brew-divorce

[Jayman931]

Is there a chance of finding a replacement? I think 1000 bucks is to high....he used it for two years and is only out $250 while 3 people are out $333.00...thats unfair...

The solution that is fair would be have the amount you are paying him equal to the amount of depreciation..there for its all equal...

The 3 of you give him $312.50 each...which equals $937.50 Subtract that from the intial investment and it equals $312.50....all parties equally share the burden and you can remain friends...

Cheers

 

[hoppysailor]

Give him nothing now except maybe some beer. Same goes for anyone else who drops out. If the day comes that the equipment is ever sold, then everyone gets a percentage of the proceeds. Otherwise, I wouldn't want to be the last one remaining in the ownership "group" and be into this $5,000 when I had intended only $1,250. The first one to leave the group sets the precedent for others that might leave. Consider guy #1 just to be taking a break from brewing for a while......

 

[King of Cascade]

Maybe someone already posted this but I’ll say it again. The only fair solution for all partys involved is to sell all the equipment and divide the profits. Maybe the remaining three could repurchase it after but have a plan in place as this may happen again down the road.

 

[TheMan]

I bought out my brew partner because our joint set of equipment just wasn't cutting it. But I felt it was only fair to pay him for what he had put into it when I kept it all. However, this cost far less than your situation, which is why I see it differently.

As others have said, depends why he is leaving. Honestly, if you guys went into this together and didn't discuss a buyout then it kind of sounds like he is being a little douchy to ask for one. I don't see how he could get upset if you guys didn't buy his portion since it wasn't discussed.

However, it's not worth losing a friend if it's just a couple hundred each.

Why is he leaving? We can give you final opinions based on that.

 

[ReverseApacheMaster]

The laws around partnerships is probably a bit too complex for this kind of situation. Pay the guy out a quarter of what the system is worth. If you all cannot afford to pay him out now then pay him in installments. Otherwise, sell the equipment and split the cash four ways.

Think about it like this. If you had to leave the group in the future -- let's say you were moving across the country -- how would you want the other two to treat you? Would you want them to stiff you or cut your piece of ownership? Or would you want to receive a fair portion of the value of what you collectively own?

 

[thegerm]

There's depreciation, plus the value of his time spent with the equipment. Also there's a sort of understood agreement when you go into something like this, that you trust one another enough not to screw over the others. If he wants out of that agreement, I'd say that's tough for him. If you and the other 2 were trying to push him out of your little club, then I'd say you'd owe him something. But if he's totally leaving of his own accord, then that's his choice and his loss.

that's just IMHO. take it for what it's worth.

 

[motobrewer]

Don't you care about why, though? What if he's getting divorced? What if his job is cutting back on his overtime, or his wife just got laid off? What if his kid just broke his arm, and their medical insurance sucks?

It's read hard for me to assume that this guy's being a dick without knowing a thing about the circumstances.

And are you really going to look up the depreciation tables on pro brewery equipment? That's just for tax purposes anyway, it doesn't tell you anything about market value of the equipment. You really want to get that anal about something, when it's going to end up being +/- $50? The guy's already said he's willing to take a haircut ($1,000 versus the $1,250 he put in), do you really want to be THE GUY who "negotiates" down to $827.34?

Get too anal about it, and I guarantee you're going to lose a guy that you DID think of as a friend, at least at one point.

But, if the guy really is being a flake and you aren't that concerned about pissing him off, it's valid to say "there's no buyout, but you still own 25% when you want to start brewing again."

i can't believe I'm gonna say this...

the_bird is rig...


nah i'm not gonna say it

 

[unionrdr]

I would never put myself in that kind of situation to start with. Partnerships simply do not last. I want to own the whole thing,or I'll leave it alone. This is the very reason why I don't get into these situations. I can't afford top dollar buy outs & all that nonsense. Sell it,split the proceeds 4 ways,& everyone buy his own stuff. It'd be different if it belonged to a club or something.

 

[brian2can]

Sell his share

Sent from my iPod touch using HB Talk

Try to bring in another brewer to pay for his share.

 

[MaltnHops]

So if you sell it because one guy drops out, then everybody loses and will be pissed at that guy because they all had to give up a pretty sweet system.

I would lean towards the buyout, but only at 25% of the current market value. Also, he cannot expect his money right away as none of the others were planning on this buyout and cannot be expected to just have the funds on hand for such an occassion.

Lesson here, don't ever go into any partnership with friends or family. It never ends well. I've done it in the past and now I don't speak with multiple family members due to it.

 

[unionrdr]

^^^That's why I made the comments I did. Been down that road since I was a kid. Nevermore...!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[bottlebomber]

I don't think we have enough information/details to really make some of the sweeping statements that have been made... it could be the guy spends most of his free time brewing, doesn't make a lot of money, and his wife has had it up to here and threw in the gauntlet. In that case unless the other 3 off you are broke @sses as well, it would be the friendly thing to do to just pay him out. In theory brewing equipment depreciates, but in actuality it doesn't unless you are planning to sell it. Its not like a car, where everytime you brew the bottoms of the kettles get a little thinner so that you are definitely looking at replacement at some time in the future. Maybe the electronics crap will need to be replaced at some point but basically a brew set up lasts a lifetime.

