I think I need to calibrate. I am getting 1.001 on my tap water gravity - which is okay since I didnt' try distilled water yet. And I think it's about 1.5 degrees off from what both my thermomoters say (analog and digital). But, I think calibrating is simple in the app...



Other than that, it does what it says that it will.



check out the link: https://sites.google.com/site/alsorangebrewometer/



Any feedback???!! chart ideas?? By the way, the content text I added to the googel site is for my layman family and friends... Help me clarify anything that isn't correct or doesn't read well. :)


Nice work!!
 
Oh, one thing I noticed with the sheet this morning is it seems the app is hard coded to log to a sheet named "Sheet1" in your doc. So if you change the name to anything other than "Sheet 1" it will stop logging data. I'm not sure why they hard coded the sheet name in the app, which could obviously be changed, instead of just using the sheet ID, which doesn't change when the name does.

I suppose you could hide the sheet, but the only place you can update the comment field is in that logging sheet (which then carries over to the "Report" tab) and in the app when you log a data point. If you try to add a comment directly to the Report tab, it messes everything up.
 
Has anyone asked them explicitly if the gravity reading is affected by the temperature? And if so, is that calculation done in the app or in the device itself? If not I will reach out but I don't want to pester them with repeat questions.

.
From the brewometer FAQ page.
Q. Does the SG reported by the brewmometer compensate for the current temperature automatically?

A. Due to the polycarbonate housing of the the Brewometer, no correction is needed for 38F to 98F. Temperatures above 98F result in an decrease of SG of about 1 point per 10F. i.e. water at around 160F will read 0.994.
 
Hey everyone, I got mine today and I'm floating it in water now. I created a google site to publish my data. Here is the link. Check it out: https://sites.google.com/site/alsorangebrewometer/

first thoughts... I have multiple android devices around so I can see the value of using an old phone to publish the data. If I didn't, I'd simply enter the data into the spreadhseet each time I used the app to measure.. But an extra device makes all the difference with this thing.

Also, configuring the cloud was simple (Thanks Google!). Although it will take some tinkering to set it up and then discipline to 'leave the damn thing alone and let it do it's thing!' However, I need to monkey around in the spreadsheet and change variables like date and time - and even added a couple new charts.

I like the guages chart because I can configure them to tell me when I've hit my gravity and monitor temps - just like on the line-chart, but just more neat-o.

I think I need to calibrate. I am getting 1.001 on my tap water gravity - which is okay since I didnt' try distilled water yet. And I think it's about 1.5 degrees off from what both my thermomoters say (analog and digital). But, I think calibrating is simple in the app...

Other than that, it does what it says that it will.

check out the link: https://sites.google.com/site/alsorangebrewometer/

Any feedback???!! chart ideas?? By the way, the content text I added to the googel site is for my layman family and friends... Help me clarify anything that isn't correct or doesn't read well. :)

Nice...I am very interested in this gadget after reading this thread and seeing your output.
Your gravity scale is off. I'd expect that 1.1 should be 1.01, 1.2 = 1.02, etc. Actually, being water, I'd expect it to be much closer to 0.
 
It's a bit of a challenge to keep up with all the widgets out there, but I do my best ;)



Seriously, though, an esp8266 has enough on-board code space to support rudimentary web pages for configuration purposes and perform modest mission stuff (like, push packets to a url). Wired to a serial/BT bridge and you have a really cheap solution - even at one-off prices.



The HM-10 is a lower power solution vs HC-05/06 but as it's going to be powered by a line cord one way or the other paying a premium for the LE capability would be questionable for an integrator...



Cheers!


Unfortunately the hm10 I got is a clone of the original and so I need to flash it to get it to support the proper firmware. Might be a while before I can do that so I'll probably use my Python script on my old raspib to intercept the data for the time being.

The hm10 supports BLE which is what is required to receive the brewometer advertisement messages.
Do the other ones support Bluetooth 4? I didn't think they did which is why I ordered it.

Yes the plan is to push data to an Mqtt topic including the other stats from the chamber. It supports basically unlimited temp sensors using the ds18b20 sensors.
I'll detail my setup eventually.
 
fwiw, I found at least one site that claims to have an HC-05 communicating with a BT 4.0 BLE device.
But on balance it does appear the easiest path would be via an HM-10.

I'm going to have to pick one of those up and validate it on one of my BrewPi "minions"...

Cheers!
 
Mine is exactly 2º off, can't wait for the calibration update.

I also have a thing where it will log data for hours on end, then just stop. I'll have to quit the app and re launch for it to pick back up.

Not sure if it's the wifi cutting out in the garage or if it's the brewometer.

Pretty cool though, most of my fermentation was finished in the first 60 hours, went from 1.055 - 1.014 but now it's not logging so I'll have to go manually check where it's at this morning.
 
The updated app showed up on the App Store yesterday... haven't tried the new calibration method yet though as mine is still sitting in a batch of Best Bitter.
 
From the brewometer FAQ page.
Q. Does the SG reported by the brewmometer compensate for the current temperature automatically?

A. Due to the polycarbonate housing of the the Brewometer, no correction is needed for 38F to 98F. Temperatures above 98F result in an decrease of SG of about 1 point per 10F. i.e. water at around 160F will read 0.994.

Hmmm, I'm not sure if I buy that or not. If you look at all the "freak out" occurrences in my tracking graph you'll notice there is a pretty clear correlation between peaks/valleys in the temp and peaks/valleys in the gravity.

So either the temp reading was freaking out, messing up the gravity reading, or the gravity reading was freaking out, messing up the temp.
 
They are related but the software is compensating inside the brewometer.

I think the FAQ is saying that in the normal temp range it's accurate, outside you have to start manually adjusting.
 
I think they are saying that the probe is not actually touching the liquid and given the material in which it is encased/insulated that the temp does not affect the gravity reading in a given range.

I posted my reply as a couple people had wondered if the manufacturer had been asked this specific question.
It seems maybe it has spawned a new set of questions.:tank:
 
I showed the sheet to some home brewers at work, and one of them asked me about having it do a real time ABV calc. I added it to my sheet if you want to take a look, but it's pretty simple, you just use this formula:

=sum(INDIRECT("D"&COUNTA(D: D))-D2)*131.25

Then I added a gauge graph for it as well.

Please note - there should NOT be a space inbetween the : and the D there, but if I type them together, it does this in my formula :D
 
[...]Please note - there should NOT be a space inbetween the : and the D there, but if I type them together, it does this in my formula :D

fwiw, I run into this all the time here, and the sure fire way to get the text across intact is to stick it inside a CODE block...

Code:
=sum(INDIRECT("D"&COUNTA(D:D))-D2)*131.25

Cheers!
 
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