Botched sparge?

[lukeziegler]

I brewed my 4th batch yesterday. First All grain. I couldn't quite afford these large brew pots so i scaled a recipe to 3 gallons. I converted a five gallon igloo cooler for a mash tun, and found out (a little to late) that it was far too small for my grain bill. (did a porter at about 7.25 lb grain bill) I eventually got the grain bed to float during my sparge, about 15 minutes in. However i had no room for any standing water on top of the bed. So my questions: any thoughts on what this does to the final product? Is that a huge grain bill for 3 gallons of beer? (i know how to do math...I scaled the recipe accurately)

 

[bethebrew]

What do you mean by "I eventually got the grain bed to float during my sparge"?

 

[lukeziegler]

Well...It took somewhere close to 15 minutes to see water at the rim of my cooler. From what I have read, and i could be wrong, you want something like 1-2 inches of water on top of the grain bed. Correct? and i just didn't' have the room for that in my mash tun. So my sparge water was falling directly onto grain. I am assuming (and, perhaps incorrectly) that the grain bed floats an inch or so off the bottom of the cooler during the sparge?

 

[causeimthesquid]

I'm not sure how you had a problem with a 7.5 lb grain bill. I routinely fit 15lbs of grain into my 5gallon cooler for 6 gal batches without a problem.

As for floating your grain bed, I am not sure what you mean by that. With 7.5lbs of grain and assuming ~4 gallons of strike water in your mash, thats more than 2 qts per pound. Most people I know mash with 1.25 qts per pound.

Either you aren't describing your problem well, or perhaps you are confused on what you are trying to achieve during your sparge.

 

[lukeziegler]

Interesting. Yeah, 7.5 lbs filled my cooler to the top. Absolutely no 'wiggle room.' My strike was 9.45 qt at 168 degrees. No problems mashing. I guess my real question is how significant it is to have that 1-2 inches of water on top of the grain bed while sparging?

 

[lukeziegler]

Perhaps this helps illustrate.

 

[causeimthesquid]

Yeah, that thing looks chock full.

What type of a false bottom are you using, perhaps that is making a lot of deadspace below your grain. Also, who weighed the grain? Are you sure that is 7.5 lbs, and not 7.5 Kg?

Any idea what your efficiency was after sparging like this? That is the only downside I can see from not submerging your entire grainbed.

If it works, I'd leave it - at least until you get a few more all grain batches under your belt.

If it really bothers you, I'd buy a 10 gallon cylindrical igloo cooler. I've seen them at Home Depot for $40; they might be cheaper now at the end of the season (or out of stock entirely).

 

[lukeziegler]

My false bottom is actually just a stainless steel mesh tube. So it really does not create a lot of dead space. I'm hoping the guys at my homebrew store weighed correctly, but who knows. I handed him my phone with the beeersmith app open and he started weighing. I should probably know how to calculate my efficiency, but I don't. I know that I overshot my target OG by .008. I suppose I will make it work until I pick up the 10 gallon. Thanks for your input.

 

[Malty_Dog]

Just going off the "Can I Mash It?" calculator here: http://www.rackers.org/calcs.shtml
you should only need a total of 2.85 gallons (or so) of mash tun space to account for both grain and mash water. What was your ratio of water to grain?

 

[lukeziegler]

My mash was 1.30 qt/lb. So according to the "can i mash it" calculator i should have had plenty of room.

Perhaps mistakes were made weighing out my grains.

 

[Desvio]

The guys at your home brew store weigh out your grain bill for you? Guess I am a little more picky, I select and weigh out all my ingredients and hand my recipe to the cashier. Ever since I started doing it all myself I began to hit all my numbers right.

 

[lukeziegler]

The guys at your home brew store weigh out your grain bill for you? Guess I am a little more picky, I select and weigh out all my ingredients and hand my recipe to the cashier. Ever since I started doing it all myself I began to hit all my numbers right.

yeah they sure did. Like i said, this was my first shot at all grain, so i guess i
know i might be better off weighing them myself next time...