 

[unionrdr]

I'm curious about what happened myself. Or maybe he's thinking,"why buy the cow when I can get the milk for free"? I know times are tough nowadays,hell,I'm retired. But that also means people will take advantage of a situation if they think they can profit buy it. Bills have to be paid,kids have to be fed. I'll tell you folks something an old friend said to me,some 20 years ago..."If you can think of it,chances are pretty good they did too". 'nuff said.

 

[jrg42]

so the system in question was purchased new 1 year ago for $5K.

Whatever the reason for leaving the brew quartet, It's harsh to ask your buddies for $333 cash each because of your decision (no matter what the reason is). Sure it would be nice if we could all get get cash back from stuff that we have purchased in the past but now no longer use, much less 80% of retail.

I would go $100 tops each and maybe a share of some of the future brews. If you 3 were kicking him out, then he would entitled to his share of the rig, but it's his decision to leave/quit (again, it could be a legit reason like health or new job, but it's still his to make). Hitting your buddies up for a $333 bill out of the blue is not cool.

 

[AdvGroo]

I think the 25% current market value payout was a decent idea... sounds fair. Besides, for a couple hundred a piece to buy him out you can avoid other problems people seem to develop when money is involved. Good luck.

 

[onthekeg]

List it on ebay and see what its worth. You can set the reserve price above 5k and if it only brings 3800 at the end, guess what? The unit is worth that much no matter what you invested into it.
I was in a partnership with my Dad when he retired, and the best way to value items is to sell it at auction. I bought what I thought was worth keeping and the rest hit the highway. He can't say I paid to little or vice versa. Keep it fair and no one can bitch.

 

[ozzy1038]

Partnerships like this rarely work. Especially so if there are no ground rules set beforehand (ideally binding). That being said, if you can afford it, buy him out and keep it between you three. One less person to worry about!

I see no reason for you to sell the whole setup just because one guy wants out. I think that's a foolish idea. Then what do you guys have? Nothing!

 

[wildwest450]

Cut it all in to quarters with a plasma torch, let him sell off his quarter.


_

 

[Irrenarzt]

A similar deal happened with a friend who bought a whitewater raft with a another guy. The one guy demanded a buyout, the other guy tried to lowball him with depreciation and they are no longer friends as a legal battle ensued for the cost of the raft, costing both parties a schit-ton of legal fees far in excess of the cost of the 4400 dollar raft.

Moral of the story? Don't buy into things with partners.

 

[Germelli1]

I love how everyone is saying "You shouldn't have done it in the first place." That is really helpful to the OP!

 

[Irrenarzt]

He'll be fine no matter what happens. Worst case he's out 333 bucks and his friends are as well.

It's not like he's in prison being raped by a 400 pound felon or anything. It could be WAY worse.

 

[stevedasleeve]

Interesting bunch of responses - are you all lawyers by any chance?!

Me I would find it really easy. It's an opportunity to do a nice thing for someone. I'd offer him 1/3 of the original price back.

 

[unionrdr]

I don't think selling it is foolish at all. Who's got that kind of money laying around these days? And staying away from partnerships with friends & family is just common sense to me. You never know what'll happen. The quickest way to turn a friend into an enemy is to live with them.

 

[Bobby_M]

Nice cleanup there.

I think offering up $900 due to depreciation is fair, each remaining partner pays in $100 a month for the next three months. In the mean time, draft up a simple written agreement between the remaining three where if anyone else wants out they can initiate a sell process but as the person who initiates, they have to take a 20% penalty.

You put it on Ebay to establish the fair value and it doesn't mean that the remaining partners can't join together for a new partnership and buy out the third but it will be at fair value. In fact, they can establish the amount they'd be willing to pay up just by setting the reserve to that amount.

 

[TheMan]

ebay? That's no good. What is to stop the guy from bidding to jack up the price so that it appears the thing is worth more than it actually was?

 

[JonK331]

So why is the guy opting out? Seriously, that would make a huge difference to me. If he's in dire straights or moving or something I'd be more likely to help. If he's just being snotty, it's a different story. How often to you guys brew? did the three of you end up brewing without the other guy or does he not have time for it???? More info please.

 

[bottlebomber]

I've heard a couple people say "it sure is a lot of money for you to have to cough up". How hard is it really to produce a few hundred dollars? You guys had to come up with several thousand dollars to buy the equipment. And furthermore... if it had ended up being just the 3 of you and not the 4th fellow from the beginning, would you have purchased downsized equipment? Probably not.

 

[King of Cascade]

I don’t understand why some are bringing up “fair market value” when you need to put it on the market and sell it to get fair market value. Remember, the system is only worth what someone will pay for it. That is why you need to sell it to be fair for all parties.

 

[wildwest450]

I love how everyone is saying "You shouldn't have done it in the first place." That is really helpful to the OP!

I like how this isn't removed for being ot.


_

 

[Pivzavod]

Interesting.... I dont think he should be allowed to be bought out because of future ramifications.

What if somebody else wants out next year? Next thing you know, your 1,250 investment turned into a 2,500 investment. Not what you originally planned.

He needs to take a loss, maybe he can be bought out at a significant price reduction (you can argue depreciation).

Bingo! I was going to say the same thing.

Tell him to find someone to buy him out. He can sell it to whoever he wants for as much as he wants. If he still insists on money you can be a gentleman and offer him 50% the current value of his share. Since you have no prior agreement for exit plans none of you are obligated to do one thing or another. You have a gentleman agreement and a handshake.

If the guy is still being a ****** tell him to GFH

PS. If he is out of the deal dont let him brew on your system again.