Bottling disaster

[Mothman]

Well, what a disappointing end to my first batch of homebrew..

After my first brew went through brew day and fermentation (for 2.5 weeks) very well, bottling tonight was a total flop.

All was going well to start, until I got about half of the beer into the bottling bucket, at which point the siphon started bubbling like crazy, and I lost siphon. Tried several times with the auto-siphon to get it started again, and it just wouldn't go, and I introduced a lot of air bubbles.

Try as I might, I just couldn't get it to siphon, so I eventually committed the cardinal sin of just using the cane (out of the auto siphon) and sucking to start the siphon. I siphoned the first bit into my 5 gallon sanitizer bucket, sticking the end into the solution and sloshing it around, then back to the bottling bucket. Got a bit more siphoned, then the siphon failed again, full of air bubbles, then stopped completely.

In the mean time, I'd had my hands all over the damn siphon hose end that was now in the beer as well, although hopefully my hands were fairly well sanitized, as I'd had them in the starsan a lot, including as I was trying to sanitize the siphon hose after having my dumb old mouth on it.

I think the problem was that I accidentally put the siphon too low in the primary, and it sucked up a bunch of the hop debris, of which there was a ton, and it blocked up the siphoning cane.

In the end I gave up trying to get more into the bottling bucket, leaving behind a little more than a gallon of trub/beer, where I was guessing I might end up leaving behind 0.25-0.5 gallons. Seeing as I only had a little under 3.5 gallons in the primary, that lost gallon hurt.

So I bottled what I had, and that part went pretty smoothly, using a bottling wand on a spigot. The spigot leaked around the washer a bit, but that's OK... overall, the actual bottling was a breeze.

But... and it's a huge freaking disappointing BUT... I ended up, after being so damn careful for the last 2.5 weeks, with likely a bunch of oxidation potential, potential for infection, and because I had batch primed for a little over 3 gallons of beer but only managed to get about 2.2 gallons, I'm afraid I've badly over-carbonated and will have grenades instead of drinkable beer.


Any suggestions for me?

Specifically:

- re: the carbonation, should I be popping the caps after a week and then recapping, or something, to try to avoid bottle bombs?

- for my next batch, being as it's in a plastic bucket and I can't see the trub layer, how do I do a better job of siphoning without clogging up the works by sucking up debris? Just be more careful and try to keep the siphon just below the surface?

 

[bajaedition]

gave up using those auto siphons years ago . just to many issues
the bubbles probably came from where the hose fits on the tube
I just use a SS racking cane and a tube, has a clip to hold it above the bottom. plus I wrap the plastic fitting with a hops bag.
this is a learning curve you are on.

 

[ChelisHubby]

I use vaseline where the tubing meet the racking cane it stop airleaks .

 

[jerbrew]

I use vaseline where the tubing meet the racking cane it stop airleaks .

That's an interesting way to stop leaks. I like it. Do you do that in addition to clamps or just Vaseline?

 

[jerbrew]

gave up using those auto siphons years ago . just to many issues
the bubbles probably came from where the hose fits on the tube
I just use a SS racking cane and a tube, has a clip to hold it above the bottom. plus I wrap the plastic fitting with a hops bag.
this is a learning curve you are on.

I've used both without incident. I just find I need a proper fitting hose and hose clamp.

However, I now transfer under pressure so sucking in air would be more difficult since it's a forced transfer and not a siphon. I find it easier and more reliable.

 

[Mothman]

I don't know, it was siphoning great for the first while.

It also worked great testing with water both before and after...

I feel like the seal between the tube and the cane was good... I had to heat the union with hot water to assemble and to disassemble afterwards, very tight fit.

It just started to fail very suddenly, which is why I thought it must have gotten all clogged up.

Don't know though, just guessing.

Still feeling broken hearted over how poorly this went, and nervous about the inevitable second batch, wondering how to do better.

 

[jerbrew]

I don't know, it was siphoning great for the first while.