 

[Robusto]

You are definitely full to the brim there… but I don’t see how. I routinely fit 4Lbs of grain into a two gallon cooler for my 1 gallon test batches… I wonder if someone at the shop forgot to change the units back to LB’s from KG’s…

 

[lukeziegler]

You are definitely full to the brim there… but I don’t see how. I routinely fit 4Lbs of grain into a two gallon cooler for my 1 gallon test batches… I wonder if someone at the shop forgot to change the units back to LB’s from KG’s…

AH-HA. good call. that just might be it. I know one of the guys at the shop fairly well...I might have to get on his case about it lol

 

[causeimthesquid]

AH-HA. good call. that just might be it. I know one of the guys at the shop fairly well...I might have to get on his case about it lol

I thought that could explain it at first, but if you only missed your gravity by .008, then your efficiency would have to be pretty bad.

 

[lukeziegler]

I thought that could explain it at first, but if you only missed your gravity by .008, then your efficiency would have to be pretty bad.

Right, which could have been caused by the fact that my strike water was calculated for 7.5 lbs?

 

[lukeziegler]

I figured I would update: Went into my LHBS and, yes, somehow 9 oz was confused with 9lbs. The scale can be a difficult piece of technology to master.

 

[bja]

I figured I would update: Went into my LHBS and, yes, somehow 9 oz was confused with 9lbs. The scale can be a difficult piece of technology to master.

9 oz. of what was confused with 9 lb?

 

[lukeziegler]

9oz of brown malt. So I, with no previous experience of what my grain bill should have looked like, just poured it in. (it was given to me all in one bag) So..lesson learned. Bought some more grains last night. Weighed, milled, and bagged them myself. Round 2 should go much smoother.

 

[bja]

9oz of brown malt. So I, with no previous experience of what my grain bill should have looked like, just poured it in. (it was given to me all in one bag) So..lesson learned. Bought some more grains last night. Weighed, milled, and bagged them myself. Round 2 should go much smoother.

You need to get your money back (+ some) for that first grain bill. Brown malt is considered an adjunct and that batch is going to be undrinkable.

 

[lukeziegler]

You need to get your money back (+ some) for that first grain bill. Brown malt is considered an adjunct and that batch is going to be undrinkable.

Correct. They already refunded me. And last nights was free. We're square.
They're pretty good guys.

Wort didn't taste all that awful. But I'm sure you're right.
Whats it going to do?

I have enough free carboys to see it through...just for curiosity's sake.

 

[bja]

This is the description I found for it:

Use in darker beers such as porters, stouts, and some old style English ales. This grain will impart a roasted, nutty, slightly bitter taste.

You used about 18 times more of this malt than you normally would.

 

[i4ourgot]

I think you should be fine without having that 1-2 in of water on top. I don't think you are going to get to your target SG though but your making beer. Try to get as much water in there as possible though.

 

[lukeziegler]

This is the description I found for it:

Use in darker beers such as porters, stouts, and some old style English ales. This grain will impart a roasted, nutty, slightly bitter taste.

You used about 18 times more of this malt than you normally would.

Yeah, that sounds about right.

Oh well, live and learn.

 

[QuercusMax]

Brown malt is a reasonable ingredient in a porter... even a lot of it, historically speaking. I'd at least let it ferment out and see how you like. It might turn out fantastic.

 

[causeimthesquid]

Brown malt is a reasonable ingredient in a porter... even a lot of it, historically speaking. I'd at least let it ferment out and see how you like. It might turn out fantastic.

Historically, that's all that was used for color. Up until Daniel Wheeler invented a new means of kilning grain (and black patent malt) in 1817, porters derived their color exclusively from brown malt (up to 40% of the mash).

Once brewers could get their hands on black patent, they could use much more pale 2-row, which resulted in a higher efficiency and reduced costs.