It also worked great testing with water both before and after...

I feel like the seal between the tube and the cane was good... I had to heat the union with hot water to assemble and to disassemble afterwards, very tight fit.

It just started to fail very suddenly, which is why I thought it must have gotten all clogged up.

Don't know though, just guessing.

Still feeling broken hearted over how poorly this went, and nervous about the inevitable second batch, wondering how to do better.

Don't cont it out till you've tried it carbed and appropriately aged. May be fine yet. Live, learn, and brew again.

 

[bajaedition]

mothman
in 30 plus years of brewing I have made every mistake there is to make
relax
it is all good
we learn from our mistakes

Is there a local home brew club in the area? brewing with an experienced brewer will do you wonders

 

[Mothman]

Yes, I will definitely hold onto hope.

For a moment during the disastrous bottling, I contemplated the though of "F-it, dump it all and try again another day", but then gave my head a shake.

I am definitely worried about the over-carb though....

I used Brewers Friend Carb calculator, aiming for 2.2 volumes with 3.2 gallons, but only ended up with about 2.2 gallons , which I think will give me about 2.8 volumes.

For sure that is more than I want for a English brown ale, but I'm more concerned for bottle integrity... will reused commercial craft beer bottles stand up to carbonation approaching 3 volumes? Anything I should be doing to address the overcarb?

Bottles are currently at room temperature inside a rubbermaid bin with the lid on.

 

[rodwha]

Were it me I'd give them no more than 2 weeks to condition. If it's aerated it will begin to get an odd off flavor (I've had what I believe to be aeration issues that became noticeable after about 5 weeks, but the aerating was at the beginning and just a bit). Drink up and don't let 'em sit long.

I put a clamp on my hose and learned to start my siphon better, but that doesn't sound like the issue you had.

I have opaque plastic fermentors from MoreBeer so I can see the end and where the trub layer is.

 

[Mothman]

mothman


Is there a local home brew club in the area? brewing with an experienced brewer will do you wonders

Not that I'm aware of.

I did the actual brewday with an experienced friend, and that went off without a hitch, as did fermentation.

I never would have guessed that the simple process of transferring from primary to bottling bucket would cause me grief.

 

[bajaedition]

do not know what you are using as a fermentor, I have used all kinds of things
gave up on glass carboys because of the cleaning issues and that they can be fragile, plus no handles unless you put that thing on the neck, looks like a neck buster to me
I used a six gallon bottling bucket for a while so I could use the spigot and not have to start a siphon,
looked at conical s but do not want to invest that kind of money into them
Have been using Spideils now for over 6 years and love them, they have the spigot, you can get a turn tube for it, and they are heavy duty with a wide neck to get inside and clean. I always had issues with that bent carboy brush doing as good as a job I wanted in a carboy.
cleanliness and sanitation need to be easy to attain.

 

[bajaedition]

I never would have guessed that the simple process of transferring from primary to bottling bucket would cause me grief.

it is like sex, everyone thinks they are doing a great job of it till they get a partner.
having someone around the first time and you have advice if you something comes up

 

[Mothman]

I'm using a plastic bucket (Home Depot food grade) as the fermentor. That is a contributor I guess to my mistake, as I can't see what I'm doing with the racking cane in relation to the trub.

But tons of people use buckets and do well, so I just need to figure out the proper technique.

 

[bajaedition]

I'm using a plastic bucket (Home Depot food grade) as the fermentor. That is a contributor I guess to my mistake, as I can't see what I'm doing with the racking cane in relation to the trub.

But tons of people use buckets and do well, so I just need to figure out the proper technique.

Start the siphon. watch what comes out, lift till clear. hold at that level

 

[bajaedition]

check it out
https://www.morebeer.com/products/s...80s7Q3hrLpgRVnTfZ-ayOVDM27AQXY1Cm4aAo2S8P8HAQ

 

[Temptd2]

I second the Speidel fermenter. Best piece of equipment we've bought in four years of small-batch brewing. No siphoning needed.

Here's hoping what you DID bottle will turn out well and not be bottle bombs!

Don't give up! We've poured out several batches, two of which had been bottled, one of which had not but tasted not good enough to bottle. It happens. Learn and then brew again.

 

[Mothman]

I'll live to brew again!

 

[ChelisHubby]

I use vaseline where the tubing meet the racking cane it stop airleaks .

Straight vaseline or keg lube no clamps needed!

 

[homebrewdr]

I used to use a speidel. I moved and left it behind. I miss the speidel. With that in mind, they are overpriced by a large amount. Now I use buckets. Buckets are cheap especially food grade at walmart/homedepot/lowes. Use a foam eliminator if youre close to the top. This thread has gotten off topic.

For your advice, I think you either got a bad autosiphon, or you had something in your brew that kept clogging it. If you want to avoid using your autosiphon, go to the dollar store and get a turkey baster. Sanitize it, lift up your tube, fill baster with beer, then push it into the tube, then use the suction a bit and drop the tube into your bottling bucket. Never use your mouth. Also, be sure you are using gravity to your advantage cause it helps a lot. Practice with sanitizer first.

 

[bajaedition]

Straight vaseline or keg lube no clamps needed!

So Chilli's. You say to just live up the ole cane real good and plop it in the tube?

 

[Jtk78]

I recently had auto siphon issue. Started bubbling and running SSSLLOOOOWWLY. Luckily it was going into the fermenter and already cool, so it wasn't too much of a problem.

I determined my problem was not enough hose off of the auto siphon. I put a longer hose, 5/16 ID that I thought no way is this going on. But I let it soak a few minutes in hot water and got it to go on. Then I doubleasily clamped it. I bottled with it yesterday and didn't get a bubble the entire transfer.

 

[Sadu]

A few things.

It was your first batch. I think pretty much everyone here screwed something up here on their first batch and most got drinkable beer at the end. Screwing stuff up is normal, it doesn't often prove fatal to the beer.

Oxidation. I wanted to see what this tasted like so I grabbed a couple of bottles and shook them like crazy when bottling. Tried the first one at 2 weeks, the second at 4 weeks. Couldn't taste any difference despite doing my utmost to oxidise the beer. My understanding is that oxidised beer won't age well but it should be ok if you drink it quickish - not usually a problem on your first batch.

Autosiphons - Find what works for you. I use a silicone hose and a removable plastic fitting to start the siphon (so my mouth doesn't touch the hose). You can buy fancy crap if you want but a hose is all you need for racking and bottling. The less gear you have, the less to clean.

I'm betting this beer will be ok. Not great, it will take a few more batches for that, but it should be drinkable and you have learned a lot from this that you can apply next time. Brew on.

 

[madscientist451]

it is like sex, everyone thinks they are doing a great job of it till they get a partner.

My morning coffee hasn't kicked in yet.....but how can you have sex without a partner?

 

[dstockwell]

I'm using a plastic bucket (Home Depot food grade) as the fermentor. That is a contributor I guess to my mistake, as I can't see what I'm doing with the racking cane in relation to the trub.

But tons of people use buckets and do well, so I just need to figure out the proper technique.

Install a spigot...

 

[bajaedition]

My morning coffee hasn't kicked in yet.....but how can you have sex without a partner?

No hair on your palms

 

[BGHSmt7]

When I use the siphon, I add some starsan to the back end of the cane to make sure there's a good seal there. Otherwise, I've had bubbles cone from behind the seal. If you're planning ppb using a lubricant, I'd avoid Vaseline. It's not sanitary and we'll destroy some rubbers. I'd use a good grade silicone lubricant.

 

[eric19312]

Did you lose the end piece of your autosiphon? That little black cup that goes at the bottom?

 

[dwinfiel]

- for my next batch, being as it's in a plastic bucket and I can't see the trub layer, how do I do a better job of siphoning without clogging up the works by sucking up debris? Just be more careful and try to keep the siphon just below the surface?

I am still not great at siphoning from primary. I have used both buckets and carboys. If your bucket is white like mine you should be able to shine a bright flashlight through the side of the bucket and be able see under the surface some (while looking from above). The last beer that I racked was a fairly dark brown and I could see below the surface 2-3 inches with the racking cane clipped to the side of the bucket. This probably won't work with a very dark stout though.

I like to use a food grade silicone lubricate between the racking cane and the tube. It creates a better seal, and it also makes it much easier to get the tube back off when you are done.

 

[eric19312]

Also I think oxidation is a bigger deal when kegging and force carbonating. Naturally carbonated beer is apparantly protected by the yeast/refermentation. I think the majority of what you read on the internet about need and techniques for protecting beer from oxygen post fermentation applies mainly to brewers who are force carbonating their beer. I am sure you didn't ruin your batch due to a bit of splashing in the bottling bucket.
Most bottles should have no issue holding 2.8 volumes. Not going to be ideal and you may want to pour them colder than you like for the style and let them warm up and decarbonate in the glass a bit before drinking.

 

[Special Hops]

I have never had consistent success with an autosiphone. I find the best way to start a siphon is to fill your racking cane and tubing with star-san, clamp one end, then dip it in the fermentor, release the clamp and let it rip.

 

[sven945]

I once had a regular siphon give up on me during bottling and I ended up tipping it from my fermenter into my bottling bucket. The beer ended up fine. Perhaps a hint of oxidation in some bottles, but still perfectly drinkable.

Just after that (before buying an autosiphon, which I've found wonderful) I ended up pouring a saison through a funnel into a glass carbouy for adding brett, and four months later it tasted wonderful going into bottles.

I've spoken to someone in my local brewing shop and he suggests that oxidation is much less of a risk than some believe it to be. That's not to say don't be careful to avoid it, just that if something happens it doesn't necessarily mean it should go down the drain.

 

[Mothman]

Thanks all.

To Eric, no I did not lose the cap off the end of the auto siphon.

Re the suggestion to put a spigot in the primary bucket... If it's anything like the spigot I put in the bottling bucket, I don't want to go there... Can't seem to keep if from very slowly leaking around the spigot threads/washers.

 

[Special Hops]

One time I dropped the O-ring form the fermenting bucket (where the bubbler goes into) into the wort. Not having another one. I sprayed my entire arm down with Star-san. then reached down into the the bucket and felt around for the O-ring and got it out. Beer turned out fine.

 

[Cavpilot2000]

I use vaseline where the tubing meet the racking cane it stop airleaks .

Ugh - Vaseline?
You are letting petroleum jelly contact your beer?

Try Keg Lube. It's food-safe and has no flavor or aroma (it's meant for helping seal keg gaskets).

I've had a few auto siphons go bad - the gasket can become deformed or get damaged and won't hold a seal. You can replace the inner cane though (but not the gasket alone, unfortunately).

 

[Mothman]

I don't feel like the siphon is faulty... I tested it before, and again after this fiasco, with water and it seemed to work fine.

I must have used it incorrectly, is the only thing I can figure.

 

[Mothman]

Is there any value in me, say,.popping the caps after a few days and recapping, to reduce the carbonation?

 

[bajaedition]

Actually that is not a good idea . Let them go a week and then refrigerate to slow activity.

 

[rodwha]

I generally brew 5.25 and 5.5 gals and wondered about using bottling buckets prior to using my siphon better. I set it next to a batch of brewed beer and found my trub level would be too high on that one. As trub level varies it would be better to add a spigot.

 

[vgmohag]

I have successfully siphoned 18 batches with an auto siphon to a keg. I push the siphon all the way to the bottom. Some times i'll see a little bit of trub when it first touches the bottom but then it siphons clear until the bucket is almost empty.